Welfare support and drug testing

[skippa1]

....I reckon you are...

you can reckon whatever you like, Im no angel and have done both of our share of drugs. I dont now but I spent years wasted. I paid for my own and never used tax payer money to pay for it.

[scumdog]

It's much easier than this. Do not pay a benefit at all, into their bank account.

They would receive x amount (but not actually receive any money). Their rent is dealt with automatically, same with essentials like power and water. For food, an account is available at the local supermarket, restricted to non-luxury items (ie, no alcohol, cigarettes etc). The govt should receive good pricing from the supermarket because of the bulk buying and customer base. Accounts could easily be setup for various requirements, but naturally you'd have one supplier per requirement, not every single supplier. Completely possible a small amount is supplied for discretionary reasons, but all the staples are taken care of.

Too many have forgotten that a benefit is to help you get back onto your feet when you experience some hardship. The money comes from those that are working. It is not your right to do whatever you like with that money. If you want choice, earn your own money. In the old days, if you kept sponging off everyone's goodwill without contributing, you'd be run out of town.

Great idea - but no Govt would do that while they depend on so many of their votes from beneficiaries

[mashman]

and so he should. Fucked if I would want some impaired surgeon sticking a knife in me.

The afterglow sounds good, been a few years since had one.

(truth be known, I spent 15 years smoking daily 2-3 times a day and messing with psycadelic chemicals as well. Maybe youre all right and I have just cooked parts of my brain?)

Rather that than a surgeon with the DT's? or indeed I'd rather have a surgeon relaxed enough from the night before after a smoke, then one with a hangover. I wouldn't be too thrilled about on the job though, but then I'd be asleep and wouldn't have a clue, unless I didn't wake up that is... fortunately stoners don't leave their couch

meh... same as most things, you use it or it uses you... and as plenty of people go through that "stage", some never leaving it (lucky feckers... in ways), it may as well be those on the dole?

[CookMySock]

It's all about money. More money in the govts pocket if they force everyone off weed, back onto govt-taxed alcohol, pay fines, govt doesn't pay out on the dole to law(sic) breakers etc.

Watch the situation reverse when when the govt decriminalises.

[ellipsis]

you can reckon whatever you like, Im no angel and have done both of our share of drugs. I dont now but I spent years wasted. I paid for my own and never used tax payer money to pay for it.

...i reckon you are, was an ambiguous statement i threw in as a half lame troll and you snapped at it like a fish at a worm on a hook...like puddytat and BD mentioned, this is likely nothing more than a weak, government curved ball, thrown to the nation to hide other shit they are sneakin behind our backs...and they depend on reactionaries like you to make a big deal of it...obviously it works...and if you are implying that you have done twice as many illicit things as i may have indulged in, then that is very much akin to the 'my cock's bigger than yours' mention you made in a previous post...but probably correct

[Brian d marge]

Unless you are selling , you aint buying on he dole , the odd tinnies here or there ,,,but there isnt a lot of flesh in that dole money ...for a reason

Stephen


I want to talk to Samson smarty pants !

[ducatilover]

Government training funding for Christchurch rebuild is not being spent because apparently there is no demand for trained people yet.


http://catalystrecruit.wordpress.com...ing-a-reality/

Thanks for the linky. I got a pre-trade in carpentry so I can drop a hammer the right way, they need me

[scumdog]

Unless you are selling , you aint buying on he dole , the odd tinnies here or there ,,,but there isnt a lot of flesh in that dole money ...for a reason

Stephen

That's why you steal bro, that's why you steal!

Easy-as...

[skippa1]

Rather that than a surgeon with the DT's? or indeed I'd rather have a surgeon relaxed enough from the night before after a smoke, then one with a hangover. I wouldn't be too thrilled about on the job though, but then I'd be asleep and wouldn't have a clue, unless I didn't wake up that is... fortunately stoners don't leave their couch

meh... same as most things, you use it or it uses you... and as plenty of people go through that "stage", some never leaving it (lucky feckers... in ways), it may as well be those on the dole?

I would rather the cash was in my pocket thanks

[unstuck]

Well I better not apply for a bennie then. I wonder if I should fire myself. And then apply for a PG.

[skippa1]

...i reckon you are, was an ambiguous statement i threw in as a half lame troll and you snapped at it like a fish at a worm on a hook...like puddytat and BD mentioned, this is likely nothing more than a weak, government curved ball, thrown to the nation to hide other shit they are sneakin behind our backs...and they depend on reactionaries like you to make a big deal of it...obviously it works...and if you are implying that you have done twice as many illicit things as i may have indulged in, then that is very much akin to the 'my cock's bigger than yours' mention you made in a previous post...but probably correct

yeah, youre right I did bite, maybe I am a reactionary but I just get fucked off with being financially sodomised by the "help me cause I cant help myself" brigade. When I have been at my lowest, I have got off my arse and done what was required to make ends meet and feed my family and I didnt have luxuries or spend money on drugs or alchohol.....I had to feed my family. If it caused me health problems, personal discomfort, lack of sleep or no free time......I just did it. And to put my hand out and ask for someones elses hard earned was an embarasment. These days, it just seems like an expectation. Why shouldnt I make a noise? Its my hard earned money they are spending.

In regard to the biggest cock thing.....I am proud that I have done well, I feel a little sick to the stomach that I wasted so much time and money when I was younger(I still went to work every day). Maybe I wouldnt have a loan to buy my bike?

[wharekura]

yeah, youre right I did bite, maybe I am a reactionary but I just get fucked off with being financially sodomised by the "help me cause I cant help myself" brigade. When I have been at my lowest, I have got off my arse...

skippa, dont let this get to you. there will always be those that feel they have a right to a free lunch while people like u and i and many others work our asses off - then the pricks have the cheek to blow their smoke into our faces and tell us just to handle it, while there hands are extended for more money.

It was the same when we were teens (like the hippys that went to uni and not leave). on the other hand my boss years ago said we should be like india as the poor work themselves out - i dont know what planet he was on but kids begging for food is bshit. Therefore at the beginning I stated i dont mind giving a handup to those in need.

[sidecar bob]

There is this whole attitude coming through that there is a right to use drugs in NZ.
Theyre fucking illegal, if people hadnt actually noticed, so why should the government currently be funding a bunch of dropkicks that are in breach of the country's law? Chuck them off the bene now.
There are plenty of countries where you would be locked up for a long time, or even shot by firing squad for possesion of a tinnie.
Those of you who disagree didnt read yesterday's Hearald.

[Akzle]

Anxt- what dope does to your brain.

angst*
this morning's english lesson with bob was bought to you by: wake and bake

actually, I agree entirely. There are some luxuries that should be excluded for those getting tax payer funded help. In actual fact, I think that the dole is not high enough to help when you consider that $160/wk isnt going to cover rent let alone food etc. If there were less people abusing the system we could raise the available allowance for the genuine needy.

i can completely understand why people abuse the system: the basic "entitlement" is hardly a living allowance! it sure as shit doesn't help the legitimate "job seekers" when they're worried about anything that might cost an extra 20$, then winz phones them up every month or two and tells them to come in (fuel costs money...)

...what about proactively securing a future for the country instead of justifying the behaviour of leaches?

I wonder, if a stoner arrived at your house every week with his hand out...

stoner's don't actually take tax. the govt does that. you voted for them. stop whining.

I cannot fathom how one can afford drugs in any "reasonable" amount on $160p/w.

oh that's real easy if you have a vagina... just pop a few out! more money! 12million$ comes into northland EVERY WEEK to prop up career breeders.
i say neuter the bitches. if however, you're one with a penis, it's a lot harder,
but that's alright, because not being duffed allows you to run quickly and climb in and out of windows.

They had an earthquke in Christchurch and need between 25-30,000 extra workers. They pay more than the minimum wage which is more than the dole.

no fucking good if your family is not in chch, noone in NZ is offering "fly-in, fly-out" shifts". and i'm not sure if you've noticed... there aren't enough HOUSES in chch for the people displaced by said earthquake.

what are you looking for? and why is a stoner more dangerous than a closet alcoholic.?
what are the drugs you want people tested for?

i am asking because I am curious,
Of the NZ'lers on welfare - how many are abusing the system. really how many? 5 % 10% 50%. Can i have a cost benefit analysis, or is it un-polite to ask?

i'd say quite a lot. certainly most of the females. and many of the males, a story came out a while back about a guy collecting the benne for five identities (at the same address - come on!) which would probably have allowed him to live quite comfortably. where's winz's due diligence???
and then there's the bitch that i heard walking past the WINZ office a while back "i came in and got an extra hundred bucks, spent it all on booze but didn't tell them that (*laughs), told them the washing machine broke" - and guess what, she was probably back for another hundy handout.
(bring in food stamps - no booze, no smokes)

i'd also like to see a cost-benefit, infact i'd like the ministry's (ALL ministries) to have wide open accounting practice. their ledgers should be posted online monthly.

but lest we forget the govt isn't obliged to make a profit (which f*cks their argument for private sector wages) the welfare system is intended to support those in times of need.

I reckon its just another Govt. diversion stategy.....they have no real intent to use this as a way of solving any of the problems its supposed to.
I think people are just going to have to get used to the fact that drugs are here to stay & that acctually nowadays those that imbibe one or the other drug are actually the "norm"....maybe some people just have to accept that that is how society is now.

+1 for diversion, but that's nothing new.

cannabis was bought to NZ in the late 19th century.. not by pot heads, or "stoners", but by NUNS, for medicinal purposes. that's a couple hundred years. in fact it wasn't until early-mid in the 20th that it began being legislated against. (with the subsequent and exponential increase in policy enforcement costs) and that (NZ) was based on the american example (good f*ing deal - puppy dogging america) - whitey used booze, blacks smoked hooch. it was a racially motivated policy to keep the blacks (particularly the jazz scene) at the mercy of the whites.
oddly enough "black" crime was a long yard under "white" crime. but it set the precdent.

...and the state taking money off me that I earned the old fashioned way, and giving it to that person who then spends it doing something illegal and for pure self satisfaction.... I got out of bed for it and I spent the day away from home and my family for it. I would like to know that the person that was getting it, was being sensible with it, for the benefit of their famiy. Not self satisfaction.

everyone else would tell you it's "human nature" so that's your society's answer to self centeredness.
again. food stamps.

but yes. it's the state that takes the $ from you. and it's also the state that, for whatever reason, has legislated against cannabis. (and the enforcement costs - which are also tax $$) if cannabis was legal would you oppose bennys buying it?

quite a few of the current unemployed have worked many many years before the financial crash ruined their business, or the earthquake in CHCH did away with the business. should they be drug tested? they have paid taxes, so they have a right to this service. or what are we paying taxes again? to pay some 100 million on consultants to do away with our national silver?

however I am happy for every governmental worker to be drug tested...would not want to spent my tax money on druggie in the beehive and other offices..!

i work with a lot of small/medium sized businesses and the bleeding has not stopped. people don't spend, as their wages hardly keep up with living costs, they are afraid they might not be able to serve their mortgage etc, so they don't spend. As a consequence businesses especially small ones are closing.....whohoooo a new crop of welfare dependent cause our government is to busy shoveling shit up the hill instead of creating jobs...

but hey, lets spend tax money on drug testing mom and pop unemployed cause they might smoke a joint....fucked up priorities really

+10, all over your face buddy.

Legalise it and encourage them to be growers and they'll become productive members of society, well they'll pay tax...

...So your surgeon friend, a stoned surgeon hmmmmm , with his trace drugs in his system will lose his job,

+1 for out-the-box problem solving. - and it would solve the f*ing problem, and probably others.

there are many documented cases of people maintaining their medical practitioners' certificates well into their 80s etc, without running a practice, to keep their MORPHINE (heroin) habits. (france, i'm thinking of)

i know at least two doctors on a personal basis, one smokes, the other doesn't but does not agree with the current mainstream view of dope. i would have no objection to being operated on by a dope smoker. i would have no objection to having a joint with my surgeon before the op.

Your waffle would carry more weight if so many stoners were not drinkers too...

reverse that, what if drinkers were smokers?

[skippa1]

[QUOTE=Akzle;1130350710]angst*

no fucking good if your family is not in chch, noone in NZ is offering "fly-in, fly-out" shifts". and i'm not sure if you've noticed... there aren't enough HOUSES in chch for the people displaced by said earthquake.

So they could relocate to where the work is......I have done this three times, borrowed the money to do it.

but yes. it's the state that takes the $ from you. and it's also the state that, for whatever reason, has legislated against cannabis. (and the enforcement costs - which are also tax $$) if cannabis was legal would you oppose bennys buying it?

Moot point cause its not? What if we were all millionaires and the roads were paved with hot mix? And.....its the state that wants to test em because they see an issue with benes smoking herbs

i know at least two doctors on a personal basis, one smokes, the other doesn't but does not agree with the current mainstream view of dope. i would have no objection to being operated on by a dope smoker. i would have no objection to having a joint with my surgeon before the op.

Cool, good for you man