A unique problem with SI Buckets

**Muzzab** · 26th June 2012, 13:56

Originally Posted by F5 Dave

Back markers one can cope with. its the super slow bikes that make sickening impact a possibility. I wouldn't rate you as a problem Hels. This isn't about a thread to bash the slower riders, I think its more about the bikes that just can't make the grade (at least that's my take). or perhaps Learners still learning how to change gear, that would be an issue.

The thread started off discussing a new (older) rider who was being passed by a fast rider. The bike he was riding is capable of doing over 120kmph and passed many of the slower bikes (several times) at last years BoB. How do I know? I was on it at the time. The accident could/would have happened if he was on the fastest bike out there. I'm not about to bash slower riders (I'm one of them), just wanted to state where the thread started. I understand where you are coming from regards how quickly the fast guys gain on the slow guys. If I hear them coming I try and stay wide to let them through, but it can get a bit busy if you are trying to pass someone as well.

Cheers
Muzza

**Str8 Jacket** · 26th June 2012, 14:14

Originally Posted by richban

You are put of by people trying to discuss making racing for all involved safer? WTF. Leave your personal issues at the door. This is about making racing safe. Nothing else.

Vests seams to be a hit so far. What rules regarding wearing one should we follow? First 5 races as a beginner? First 3 races when you change from B to A. New riders from out of town in any grade?

Eh?? I am not having a vent, I am just calling it as I interpreted the thread to be about and making comment as to how others and myself read these types of comments on threads.......??

When comments are made as to speed difference and people riding pieces of shit it is easy to make some people feel like maybe they jsut shouldn't be out there. Sorry you took offence.

EDIT - the green rep from people that I have received says that I am not the only person that has read the thread like I did. Guess I was just after a bit more clarification and a bit more open mindedness regarding how these types of comments can come across to people. Again apologies for any offence caused.

**F5 Dave** · 26th June 2012, 14:47

Originally Posted by Str8 Jacket

I guess what I am saying is how things are interpreted.... If a possible Bucket Noob was to read this thread then they may just walk away and go race something else cause a) there is alot less politics and b) at least all the bikes power, set up etc will be similar in a controlled class.

These types of threads and comments are the kind of thing that puts noobs and even some of us not so noobs into entering things like the GP and BoB........

When I said not listening I wasn't talking to you, um, no hold on, that sounded bad

, but I mean I should have quoted Shorty re his jib about 'bikes going too fast now' That was what I was reacting to.

**Str8 Jacket** · 26th June 2012, 14:48

Originally Posted by F5 Dave

When I said not listening I wasn't talking to you, um, no hold on, that sounded bad

, but I mean I should have quoted Shorty re his jib about 'bikes going too fast now' That was what I was reacting to.

Bring out the Jelly Pit!!!!

**Shorty_925** · 26th June 2012, 15:08

Originally Posted by F5 Dave

No. You're not listening (if one can listen to the written word).

The biggest problem at the last BOB was super slow bikes which are almost parked. Throw in a large sweeper & a straight either side & it doesn't matter what you are riding. If you are racing in a group these guys can 'appear' ahead of you virtually motionless. Racing is racing & we know there are risks, but this is scary.

The BOB is a 55 min race. You have to cope with back markers in a way that doesn't show up on sprint races. But this goes beyond that.

Like you said racing is racing. Its up to event organisers enforce the rules. Riders Rep is there to be used as well.

Off topic but this is KB so...: If I had a dollar for every trail ride Ive been on and a slower rider(and really slow riders), were in my way and I have just about hit them(or have hit them) and had to adjust my line, thus almost riding into a tree or off the side of a hill/cliff, Id be rich! Its part of it(off road), the fun & excitment, and no matter how safe you make it, something will always happen.

**ellipsis** · 26th June 2012, 16:02

Originally Posted by Shorty_925

Its up to event organisers to enforce the rules.

....which in the case we are talking of, are?...

**Shorty_925** · 26th June 2012, 16:36

Originally Posted by ellipsis

....which in the case we are talking of, are?...

Depends on the supplymentary regs and what they say. From there 6.4: A Riders Representative shall be elected at or prior to riders briefing to be available to represent the interest of riders to the Steward of the Meeting on questions of safety, or other matters involving the welfare of competitors,
which I think F5 Dave and others have mentioned/mentioning. Prehaps using 6.4 would be the best at whichever event instead of on KB.

**all4A50s** · 26th June 2012, 16:53

Interesting thread. I have just been though this dilemma with my daughter starting buckets in November and the way worked itself out (much thanks to Fish's patience);

When she started (wearing a vest) she was pulled from the track after being allowed to complete the race for being to slow. But by being allowed to complete the race, gave her the confidence to give another go.

The second meet she did a couple of races and then stopped when asked (again wearing a vest), which lead on to her to being mentored by several riders and attending practice days.

Since then she has raced at most meets and throughly enjoys it. She still is one of the slowest on the track and has been given the space/chance to develop into a confident rider (and has knocked 18 secs off her lap times).

What I saw during this time which worked (with her and others);

- Riders being given coaching when necessary, while letting them out when possible.

- Running two grades (as we do in Wgtn) works very well, with the fastest B-graders moving up when their times to help thin out out b-grade and allow riders to continue to improve.

- Wearing vests by new riders for at least three meets.

- Keeping it fun.

- Having handicap races.

The only thing I would like to see added would be the rule of only being allowed to pass a vested rider on the outside when cornering.

**kel** · 26th June 2012, 17:23

Originally Posted by Muzzab

If I hear them coming I try and stay wide to let them through, but it can get a bit busy if you are trying to pass someone as well.

Ah now thats my bugbear, if you're about to get lapped (and the blue flag lets everyone know) then your duel gets put on hold, maybe thats something that can be instilled at the mentoring stage, would certainly reduce the near misses.

**F5 Dave** · 26th June 2012, 17:30

Originally Posted by Str8 Jacket

Bring out the Jelly Pit!!!!

Now we're talking

**F5 Dave** · 26th June 2012, 17:37

Originally Posted by all4A50s

. . .
The only thing I would like to see added would be the rule of only being allowed to pass a vested rider on the outside when cornering.

Sorry dude, lets be honest, this is racing not ballet, or even a track day. While it is fun it is also competition & people want to win or at least race with someone. If someone gets past a backmarker then the following person has to just as quickly or thier competition is ended. Depending where you meet these people will depend which side you go around.

Mentoring & riding practice is great stuff (and I have helped out here a number of times), but lets not lose track of; the core activity here is racing.

**Yow Ling** · 26th June 2012, 17:51

Originally Posted by Shorty_925

Like you said racing is racing. Its up to event organisers enforce the rules. Riders Rep is there to be used as well.

Off topic but this is KB so...: If I had a dollar for every trail ride Ive been on and a slower rider(and really slow riders), were in my way and I have just about hit them(or have hit them) and had to adjust my line, thus almost riding into a tree or off the side of a hill/cliff, Id be rich! Its part of it(off road), the fun & excitment, and no matter how safe you make it, something will always happen.

but were you going 50 or 60 kph faster than them ?

**Kickaha** · 26th June 2012, 17:55

Originally Posted by Str8 Jacket

Threads like these definitely put me off considering coming down to the BoB and bucket racing in general TBH.....

Yes but last time you did the decent thing and crashed out

Originally Posted by F5 Dave

The biggest problem at the last BOB was super slow bikes which are almost parked. Throw in a large sweeper & a straight either side & it doesn't matter what you are riding. If you are racing in a group these guys can 'appear' ahead of you virtually motionless. Racing is racing & we know there are risks, but this is scary.

The BOB is a 55 min race. You have to cope with back markers in a way that doesn't show up on sprint races. But this goes beyond that.

I found them to be no problem at all although not travelling at the pace of the front runners, the vest were visible several corners away so I knew I'd be in amongst them quickly although maybe I had more time to look around