Sticky Tar Day

[Zedder]

You'd think the council / organisation would want a warranty. Please someone in the department have a brain that a job that costs twice as much lasts say, 5 times as long = a bargain?

Highbrook in East Tamaki is a good example of modern roading. It's a feeder between industrial and motorway. When developed it was hot mix, nice and smooth. In time, with the large volumes and their weight some sections broke up. They put in a few terrible patches (bumpy as hell transitions) which actually sped up the break down. Then they removed all the hot mix (including the sections that were fine) and laid chip seal instead, which is so rough the first few times over it I thought my bike had a problem, as it slipped and slithered over the stones. Noisy as well, and the traffic volume has pounded the surface into crap again...

Councils etc do get a warranty/guarantee Gremlin but several factors are in play here. They may have got the traffic volume wrong. Maybe more trucks started using the route than was projected which does happen 'cos word gets around to use a certain road.

The thing is, trucks damage roads to the power of 4 compared to cars. So, a truck weighing 8 tonnes for example works out to 8x8x8x8 in terms of surface damage as opposed to a car. However, although the surface has been getting damaged it has also been compressed which actually will assist in the total compaction to a degree.

Another problem is that NZ still uses a 1950s test for what's called Pavement Performance modeling. This is obviously not good. Unfortunately, as far as I know, a new system was still being developed overseas to take the place of the old one and hasn't been introduced yet.

[ellipsis]

...so we have cheap chinese tar, made in india and good help is hard to find...anything else...

[Ocean1]

When developed it was hot mix, nice and smooth. In time, with the large volumes and their weight some sections broke up. They put in a few terrible patches (bumpy as hell transitions) which actually sped up the break down. Then they removed all the hot mix (including the sections that were fine) and laid chip seal instead,

Was talking to someone in the trade, so to speak couple of months ago. Apparently hot mix for suburban roads = $70/M, chipseal = $12/M.

/lesson.

[unstuck]

Another problem is that NZ still uses a 1950s test for what's called Pavement Performance modeling. This is obviously not good. Unfortunately, as far as I know, a new system was still being developed overseas to take the place of the old one and hasn't been introduced yet.

So not just a clegg test then?

[unstuck]

I think Norway have just come up with a new perfomance test?????

[Zedder]

Was talking to someone in the trade, so to speak couple of months ago. Apparently hot mix for suburban roads = $70/M, chipseal = $12/M.

/lesson.

Of course they'll go for the cheaper option, no surprises there.

[Road kill]

You'd think the council / organisation would want a warranty. Please someone in the department have a brain that a job that costs twice as much lasts say, 5 times as long = a bargain?

Highbrook in East Tamaki is a good example of modern roading. It's a feeder between industrial and motorway. When developed it was hot mix, nice and smooth. In time, with the large volumes and their weight some sections broke up. They put in a few terrible patches (bumpy as hell transitions) which actually sped up the break down. Then they removed all the hot mix (including the sections that were fine) and laid chip seal instead, which is so rough the first few times over it I thought my bike had a problem, as it slipped and slithered over the stones. Noisy as well, and the traffic volume has pounded the surface into crap again...

Ahh yes,High Brook five days a week usually 2-3 times a day.

I come off the motorway in my truck,get onto High Brook and stay in the right lane for the first 500 meters when I should really pull left straight away to let faster traffic past,,but for the road surface being so bad in the left lane it darn near shakes my teeth out when I'm empty.

How olds that road now ?,,six years "I think and it changes every six months and never for the better.

Of course the good thing,,,it could always get worse huh.

[Zedder]

So not just a clegg test then?

No mate, different emphasis. Check out Markov models etc for pavement deterioration if you're interested.

Yep, Nordic countries are quite on to it with roading research and pavement performance models.

[pritch]

I was in Aussie over Xmas, 45C or so, NO melted tar on the roads.

Why the Eff can't Kiwi roads be the same???

Maybe they don't have a totally obsesive thing about the lowest tender. Despite all the noise to the contrary the powers that be don't care too much about safety, unless perhaps it's their own.

There are the three "E"s: engineering, education and enforcement. The first two cost money, the last one rakes it in. So pardon my cynicism, but guess where the emphasis goes in Godzone?

[Zedder]

Maybe they don't have a totally obsesive thing about the lowest tender. Despite all the noise to the contrary the powers that be don't care too much about safety, unless perhaps it's their own.

There are the three "E"s: engineering, education and enforcement. The first two cost money, the last one rakes it in. So pardon my cynicism, but guess where the emphasis goes in Godzone?

Money from enforcement provides funding for roads etc.

[george formby]

You an Inspector or something with all them pips?

And how does the tar get onto them??

Bugger.. Dropped an "e" sorry. It's not the sliding but the splattering that annoys.

[unstuck]

Bugger.. Dropped an "e" sorry. It's not the sliding but the splattering that annoys.

CRC is good for removing tar.

[pritch]

Money from enforcement provides funding for roads etc.

Do you believe in the tooth fairy too?

There is the tax on petrol - excessive and rising - that's supposed to be spent on roading too but if that happens now it would only be coincidental.

[Zedder]

Do you believe in the tooth fairy too?

There is the tax on petrol - excessive and rising - that's supposed to be spent on roading too but if that happens now it would only be coincidental.

Wake up from La La land, $4.5 billion has been spent on NZ's roading infrastructure in the last 3 years. The money for that didn't just fall out of the sky.

[pritch]

Wake up from La La land, $4.5 billion has been spent on NZ's roading infrastructure in the last 3 years. The money for that didn't just fall out of the sky.

One of us may indeed live in la la land but I don't think it's me.

I have no idea how much has been spent on roading infrastructure, but I do know it has been very unevenly distributed. Most of it going on routes in and out of Auckland and Wellington so that traffic there can become even more congested. Presumably billions more will need to be spent in Christchurch repairing earthquake damage.

The major roading projects where I live keep getting postponed, and yer average Kiwi driver being very "average", people continue to die.

It would now be many decades since the tax on petrol was allocated specifically to roading that and I suspect the proceeds from "enforcement" are also now swallowed up by the consolidated fund.