Dobbed in weed-growing parents

[FJRider]

I would certainly expect there to be conditions.

There's restrictions and conditions for the sale of tobacco and alcohol also.

I'm thinking more along the lines that ... the hue and cry over the WINZ proposal to drug test their "clients" .. will be a drop in the bucket .. with any new imposed legislation ... (should it ever get introduced)

[mashman]

Done any research into the wealth of the Vatican lately? Eye opening!

The trials you should be looking for are those that research the effects on the person through smoking it, such as the driving one we looked at earlier

Even if they had a few trillion $ they couldn't eradicate poverty forever.

What about those who smoke it to a level where the effects are negligible i.e. they're used to that dosage... similar to say, someone on Tramadol getting used to the effects.

[Katman]

Along with the links you posted should be comparisons of effectiveness and cost by comparison with other drugs.

I just did what you suggested Ed. I typed 'clinical trials of cannabis' into Google.

Don't blame me if they're not the results you were hoping for.

[Edbear]

Even if they had a few trillion $ they couldn't eradicate poverty forever.

Obviously not, that would only work if every nation was fair and equitable and crared about their fellow man. Much like the financial system of the ancient Israelites. It was an interesting history lesson on finance that worked well. Too much greed and avarice today for that though I fear.

What about those who smoke it to a level where the effects are negligible i.e. they're used to that dosage... similar to say, someone on Tramadol getting used to the effects.

Not sure your point, as the issue is about decriminalising it, not who and how many are affected in what way.

To use Tramadol as an example is not correct, as for some it may be lethal or at least have severe side effects, as my own daughter can testify. All drugs affect different people in a dfferent way, so the fact that I tolerate it without any noticable or measurable effects is great. I don't with many other drugs, and as I said before, I choose my medication under the guidance of my Docs. If they say don't drive on this stuff, I don't.

How many users are going to consult their Doctor or a specialist to ascertain how much affected they are and whether they are safe to drive? And then be willing to stop using it if the results don't go their way? Any here..?

[Edbear]

I just did what you suggested Ed. I typed 'clinical trials of cannabis' into Google.

Don't blame me if they're not the results you were hoping for.

They were intersting! My point was you need to be bright enough to find what you are looking for as it relates to the discussion.

Maybe that is too much for some here?

I am making way too many typos, I'm off to bed to snuggle up to my non-tattood, straight, affectionate and physically attractive wife...

[Madness]

10 pages today. Fuck Ed, you need to get a life mate. If you know what I mean.

[mashman]

Not sure your point, as the issue is about decriminalising it, not who and how many are affected in what way.

To use Tramadol as an example is not correct, as for some it may be lethal or at least have severe side effects, as my own daughter can testify. All drugs affect different people in a dfferent way, so the fact that I tolerate it without any noticable or measurable effects is great. I don't with many other drugs, and as I said before, I choose my medication under the guidance of my Docs. If they say don't drive on this stuff, I don't.

How many users are going to consult their Doctor or a specialist to ascertain how much affected they are and whether they are safe to drive? And then be willing to stop using it if the results don't go their way? Any here..?

So me quoting you saying: "The trials you should be looking for are those that research the effects on the person through smoking it, such as the driving one we looked at earlier." How did you interpret your statement... given that you say to research the affects on a person i.e. how they are affected by smoking.

In regards to Tramadol and how many users would consult their doctor. I consulted my Dr and she seemed to think that driving wouldn't be an issue. If I had the choice between a joint as I role them and a couple of Tramadol, giving them both an hour ad then having to get into a car, then I'd take the joint irrespective of my Dr's advice. I know how the drugs affect me.

[scissorhands]

Another topic that seems to be worth discussing, is could it replace booze and reduce the social impacts and cost that way?

For many peps it has. I would hazard a guess that at least 60% of stoners I met thru the cannabis club scene no longer consume alcohol.
I was one of the very few who did, but presently only average 2-3 beers a week due to a head knock, 16 months ago

[scissorhands]

Trailer for an upcoming feature length doco made by a film maker buddy of mine.

He interviewed many authorities, including the UK police minister who came out in support of legalisation, and was then sacked, about 3 years ago

He also made the Inside NZ doco that aired twice in the last year

[bogan]

See Maha, I told you rational discussion was beyond him.

Since you are by your own admission unwilling to do any relevant research yourself anyway, you do not inspire me to humour you. At least katman, while he seeks to oppose me, will come up with his own links found by himself.

You need to back your points Ed, that is how research works.

Citation has several important purposes: to uphold intellectual honesty (or avoiding plagiarism),[1] to attribute prior or unoriginal work and ideas to the correct sources, to allow the reader to determine independently whether the referenced material supports the author's argument in the claimed way, and to help the reader gauge the strength and validity of the material the author has used

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Referencing

Your attempts at misdirection are completely transparent, as useful as pictures of hats or tattooed beauties, but with none of the visual appeal.

[Akzle]

...a train wreck you just can't take your eyes off, but with more boobies.

but we do like boobies.

I personally don't think it will help or lower costs

I do not consider that Cannabis is harmless

There are too many actual clinical trials to the contrary,

Most "man made drugs" are from the natural flora of the Earth.

The synthesising of drugs is an effort to keep up with demand and lower the considerable cost of the most needed or required drugs, so that as many as possible can benefit. Who, apart from the "drug companies", has the money to find and develop drugs?

pharmeceutical companies.... benefit people?! you're off your fucking trolley. they are interested in production and addiction because that's profitable and guaranteed repeat business.

the four points abve could do with some kind of... fact. as i disagree, and "you don't think" doesn't actually translate into "it will happen if legislation is changed"

i would say that most pharmaceuticals are not based on natural products, nor even synthesised/ concentrated forms of the actives.

The cost thing depends a lot on how it is implemented and policed, which I haven't seen what the current popular suggestions are, anyone?

Another topic that seems to be worth discussing, is could it replace booze and reduce the social impacts and cost that way?

i started a thread some moons ago, for the cost of one drug raid they could have kept a school in chch open and paid 3 or four teachers.
aswell, their reported "street values" are always grossly overstated. some brown kid in rotaz had "a few plants in his shed" that "had a street value of millions" doing the maths on their figuires, his shed would have to have been about 400m^2 and him pulling a pound off every plant.

in terms of "cost-benefit", enfrcing cannabis policy fails.
the only argument from the other side was that a lot of criminals have/use dope, so it's a convinient "kick me" sign and a fairly guaranteed conviction, even if the cops can't prove they burgled/stolen/hijacked/stabbed/DUI whatever.

personally, when i smoke dope on a regular (daily) basis, i smoke less tobacco and drink less booze.

and i'm clearly a well adjusted motherfucker...

The trials you should be looking for are those that research the effects on the person through smoking it, such as the driving one we looked at earlier.

Along with the links you posted should be comparisons of effectiveness and cost by comparison with other drugs.

okay ed, i'll bring a bag of weed, you pop a few slamadols and we'll take that little car for a skid eh? see who's better at it...
i'm sure we can get a KB volunteer for acid, eccy, beer, bourbon tests.... (i'll do the eccy one, if someone shouts the pills)

[Banditbandit]

Ewww, lets not

yes - that was a strange path ...

How about ...

[Banditbandit]

92 pages of crap people - don't you think that's somewhat over the top? Even for Kiwi Biker ??? This is never going to be resolved ... just let it go ..

[Katman]

I have said I was addicted to prescription painkillers, namely DHC, and it ruined my life.

So let me get this straight. You had an addiction to a previous prescription drug but claim to not be addicted to your current drug of choice?

If someone came on here and said "I used to be a smack addict but I kicked that habit and only use Cocaine now and I'm not addicted to that" you'd be the first to cry "bullshit!".

[blue rider]

hahahahahahahahaha



blah blah blah

and i'm clearly a well adjusted motherfucker...



yes you are dear....but I can't bling you for that comment....hahahahahahahahaha