What does KB think i should do to this prick?

[SVboy]

And most people choose to drive on the road, and know the risks inherent in doing that. Whats the difference?

You are kidding right? When I ride on the road I am subject to rules and conditions that I should have knowledge of, given I have a licence. I have the safety factor that other drivers should by in large be driving using the same set of rules. Usually, we have licences to indicate our levels of knowledge and experience if not competence .
The track is a whole other world: obviously there are rules, but the speeds and different levels of experience on track make this a much more dangerous and risky environment. Obviouly organisers try to lower risk, but with speed comes a much greater chance of incidents.
Re-read your post-bit bizarre and trolly really wasnt it.

[Katman]

So in a nutshell.....

This was a rider training day, not a raceday or a trackday.

The organisers stipulate no undertaking.

Someone undertakes another rider and causes an accident.

Shouldn't take the insurance company too long to figure out who is liable.

[SVboy]

Well that certainly didn't answer the question.

Sorry, I will try and use short words for you. The rider who may or may not have made the crash happen may have had much more pressing things to deal with at that moment than to worry about a rule that they may or may not have been able to obey given what was happening at the time. What further explanation would you like Sir?

[Katman]

The rider who may or may not have made the crash happen may have had much more pressing things to deal with at that moment than to worry about a rule that they may or may not have been able to obay given what was happening at the time.

Certainly doesn't absolve them of responsibility for the accident though.

Sorry, I will try and use short words for you....What further explanation would you like Sir?

And I'll try using even shorter words for you. The question was - why do the orgainsers stipulate no undertaking?

(And there's no need to call me Sir. I haven't been knighted - yet).

[avgas]

You think that it is acceptable to push others off the track just because you are on one.

What I think is acceptable is irrelevant. I simple assume others are going to try to anyway and don't crash.
Crying over spilt milk afterwards does not change the fact that there were moves that could have been taken to avoid an accident.

Your anticipating what others are going to do, or you crash. Its pretty simple math. Strange thing is that is applies EVERYWHERE.
There are much safer things in the world if you can't anticipate what is going to hit you.

The world is full of arseholes, if you think I am one of the worst ones I highly suggest not riding motorbikes (there are worse than me out there).

[Katman]

What I think is acceptable is irrelevant. I simple assume others are going to try to anyway and don't crash.
Crying over spilt milk afterwards does not change the fact that there were moves that could have been taken to avoid an accident.

Your anticipating what others are going to do, or you crash. Its pretty simple math. Strange thing is that is applies EVERYWHERE.
There are much safer things in the world if you can't anticipate what is going to hit you.

The world is full of arseholes, if you think I am one of the worst ones I highly suggest not riding motorbikes (there are worse than me out there).

Someone hitting you from behind is a little hard to anticipate if you've removed your mirrors.

[Bassmatt]

You are kidding right? When I ride on the road I am subject to rules and conditions that I should have knowledge of, given I have a licence. I have the safety factor that other drivers should by in large be driving using the same set of rules. Why shouldn't you expect this same safety factor on the track? There are rules after all
Usually, we have licences to indicate our levels of knowledge and experience if not competence . On the road? You pass a couple of piss weak tests and get your licence its got fuck all to do with competence.
The track is a whole other world: obviously there are rules, but the speeds and different levels of experience on track, make this a much more dangerous and risky environment.
Isn't that why they have different groups when on track? for the differing levels of experience and speed? So a bit of a fail on that one mate, I think you would have a larger spread of experience levels on the road. How many bikers of 25 years experience (for example) are gonna go in the noob group on track? As soon as I go out my drive I'm going to be mixing with inexperienced drivers.
Obviouly organisers try to lower risk, but with speed comes a much greater chance of incidents.
Re-read your post-bit bizarre and trolly really wasnt it. No

The rules were broken, so the breaker of the rule is in the wrong, why is that so difficult for you to accept?
If there were no rules on the track then I would agree with your argument.

[SVboy]

So in a nutshell.....

This was a rider training day, not a raceday or a trackday.

The organisers stipulate no undertaking.

Someone undertakes another rider and causes an accident.

Shouldn't take the insurance company too long to figure out who is liable.

In another nutshell

Rider goes to trackday
Is involved in an unfortunate incident
Cannot move on without finding someone else to blame

As to the undertaking-we only have Dead tunas Perception of events....who is to say dead tuna had not just completed a[legal] overtake
on the straight just prior to the corner and enters with a lot more speed than they are comfortable with. They leap on the trusty back brake, slowing them[causing the rider they overtook to now undertake them] and tightening their line, into the other rider......

[Katman]

In another nutshell

Rider goes to trackday
Is involved in an unfortunate incident
Cannot move on without finding someone else to blame

As to the undertaking-we only have Dead tunas Perception of events....who is to say dead tuna had not just completed a[legal] overtake
on the straight just prior to the corner and enters with a lot more speed than they are comfortable with. They leap on the trusty back brake, slowing them[causing the rider they overtook to now undertake them] and tightening their line, into the other rider......

You're not very good at answering questions, are you?

[SVboy]

The rules were broken, so the breaker of the rule is in the wrong, why is that so difficult for you to accept?
If there were no rules on the track then I would agree with your argument.

The KB jury has been very quick to accept dead tunas side of the story without seeing the fabled photos or video "evidence". Yes there must be rules and guidelines on a track for obvious safety reasons but I think its wrong to castigate a rider based on the biased perception of events.

[Katman]

The KB jury has been very quick to accept dead tunas side of the story without seeing the fabled photos or video "evidence". Yes there must be rules and guidelines on a track for obvious safety reasons but I think its wrong to castigate a rider based on the biased perception of events.

Go back and check out post #109.

[D3ADLYTuna]

Ok, this is fun to read now.
Let me point out a few things... Just to clarify.
There are photos in the thread showing the guy at fault. The photographer will confirm my version of events along with the 10+ other people on that corner at the time.
The other rider admitted fault to me directly after the crash while I was being tended by ambulance staff.
I had not overtaken anybody, It happened on ford crest. I was following the racing line shown to me, and I have checked it against top superbike racers in NZ and it is the same/ correct line for
my position on the track and corner entry/speed.
I was not going slow, in fact I was passing several people in the group.

I was accelerating through the corner and was about to apex when hit by the other rider.
I don't know why he was out of position, He admitted to me via email that he thought he could undertake me safely in the gap because he falsely misinterpreted the situation and thought I was running out wide when I had not even apex'd yet. He also told me that I was clearly a capable rider as he was behind me for multiple laps.(I can prove this in court if needed)

Of course you have not heard his version, nor his reason for being out of position on the track, nor his reason for trying to undertake me when he knew it was not allowed.

I made the mistake of putting this thread up here, I edited my angry posts, I'm happy to comment now.

Anything else you want to ask or say, go ahead.
I would delete the thread but I cant...

Stop trolling, any one of you would be pissed if the same happened to you. I got insurance. I gave the guy a chance to be decent and pay me what he said he would. Its his problem now, not mine. No hard feelings from me. That's life.
Make a stupid decision, live with the consequences. He can live with his,
This thread is clearly mine

[SVboy]

You're not very good at answering questions, are you?

If the question is "should the undertaking rider take reponsibility for causing the crash" personally IF he accepts he is to blame then an apology is needed. BUT IMHO-NOT a legal battle with the courts.I personally believe the track is a very different environment to the road and to choose to blanket the track with rules would soon see track days and racing legislated out of existence. However this thread is yet to see any compelling evidence that this was indeed the situation and not the misguided perceptions of the "victim"

[Katman]

If the question is "should the undertaking rider take reponsibility for causing the crash" personally IF he accepts he is to blame then an apology is needed. BUT IMHO-NOT a legal battle with the courts.I personally believe the track is a very different environment to the road and to choose to blanket the track with rules would soon see track days and racing legislated out of existence. However this thread is yet to see any compelling evidence that this was indeed the situation and not the misguided perceptions of the "victim"

That still wasn't the question.

[SVboy]

Better spell it out for me.