The Hutchinson Effect

[bogan]

Don't waste your breath, Akzle doesn't even have a working knowledge of basic physics. Might as well teach a monkey to talk.

Nail, head; nothing more to see here.

[Laava]

My mate was building an electric car that had an alternator so when it was decelerating it would charge the batteries at an accelerated rate thus making more power than it used.

Also when he put Bitron oil additive in his actual, going, car the revs dropped by 1000rpm at 100kmh.

No amount of discussion would convince him he was wrong. Hilarious.

[superman]

[mashman]

And the world turns and modern science is as arrogant as per usual in regards to what is and isn't possible. Why? Because they read it in a book. Fuckin genius given that planets where discovered in the 16/17 00's. Not that the Maya and other civilisations had found them before. That must have been a fluke too. The walls of Jericho is an interesting story. As are several non mainstream theories, which still stump modern day science, in regards to how the pyramid and other large stone buildings where built back before god was in nappies... but sure, by all means rely on modern science for your daily affirmation. I'm glad there are those out there who don't... who knows, in a thousand years their ideas may become mainstream.

As for creating cheap power devices and making billions. Really? you don't think that the big wheel might have something to say about that sort of ingenuity? How quaint.

[jonbuoy]

And the world turns and modern science is as arrogant as per usual in regards to what is and isn't possible. Why? Because they read it in a book. Fuckin genius given that planets where discovered in the 16/17 00's. Not that the Maya and other civilisations had found them before. That must have been a fluke too. The walls of Jericho is an interesting story. As are several non mainstream theories, which still stump modern day science, in regards to how the pyramid and other large stone buildings where built back before god was in nappies... but sure, by all means rely on modern science for your daily affirmation. I'm glad there are those out there who don't... who knows, in a thousand years their ideas may become mainstream.

As for creating cheap power devices and making billions. Really? you don't think that the big wheel might have something to say about that sort of ingenuity? How quaint.

Riiight - if the US government is hiding those inventions - now might be a good time to bring them out, US is nearly broke and fighting a pointless war. The foil hat brigade are convinced all this technology is being with held, by who? And how many generations are they going to hold this information before profiting from it? Are they waiting for the enemy to discover it first? Are they waiting for their own economy to collapse? If the US had technology for unlimited energy they would love to bring it out (just for themselves and close friends you understand) it would make all that silly black fluid under the deserts of Iran and Iraq completely worthless.

I´m sure one day we will manage to extract energy from matter or room temperature superconductors - chances are it wont be done by a stoned old hippie in his basement playing around with some under table magnets a heathkit transmitter and a radio shack signal generator.

[mashman]

Why would they want to replace oil? It makes them rich. If wind and solar are so bloody good, which they are, then why don't they produce them cheaper so that we can all take advantage? The reasons they give for not employing fantastic technology is cost. Always has been, always will be. "Free" energy will open the corporates up to REAL competition from garden shed inventors. So again, why would they sacrifice their profits for competition? Honestly I'm sceptical as to wether the super efficient technology exists, however I'm less sceptical about people going to any lengths to protect their markey share. In fact I'd go as far as to say that they will kill to protect what they have... or need to take from some person/country etc... @silly black stuff becoming worthless . Just because of free energy? Oh dear lord you gotta be a trollin.

bwaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha haaaaaa. We'll leave the discoveries to patent clerks then eh. Or perhaps to 16 yr old school kids in Germany, the one that noone had been able to solve in 300 years. Or Maybe the Nurse in the UK that did something with her xbox and proteins after 10 years of the best of the best not being able to accomplish it. Seriously sunshine, for your sake I hope you're a trolling or yow is going to need some form of shock therapy to kick that mass of mush in your head into gear. Only the experts can invent/innovate etc...

[jonbuoy]

Why would they want to replace oil? It makes them rich. If wind and solar are so bloody good, which they are, then why don't they produce them cheaper so that we can all take advantage? The reasons they give for not employing fantastic technology is cost. Always has been, always will be. "Free" energy will open the corporates up to REAL competition from garden shed inventors. So again, why would they sacrifice their profits for competition? Honestly I'm sceptical as to wether the super efficient technology exists, however I'm less sceptical about people going to any lengths to protect their markey share. In fact I'd go as far as to say that they will kill to protect what they have... or need to take from some person/country etc... @silly black stuff becoming worthless . Just because of free energy? Oh dear lord you gotta be a trollin.

bwaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha haaaaaa. We'll leave the discoveries to patent clerks then eh. Or perhaps to 16 yr old school kids in Germany, the one that noone had been able to solve in 300 years. Or Maybe the Nurse in the UK that did something with her xbox and proteins after 10 years of the best of the best not being able to accomplish it. Seriously sunshine, for your sake I hope you're a trolling or yow is going to need some form of shock therapy to kick that mass of mush in your head into gear. Only the experts can invent/innovate etc...

Yes oil will be pretty much worthless if we get free unlimted energy, theres very little you cant make or do with unlimited free energy. Recycling old waste dumps even co2 or polutant filtering in the seas and atmosphere. If you cant see how insignificant unlimited free energy and nanotechnology makes oil and coal then you got mash in your head. Who is this "they" you speak of?

Most innovations and inventions happen in high tech labs because they have the recources. Maybe someone will stumble onto the cure for cancer in the Amazon jungle but more than likely it will happen in a lab somewhere. Maybe an amateur scientist will form a mini black hole in his garden shed or start up a cold fusion reactor not likely though is it?

[Phantom Limb]

Not sure who Mashman is arguing with, or if he's just on a ranting binge
If anyone is getting rich from oil, it's not the USA, they're flat broke and just can't admit it to themselves.
You talk about solar and wind generation but fail to realize that neither of these technologies are efficient enough at this stage to provide enough power to offset traditional energy generation methods.

[Brett]

Also when he put Bitron oil additive in his actual, going, car the revs dropped by 1000rpm at 100kmh.

No amount of discussion would convince him he was wrong. Hilarious.

Sounds like a genius to me. Does he understand the concept of gear ratios and revolutions per minute at all??

[Brett]

Why would they want to replace oil? It makes them rich. If wind and solar are so bloody good, which they are, then why don't they produce them cheaper so that we can all take advantage? The reasons they give for not employing fantastic technology is cost. Always has been, always will be. "Free" energy will open the corporates up to REAL competition from garden shed inventors. So again, why would they sacrifice their profits for competition? Honestly I'm sceptical as to wether the super efficient technology exists, however I'm less sceptical about people going to any lengths to protect their markey share. In fact I'd go as far as to say that they will kill to protect what they have... or need to take from some person/country etc... @silly black stuff becoming worthless . Just because of free energy? Oh dear lord you gotta be a trollin.

Lol...do you spend your free time fashioning tin foil hats too?

As for the earlier discussion, creating perpetual motion/free energy needn't be expensive, you only need to prove a principle and you would be able to obtain both support and funding. It hasn't happened because a true solution has not yet been uncovered - just like the water powered car, yes we can separate the hydrogen and water, but the electricity required to do so makes the process no less efficient.

[mashman]

Yes oil will be pretty much worthless if we get free unlimted energy, theres very little you cant make or do with unlimited free energy. Recycling old waste dumps even co2 or polutant filtering in the seas and atmosphere. If you cant see how insignificant unlimited free energy and nanotechnology makes oil and coal then you got mash in your head. Who is this "they" you speak of?

Most innovations and inventions happen in high tech labs because they have the recources. Maybe someone will stumble onto the cure for cancer in the Amazon jungle but more than likely it will happen in a lab somewhere. Maybe an amateur scientist will form a mini black hole in his garden shed or start up a cold fusion reactor not likely though is it?

Because oil isn't used for anything other than generating power? I'm well aware of some of the positives of using unlimited free energy, you'd have to be bananas not to... oh, I see your point there... but that doesn't mean that oil will lose its value or become worthless, especially when you consider the number of people that the industry employs, the amount of $$$ it generates and the likely mininmal costs of unlimited free power generation that would result in a massive loss of employees and profit. I'm desperate to see this tech everywhere. We have it, it is available, but it COSTS TOO MUCH. Epic fuckin fail of gargantuan proportions. It's available but because we can't print some money we can't use it, seriously, someone is taking the piss and that someone is THEY.

Sure the funded "professionals" make breakthroughs, I wasn't arguing that they didn't... merely pointing out that they aren't the only ones by any stretch of the imagination, 'cept yours that is. The guy in the shed is just as likely to form a black hole or create a cold fusion reactor in his yard as the guy in the lab, possibly more so given the right materials. One is bound by his imagination, the other is bound by a chain of command that "directs" what facts of the project receive the most attention. So it's just as likely imho. Just check out the dude who pulled watches and clocks apart to get nuclear material for his kitchen experiment in Sweden. Open yer mind fulla. Also how many minds like that do we lose because they're taught to be a banker? Yet another EPIC fail and waste of minds.

Not sure who Mashman is arguing with, or if he's just on a ranting binge
If anyone is getting rich from oil, it's not the USA, they're flat broke and just can't admit it to themselves.
You talk about solar and wind generation but fail to realize that neither of these technologies are efficient enough at this stage to provide enough power to offset traditional energy generation methods.

Excellent post . If they're so shit, why do they make solar panels and wind generators? Have you seen the wind power generator from China? ONE, will power 750,000 houses... yes that's right, ONE, UNO, or if you would prefer a visual numeric value

Lol...do you spend your free time fashioning tin foil hats too?

As for the earlier discussion, creating perpetual motion/free energy needn't be expensive, you only need to prove a principle and you would be able to obtain both support and funding. It hasn't happened because a true solution has not yet been uncovered - just like the water powered car, yes we can separate the hydrogen and water, but the electricity required to do so makes the process no less efficient.

Nope. I recently found out that following scientific research the it was found that tin foil hats would amplify mind control.

It'll be expensive alright, just not in the way you mean. The actual cost will be unthinkable for some. In all honesty I'd rather we didn't start filling our tanks with water unless we start sucking it from the ocean first. The oil industry wastes enough. It hasn't happened because a sound business model hasn't been created yet. The simpler things become i.e. wind power v's retrieving oil from some location, processing it etc... the less money it will generate as the overheads drop immensely. That's the biggest consideration for "THEM" and "THEM" is those who provide funding etc... or won't, I mean don't.

[Phantom Limb]

Excellent post . If they're so shit, why do they make solar panels and wind generators? Have you seen the wind power generator from China? ONE, will power 750,000 houses... yes that's right, ONE, UNO, or if you would prefer a visual numeric value

Yes they use wind and solar generation around the world, but the cost required to generate power using these methods (the cost to build a shit load of wind generators for example) is a fair bit higher than traditional methods, so they're less efficient. Also you have to take into account wind consistency and down time for repairs (which are fairly often on wind turbines in particular). Then theres the issue of space usage, solar farms and wind turbine fields take up a shit load of room.

What I am trying to explain is that you can't replace power stations with turbines and solar farms and expect to get enough output to run our entire grid. The sums don't balance out, at least not with current technology, but the way things are going this statement will still be true for a while yet.

[mashman]

Yes they use wind and solar generation around the world, but the cost required to generate power using these methods (the cost to build a shit load of wind generators for example) is a fair bit higher than traditional methods, so they're less efficient. Also you have to take into account wind consistency and down time for repairs (which are fairly often on wind turbines in particular). Then theres the issue of space usage, solar farms and wind turbine fields take up a shit load of room.

What I am trying to explain is that you can't replace power stations with turbines and solar farms and expect to get enough output to run our entire grid. The sums don't balance out, at least not with current technology, but the way things are going this statement will still be true for a while yet.

I'm aware of some of those costs, which is one of my reasons for wanting a financially free economy (coz ya get to just build the damn things at no cost other than time and materials), and understand that cost v short term return it just isn't financially worth it. But looking at the longer term gains in terms of environment, sustainability and less reliance on stuff pulled out of the ground, not to mention clean green image (snigger), it's a must and absolutely worth it in my book. I'm sure there are other places you could string "windmills" up, like on top of lampposts, tops of buildings, tops of houses etc... no doubt there could be many other places too, like around the coastline as well as on the hills. We don't necessarily have to have fields of wind turbines using land fit for other purposes. I understand that solar needs the space, but in Germany that hasn't stopped them from lining the roofs of the houses with them. As you say though, that comes at a cost, but every little helps? and there's some bloody good tech out there.

I getcha and I understand that it won't replace the entire grid. However, I don't see that as a good enough reason not to lay the foundations for electricity transport though and take a load off the current coal/diesel/gas etc... power generation. Some areas of NZ are perfect for thermal power generation. That's a permanent source, until it blows up in yer face. these are the things we should be doing, but as you highlight, it's the financial cost v benefits that stops it.

[Phantom Limb]

I'm interested in this subject because my father in law is an energy credit trader. You know, one of those buggers that buys and sells units of energy to keep individual generation sites running at a profit even when the coal is too pricey / dam level is too low / not enough wind / cloudy day. So if theres a viable source of energy production that could potentially supply units for the grid, he's the man to know about it.
The thing is, the NZ power delivery scheme is a seriously complicated beast, every time a new windmill goes up, another land owner pisses and moans about sight / noise polution, like wise every time a pylon goes up you'll get the cancer brigade up in arms (even though power lines + cancer = BS), also whenever a river looks promising for damming, the iwi start rattling their war clubs. So we're left with power lines that are going to run out of capacity in a couple of years, few sites open to decent wind farms and hydro schemes performing below par.

I think the reall future will have to be nuclear. That is unless people 'take one for the team' and allow more turbines and pylons to be erected near by.

[mashman]

I'm interested in this subject because my father in law is an energy credit trader. You know, one of those buggers that buys and sells units of energy to keep individual generation sites running at a profit even when the coal is too pricey / dam level is too low / not enough wind / cloudy day. So if theres a viable source of energy production that could potentially supply units for the grid, he's the man to know about it.
The thing is, the NZ power delivery scheme is a seriously complicated beast, every time a new windmill goes up, another land owner pisses and moans about sight / noise polution, like wise every time a pylon goes up you'll get the cancer brigade up in arms (even though power lines + cancer = BS), also whenever a river looks promising for damming, the iwi start rattling their war clubs. So we're left with power lines that are going to run out of capacity in a couple of years, few sites open to decent wind farms and hydro schemes performing below par.

I think the reall future will have to be nuclear. That is unless people 'take one for the team' and allow more turbines and pylons to be erected near by.

Sounds like an interesting job. Can he do me a deal on free electricity for life .

Shooting themselves in the pocket at the same time eh. Function over form for me. I've got friends who live next to a rail line. We spend the odd night or two up there and after the first 2 or 3 trains ya just don't hear them any more. Stick the wind farms in the water/ocean, doesn't have to be too far from shore, they've done that back in my old home town and it's kinda pretty to sit and watch. There are always alternatives, tis a shame, as you point out, that the eyesore brigade spit the dummy. Honestly, give me the keys to the country and I'll happily tell them to suck it up or fuck the fuck off off.

Thorium/molten salt reactors look damned interesting from all sorts of perspectives. Shame they shat on them back in the day. Although I reckon the future is a mix of wind, solar, thermal, potentially tidal and some form of nuclear. I'll happily have one on the hill by us, right next to the cell phone tower .