The value of money has dropped by two thirds in 30 years

[Winston001]

who the fuck WANTS a mortgage? Most want to own a property and the way the system is structured the only way to do that is via a mortgage. The mortgage is the down side, the trial of fire so to speak

There are two rational reasons to borrow money. One is to secure a home for your family. Paying rent works for a while but ultimately you need stability and the knowledge your efforts will reward you. It is a long term task.

The other reason to borrow is to earn a living - set up a business or buy one. So I agree that noone wants a mortgage but it does make sense provided the amount isn't too much.

I honestly cannot see how young people can buy Auckland homes at $600,000 but of course they don't. They start at $300,000 which is still a huge sum but not impossible.

Also we need to recognise that 70% of Kiwis live outside Auckland and houses are far less costly elsewhere, resulting in many families owning their homes without huge debt.

Before the recent housing boom, the average house mortgage was repaid in 7.5 years despite being a 20 year term.

[Ocean1]

mate,. I don't blame the tax payer

So who exactly are you blaming? Because it sounds very much like you blame pretty much everyone for a lack of funds to pay beneficiaries as much as you'd like.

so you don't like giving money to people you don't know.

I don't give charity to people I don't know. Because there's no way to know if a stranger needs it or is simply ripping me off.

in that case you should stop paying taxes, because giving it to the government is precisely that.

Love to. Organise that for me would you? Only, it'd allow me to give a shitload more to the people I know who need it.

other than that, ..you seem unhappy, greedy, selfish, and really really just a simply unpleasant character.

Coming from someone who needs no personal knowledge of someone to become convinced they need a handout I'll take that with a grain of salt.

I really really hope that you will never ever in you life need a helping hand, because with you attitude you must be too proud for hand outs and should expect everyone to treat you like you so easily treat others.

I trust those I know to help me if I ever need it, I expect them to supply that help based on what they know of my needs and my history of helping others. There isn't another way of doing it. I've no faith in social services whatsoever, the only times I've ever wanted help from them they've declined to provide it, in spite of a valid need matching the required perameters perfectly.

Like I said, institutionalise charity is simply a waste of resources.

[Ocean1]

In which case...



And it only takes one of the below to totally fuck the budget for more worthy cases.



But they're making an effort even though they're a drain? and a big drain by the looks of things. Sounds vaguely familiar.

Nope, no idea. Rio Tinto are dole bludgers?

[Ocean1]

Before the recent housing boom, the average house mortgage was repaid in 7.5 years despite being a 20 year term.

How many of those were discharged without being replaced with a fresh one on the purchase of a new house?

Lies, damned lies....

[mashman]

Nope, no idea. Rio Tinto are dole bludgers?

. It only takes one of them to totally fuck the budget for more worthy cases i.e. 1 business being "subsidised" by the tax payers and at the cost of allowing other businesses to "fail" across the wider country.

[scumdog]

Do you know why the caller gets 153 quid a week and not the 53 quid the other caller gets?

With the legislation being out in place, IDS is just maiming millions of people, living in a mansion and claiming off of the state... so you're right, they have more similarities than the media credits them with.

Frankly I am surprised Britain has enough tax-payers to support those leeching off the tax-payers tit..

[Ocean1]

. It only takes one of them to totally fuck the budget for more worthy cases i.e. 1 business being "subsidised" by the tax payers and at the cost of allowing other businesses to "fail" across the wider country.

Don't know if they're being subsidised, they're not exactly paying "wholesale" rates but they shouldn't expect to pay the extra the rest of us do for a shonky electricity retail industry. In effect I reckon it's more accurate to say the rest of us are being ripped off.

And then I don't think there's any valid comparison between a commercial agreement involving two parties who are contributing value to the outcome and dole payments, where at least one side isn't. The first will only succeed if both parties gain value commensurate with their outlay, the second can only ever fail.

Otherwise I agree, a lot of large companies have cornered significant slices of their markets in NZ and they often step well over the fair play line when "protecting" their market share. There's bullys and cheats everywhere. But you knew you'd get a rise out of me on monopolies, eh?

[mashman]

Don't know if they're being subsidised, they're not exactly paying "wholesale" rates but they shouldn't expect to pay the extra the rest of us do for a shonky electricity retail industry. In effect I reckon it's more accurate to say the rest of us are being ripped off.

And then I don't think there's any valid comparison between a commercial agreement involving two parties who are contributing value to the outcome and dole payments, where at least one side isn't. The first will only succeed if both parties gain value commensurate with their outlay, the second can only ever fail.

Otherwise I agree, a lot of large companies have cornered significant slices of their markets in NZ and they often step well over the fair play line when "protecting" their market share. There's bullys and cheats everywhere. But you knew you'd get a rise out of me on monopolies, eh?

Probably close to the mark on both counts. Why shouldn't they be expected to pay market rates? Similarly with tradespeople getting discounts for their consistent custom. I understand why and I'm not trying to be harsh, but not everyone pays the same price I paid. Why am I being ripped off in that instance?

Only ideological comparisons... oddly enough them's that I R a developin. That success and failure is based on a flawed system. Why should either have to fail? doh, yup, flawed system.

I wasn't trying to get a rise out of you, but it's interesting to see that point of view and does make sense as it does fit with your value, erm, values. Tis just another one of them reasons that the financial system has to go... as even if we did hit some magical reset button and split the monopoly's it wouldn't take too long for them to rise again to save the day.

[mashman]

Frankly I am surprised Britain has enough tax-payers to support those leeching off the tax-payers tit..

heh... they probably can't afford it, but they don't really have much choice and some people make damned good money over there.

[Ocean1]

Probably close to the mark on both counts. Why shouldn't they be expected to pay market rates? Similarly with tradespeople getting discounts for their consistent custom. I understand why and I'm not trying to be harsh, but not everyone pays the same price I paid. Why am I being ripped off in that instance?

Who's to say they're not paying market rates? I think you're being ripped off because power prices have trebbled in the last 20 years, and the only thing that's changed is the institution of a hash-up of retailers. Before you essentially paid the manufacturer, now there's at least two more mark-ups that didn't need to be there before. A lesson in the difference between "market" costs and cost of supply.

[mashman]

Who's to say they're not paying market rates? I think you're being ripped off because power prices have trebbled in the last 20 years, and the only thing that's changed is the institution of a hash-up of retailers. Before you essentially paid the manufacturer, now there's at least two more mark-ups that didn't need to be there before. A lesson in the difference between "market" costs and cost of supply.

The article posted by Stephen alludes to them having "bullied" their way to a deal that had them paying less than market rates. Ach I'm being ripped off by everyone. I'm used to it, not overly happy with it, but used to it. I guess middle men appear once outsourcing becomes the norm. "Specialists" providing their industry contacts and facilitating commerce. It all adds to the cost though eh.

[Brian d marge]

Who's to say they're not paying market rates? I think you're being ripped off because power prices have trebbled in the last 20 years, and the only thing that's changed is the institution of a hash-up of retailers. Before you essentially paid the manufacturer, now there's at least two more mark-ups that didn't need to be there before. A lesson in the difference between "market" costs and cost of supply.

I posted this before , but under the old electricity board the prices would have gone up something like 14 odd percent , under the new system the have gone up something like 400%

If I have a chance today i will nail the source down

Stephen

[Winston001]

How many of those were discharged without being replaced with a fresh one on the purchase of a new house?

Lies, damned lies....

Yeah that is the right question to ask.

However so far as I can tell 45% of NZ home owners have no mortgage - Statistics Department.

It looks (Google) like 33% of American have no mortgage either.

[Ocean1]

Yeah that is the right question to ask.

However so far as I can tell 45% of NZ home owners have no mortgage - Statistics Department.

It looks (Google) like 33% of American have no mortgage either.

Surprisingly high. Encouraging, though.

Maybe less surprising when you consider the age and size of the boomer wavefront.

[Brian d marge]

Dont worry all is well
?
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...assed-into-law


Ocean1 , who deserve it ..... do you really want me to answer that throwaway line , try people who have mental issues, or parents who have responsibilities at home

Stephen