Could you have avoided this?

[george formby]

Er...we are not in the UK!(I wasn't referring to the situation in the vid...just NZ road rules & personal safety)
Personally...I ignore "courtesy give ways" and stick to the road code rules...one person telling me they will give way doesn't make it legal...or safe!, as every other road user is only aware of the road rules!...not the guy in front flashing his lights being "polite" and waving me through (I don't rely or trust upon other road users to determine my safety while riding)

Well spotted! And I agree, even in the UK I take a courtesy flash with a pinch of salt. Neverthless, a courtesy flash often works on our confused roads to ease the flow, I sometimes get the finger too, such is life.

[James Deuce]

I reckon at the time that truck moved he was going too fast to make that stick. That's also the bit of real estate the truck is looking to ocupy, a better bet might have been to take an off-road option to the right of the black truck.

Yeah, I thought that too and then remembered what happened the one time I tried that - didn't fall off but did bang the left clip-on into the car's a-pillar because the person turning right freaked when I went down the left-hand side of their vehicle and panic braked to a stop. If they'd kept going I would have been fine.

As you said, that truck takes up a lot of space and the bike would've ended up in the ditch or hedge on the right cos the truck driver could almost be guaranteed to stop.

[BigAl]

In fact, you and Bigal are just about the only ones in this thread too lazy to consider how the situation could have turned out differently.

Mmmmm, 8+14(current poll counts) imply contrary, Steve.

In hindsight there may be ways to have avoided this situation, I say 'no' to the avoidance question because; I would have definitely slowed, saw 2 trucks stopped apparently giving way, then just entering the intersection the bastard turns in front.

Maybe with good reflexes and covering the front brake one might have been able to stop in time but shit it happened fast.

On another matter, want to go hunting sometime?

[Katman]

Mmmmm, 8+14(current poll counts) imply contrary, Steve.

Well actually Al, I'm going to consider those 14 who answered with 'probably not' as at least giving the situation some degree of thought.

There's probably not much hope for the 8 who answered 'no'.

[Ocean1]

Some inspiration for any riders reading this thread questioning how they would react.

Counter steering / swerve

This can be refined to make the turn(s) faster, sensible thing to practice IMHO. On most bikes I reckon you can move left or right at least 3 mtrs for every 10 mtrs traveled forward at about 50 kmh. No doubt further with practice.

Not starting another debate but this could be useful for fledgling riders.

I've got a couple of problems with that.

First, countersteering isn't counter-intuitive like the dude says, most of us did it the very first time we slung a leg over a bike of any sort.

Second. It can't be refined. Given a particular speed and a given shove on teh bars the bike will adopt a specific lean which will result in a known turn radius. Nor is this an option, if you want to turn a bike so much you will countersteer accordingly.

Third, while I don't doubt your swerve distance estimates the fact is that in order to get the bike to lean, say left, (so as to turn turn left) you actually steered the bike right, the wheels stepping out a fair bit in order to do it. If you're hoping to miss an on-comming car or truck approaching from the right you've just narrowed the gap by a metre.

It's a bitch, that you've actually got to get closer to danger in order to get away from it, but that's the way it works. It'a also a very good reason to practice emergency braking.

[Madness]

On another matter, want to go hunting sometime?

[george formby]

I've got a couple of problems with that.

First, countersteering isn't counter-intuitive like the dude says, most of us did it the very first time we slung a leg over a bike of any sort.

Second. It can't be refined. Given a particular speed and a given shove on teh bars the bike will adopt a specific lean which will result in a known turn radius. Nor is this an option, if you want to turn a bike so much you will countersteer accordingly.

Third, while I don't doubt your swerve distance estimates the fact is that in order to get the bike to lean, say left, (so as to turn turn left) you actually steered the bike right, the wheels stepping out a fair bit in order to do it. If you're hoping to miss an on-comming car or truck approaching from the right you've just narrowed the gap by a metre.

It's a bitch, that you've actually got to get closer to danger in order to get away from it, but that's the way it works. It'a also a very good reason to practice emergency braking.

That vid is a very good reason to practice all the techniques which save your bacon. The practice we did involved more than counter steering. Weighting the foot rests, head turn hip swivel etc. The practice refines your reaction time & the tightness of the turn, same as braking practice, you load up quicker & brake harder when you practice it
In the vid, IF he was a tad slower & a tad more to the left then swerving COULD have been an option.
Any hoo, it's moot. I only posted that as assistant for riders who may not have had the opportunity to practice it.

[Ocean1]

As you said, that truck takes up a lot of space and the bike would've ended up in the ditch or hedge on the right cos the truck driver could almost be guaranteed to stop.

Still a good option, they tend to be a tad softer than trucks.

But yes, between hyper-focusing on the truck and having less than a second to peruse softer options it's no surprise that in such situations sometimes we make bad choices. Darwin's got a lot to answer for.

[Ocean1]

Any hoo, it's moot. I only posted that as assistant for riders who may not have had the opportunity to practice it.

As did I. It's also instructive to watch how far your front wheel fucks off to the right next time you hang a left.

[haydes55]

I'm not certainly NOT following a couple of low-beam to high-beam flashes with a "wave through"

Because people do exactly what you described to "attract the other drivers attention"...so they can THEN wave them through!(or point out there lights are full beam, or there car is on fire, or an axe wielding maniac is standing on the roof etc etc)

...Its kinda why ambulances and firetrucks and police vehicles flash there lights...it sure in hell is NOT a signal to say "after you hayden"...its a signal to HAVE YOU SEEN ME??

...please don't buy a truck!

My job involves driving daily through traffic all over Waikato, I see people flashing their lights to let someone in several times a day without even moving in side their car. My driveway is behind a cue of cars during rush hour, which I come through every day, the only way I can get home is if someone leaves me a gap. 9 times out of 10 a driver will eventually leave a gap and flick their lights. Maybe one time out of 10 they will actually wave.

Maybe it's a Waikato thing?

[FJRider]

Well actually Al, I'm going to consider those 14 who answered with 'probably not' as at least giving the situation some degree of thought.

There's probably not much hope for the 8 who answered 'no'.

Where is the "I would like to think I could" option ... ??? or should that option replace the "probably" option ... ???

As for that 8 ...

[Katman]

Where is the "I would like to think I could" option ... ??? or should that option replace the "probably" option ... ???

As for that 8 ...

In an uncharacteristic moment of self-doubt I actually answered 'probably'.

I'm extremely heartened by the fact that so many have answered 'yes' though.

[FJRider]

In an uncharacteristic moment of self-doubt I actually answered 'probably'.

I'm extremely heartened by the fact that so many have answered 'yes' though.

Thinking positively is the first step. Acting positively is the bit that takes skill and perserverence ... to remain intact and upright.

[mossy1200]

He had a world of time to turn left.
Sorry but he wasnt up to task or taking enough care.
Its not like a deer jumped out of the woods at him.

[Road kill]

I think I would of avoided that.

The rider saw the truck and seems to have taken no action.

I treat all intersections and all other traffic as a possible,and I always back off just a little and start thinking about those possibles.

This rider looks like he went into it without doing anything at all.

The truckie stopped looking once he felt he was ok.

Passing through intersections while in my own truck I keep doing head checks in very direction until I'm well through,,,this guy was in the wrong job,,probably better off kickin' stones.

Seeing this sort of thing pisses me off more than anything,both on a Professional level and also because it was so avoidable by both parties.