Tazers

[Wolf]

Yeah, those were the ones I was thinking of Wolf. I didn't know there was a difference.

Major difference. The LE ones fire barbed prongs which hook the skin or clothes and when activated give a timed zap to incapacitate. The officer can then stand a safe distance from the aggressor and zap him again if he's still aggro when he recovers.

The commercial ones have to be physically held against your attacker for a long time with the button depressed - presumeably while the attacker does his/her level best to stop you from doing this. Massad Ayoob's students only got the full jolt because they had been instructed to endure it. Most said it was not too bad and it certainly did not stop any of them from accurately putting five rounds into a distant target. Please note that these are average citizens, many of them women, attending a self defence firearms course not Special Forces soldiers trained to function with both legs and one arm ripped off.

Basically, if you are capable of holding a commercial taser against a person for four seconds or more against their will, you don't need one - just beat the bastard to a pulp with your fists.

[Al]

I agree, shock the shit out of the bastards who deserve it!

Al

[sAsLEX]

Wheres the option for all front line police can have Glocks as permanent side arms and big MO FO sub machine guns in the boot? That should sort out all those boy racers.

nah what you need is a big maori bloke holding a folding stock 12 gauge making it look like a little toy, kinda like the auto driver in MIB2, now that would be more effective than skinny white boy with glasses holding a little sub machine gun!

[Wolf]

How the fuck did that gay shirt weaing Mr Skid vote on all the options?? He's ruined the poll.

The option boxes are square, meaning you can select multiple answers rather than just one (as with round option "boxes")

[Wolf]

nah what you need is a big maori bloke holding a folding stock 12 gauge making it look like a little toy, kinda like the auto driver in MIB2, now that would be more effective than skinny white boy with glasses holding a little sub machine gun!

Firearms are the great "equalisers" I'm sure the skinny white boy with the glasses (and the asthma, SpeedMedic) with a little SMG would be just as deadly as the big Maori dude with the 12 gauge riot shotgun.

Fark, I'd be worried about an eight-year-old with a pistol - physical prowess and size means very little when it only takes a reasonable aim and 4-6lbs of pressure to screw up someone's day.

Worst thing about an 8-yr-old with a pistol - you kill the little bastard in self defence his family and the media will paint you as the biggest monster since GW Bush.

[scumdog]

nah what you need is a big maori bloke holding a folding stock 12 gauge making it look like a little toy, kinda like the auto driver in MIB2, now that would be more effective than skinny white boy with glasses holding a little sub machine gun!

Nah, safe as houses from the 'big maori bloke holding a folding stock shotgun', I'm mean bloody hell the last 'big maori bloke with a shotgun' that I saw was struggling to hit the flag on the ground!!

I suppose as long as you didn't look like the NZ flag you would be pretty safe from even getting shot at let alone getting hit???

[wendigo]

I don't get it...

Just do what they do in Aussie. A decent-sized handgun, plainly visible.

Much more of a deterrent than a tazer.

All for that. Used to go to Holland. All the cops there wore handguns & Raybans. If you're dumb enough to give a cop wearing a big fuck of gun shit when you can't see his eyes, then you can't be to surprised when you become an example of Darwinian evolution.

As a deterrent, it worked 100%.

[Wolf]

Just do what they do in Aussie. A decent-sized handgun, plainly visible.

Much more of a deterrent than a tazer.

While a prominently displayed pistol would have a deterrent effect on part of the community, other parts of the community would not be terribly deterred by it and may elect to carry weapons of their own in response (a lot are already carrying weapons anyway).

I firmly believe the police should carry a variety of both non-lethal and lethal weapons so they have the ability to make a reasonable response to any given situation.

I do not think it would be ideal that the only defence available to the police was in the form of a lethal weapon, as not all situations warrant a lethal response (drawing a pistol and threatening someone is not an option - a lethal weapon may only be drawn when the situation justifies the use of lethal force)

If the person is right in your face, screaming obscenities and threating to "do you", pepper-spray the bastard into submission; if he's sprinting at you from a distance flailing a baseball bat, the taser should be an effective way of incapacitating him before he gets too close; if he's shooting at you, pull out the Glock (or, better, get the G54 from the boot) and shoot him.

There is no one magic solution to all situations, the best you can do is give the police the options and train them in their use.

[vifferman]

There was an item in the paper today that said the latest law-enforcement weapon is an "electric bullet"; IIRC it was to be fired from a shotgun, and had a range of up to 50m.

[scumdog]

If the person is right in your face, screaming obscenities and threating to "do you", pepper-spray the bastard into submission; if he's sprinting at you from a distance flailing a baseball bat, the taser should be an effective way of incapacitating him before he gets too close; if he's shooting at you, pull out the Glock (or, better, get the G54 from the boot) and shoot him.

There is no one magic solution to all situations, the best you can do is give the police the options and train them in their use.

Don't ask me what would happen if I had the Glock and my mate was elswhere with the Tazer - and the above baseball bat wearer was charging at me and showing real signs he was going to do me in....

And you don't always have time to get anything from the boot, sometimes situations crop up and you do what you have to.

I hope you all realise that not EVERYBODY will have a Tazer on them!! Shit no, we carry enough gear as it is but mainly 'cos the Gov't would be too tight to allow everybody a Tazer.

[Wolf]

Don't ask me what would happen if I had the Glock and my mate was elswhere with the Tazer - and the above baseball bat wearer was charging at me and showing real signs he was going to do me in....

Baseball bat is potentially lethal, go ahead, plug him. Even in the US around 85% of people who are shot do not die (most tend to go down and stay down with the "fight" taken out of them, though)

And you don't always have time to get anything from the boot, sometimes situations crop up and you do what you have to.

Yeah, I realise that.

I hope you all realise that not EVERYBODY will have a Tazer on them!! Shit no, we carry enough gear as it is but mainly 'cos the Gov't would be too tight to allow everybody a Tazer.

Didn't figure they'd be handing them out to everyone - you guys carry more crap on your belts than I do and I look like I've stolen Batman's Utility Belt some days. How bulky are the models they're looking at issuing?

[Sniper]

Ahh Fuck it, they deserve getting tasered. Besides at least in jail they can say they were

[Wolf]

Ahh Fuck it, they deserve getting tasered. Besides at least in jail they can say they were

A bit more "street cred" than just a prison term, eh.

"Oh, yeah? Well I was pepper-sprayed, tasered and fatally shot. So there!"

[Skyryder]

I'd also support them carrying guns on a more regular basis.
We always get this talk about the poor crim/victim,well fuck them they shouldn't be acting like cunts in the first place.
Bloody nuke em'!!!!

That's until you caught in the crossfire.

Skyryder

[Lou Girardin]

After '60 minutes' last night I'm even less convinced our cops should have these things.
The cop overseeing their trial was a veritable font of knowledge.
He didn't know the figures for the number of people pepper sprayed in NZ, he didn't know that our per capita use of the spray is higher than the UK, he didn't know that the per capita rate of shootings by our 'unarmed' Police force is higher than NSW's armed Police.
He had no comment on the fact that nearly all of our shootings have been by GD cops. The Armed Offenders squad has shot few, if any. A pointer to the lack of training GD cops receive.
Then there was overseas footage of people being tazered, not to protect the cops, but to make them comply with orders. Such as a woman being zapped because she wouldn't get out of her car.
Comments made by Tony Bouchier, ex-cop, now a lawyer, were also not very encouraging. Although I certainly disagree with his assertion that the PI shot in Birkdale when he attacked cops with a machete should not have been.
Unless training and supervision of the Police improves immensely, we will have real problems with Tazers being used indiscriminately.