Have the police stitched up an innocent man again?

[Banditbandit]

He yelled "surprise" fuck ya. So it wasn't rape!

Who did ??? Are you taklking about Teina Pora or Malcolm Rewa ..

Teina Pora is not doing time for rape ...

[Swoop]

See .. that's the problem right there ... Teina Pora is locked up for a crime he did not commit .. he did not harm anyone ... he is innocent ... why does he need to be locked up where he can do no harm ???

I wonder about that as well. The smugness on the police assistant comissioner seems to indicate they are happy to get a 2-for-1 deal of arrests from this. A rapist/murderer and a gang prospect as a bonus.

[Banditbandit]

I wonder about that as well. The smugness on the police assistant comissioner seems to indicate they are happy to get a 2-for-1 deal of arrests from this. A rapist/murderer and a gang prospect as a bonus.

Yes. Pora is no innocent - he was a prospect and he had convictions for burglary ... he's also not very bright (I'm not sure about his mental health, but it's clear he's a few briks short ...) ... but he is locked up for a long time for a crime he did not commit - that's going to really fuck him up and there will be future consquences when he is released ...

It also pisses off all the other people around him who know he is innocent ...

[duckonin]

I see another Māori boy who is the victim of the system ..

Really u racist cunt ! Typical of you inbred mutts, always choosing the way of the lesser culture within your blood lines for sympathy. Why not 'just another' person within the system? Pora was creating his own road to jail. Happened he got there a mite faster, via system corruption.

[Banditbandit]

Really u racist cunt ! Typical of you inbred mutts, always choosing the way of the lesser culture within your blood lines for sympathy. Why not 'just another' person within the system? Pora was creating his own road to jail. Happened he got there a mite faster, via system corruption.

Yers - I agree he was creating his own way to jail ... maybe not for murder but certainly on that road ...

The system is built on lines of the dominant white culture - i.e. European-derived white middle class and probably patriachal ... that's NOT a race-based allegation it's a cultural based allegation - I hope you understand the difference. (Race is a void concept and always has been)

The system discriminates against Māori ... not hard to show ... it discriminates against anybody not from the Eurpoean-derived white midele class male culture ... except the ruling class .. because iot's their system ... and as you say is corrupt.

[Drew]

The system discriminates against Māori ... not hard to show

I am not saying you're wrong, but you are saying it without context.

Maori make up a disproportionate percentage of law breakers also. For whatever reason, it still shouldn't be forgotten.

Fair go or not, right and wrong is known, and more often disregarded.

[Banditbandit]

I am not saying you're wrong, but you are saying it without context.

Maori make up a disproportionate percentage of law breakers also. For whatever reason, it still shouldn't be forgotten.

Fair go or not, right and wrong is known, and more often disregarded.

Yes - there's a good chance you are right ... HOWVER .. and it's a big however ... I acknowlege there are more Maori convicted and in jail .. does that mean they break the law more often or that, having broken the law, they are more likely to be prosecuted ??

Māori rates of prosecution are high ... how much of that is because they are just more bad than their non-Maori counterparts or is it because the police are more likely to prosecute Maori ???


“A report by Auckland University academic Kylee Quince also reported that Maori adults were 3.8 times more likely to be prosecuted than non-Maori and 3.9 times more likely to be convicted of an offence. Nine times as many Maori than non-Maori are remanded in custody awaiting trial.

Prosecution is a discretionary decision. The Police will weigh the strength of evidence, previous offending and support networks. What the recent and past figures reveal is that race is the unspoken consideration. It’s the elephant in the room that the Police Minister and her department are desperate to deny. "

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA130...ution-rate.htm

Those are frightening findings - shows the system discriminates against Māori ..

[oldrider]

Yes - there's a good chance you are right ... HOWVER .. and it's a big however ... I acknowlege there are more Maori convicted and in jail .. does that mean they break the law more often or that, having broken the law, they are more likely to be prosecuted ??

Māori rates of prosecution are high ... how much of that is because they are just more bad than their non-Maori counterparts or is it because the police are more likely to prosecute Maori ???


“A report by Auckland University academic Kylee Quince also reported that Maori adults were 3.8 times more likely to be prosecuted than non-Maori and 3.9 times more likely to be convicted of an offence. Nine times as many Maori than non-Maori are remanded in custody awaiting trial.

Prosecution is a discretionary decision. The Police will weigh the strength of evidence, previous offending and support networks. What the recent and past figures reveal is that race is the unspoken consideration. It’s the elephant in the room that the Police Minister and her department are desperate to deny. "

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA130...ution-rate.htm

Those are frightening findings - shows the system discriminates against Māori ..

I used to think that sort of stuff was bullshit until recently when that Maori fellow doing the passport stuff up North was sentenced!

Then take into comparison what the so called white collar criminals have been getting as "Claytons" sentences over the last few years!

I really do believe the statistics are, in the majority, true! ... It fucking stinks IMHO!

Judges, lawyers and so called Justice are part of the problem rather than the solution too, IMHO!

Universities just keep churning out more and more lawyers every year, need them or not, wouldn't make much sense in the manufacturing world doing the same thing.

Like asking the rabbit boards to get rid of rabbits, it's their rice bowl ffs! ... Maybe Maori are regarded as the Lawyers basic rice bowl!

[Winston001]

... Maybe Maori are regarded as the Lawyers basic rice bowl!

LOL John. Just a small correction. Young lawyers start with a year of doing duty solictor and low level legal aid work and then never go near the criminal courts ever again. Only a few lawyers continue with full time criminal representation. Its low paid - often unpaid - and generally unsatisfying work, but for a few it can also be the right choice.

However because the news thrives on high profile criminal cases there is an impression heaps of lawyers are in the courts and all making a good living. The reality is you couldn't drag most lawyers kicking and screaming anywhere near a criminal case.

[pete376403]

Gregg Oconnor and the Police Association are now asking for the case to looked at. Must be a pretty dodgy conviction if they want it investigated.

[unstuck]

Judges, lawyers and so called Justice are part of the problem rather than the solution too, IMHO!

In my recent experience, I would agree with you 100% on that fella. Just a big joke is our so called justice system. More like, how can we keep ourselves employed system.

[scissorhands]

That comment begs the question ... should they be allowed to be parents? ... and that begs the question ... who should decide such things? etc, etc, etc?

As birth defects are on the increase, and society struggles with historical ones, it would seem prudent that genetic accessments of parents are offered

The system discriminates against Māori ... not hard to show ... it discriminates against anybody not from the Eurpoean-derived white midele class male culture ... except the ruling class .. because iot's their system ... and as you say is corrupt.

Sadly for Pora he is Maori and with a mental difference, possibly an autism. So he got shafted twice as hard

Judges, lawyers and so called Justice are part of the problem rather than the solution too, IMHO!

The problems for maori and for the mentally diverse are not just limited to parts of society. All of society is practising ostracisation of these groups.

The people who run the show, who dictate policy from the top down, are the real offenders here.

By alienating and bullying certain groups, many from these groups rage out against society and their own.
As can be seen in infanticide of Maori children, rage killings in the USA[david gray/columbine style homicides], drug use and feelings of hopelessness. Beyond extreme examples, are thousands more caught in this nightmare

Police are part of the problem, though communities and families inflict most harm on those outside the apple pie box,

due to lack of awareness.... go back to sleep NZ

Poor lifestyles, work environments, addiction and pollution contribute greatly to mental illness and defective genes, though nature will always create unhealthy units. Preventing reproduction is a stitch in time.
Not advising potential parents of an impending new life of pain, is profitable for medical groups, whose profits would diminish if suffering was reduced.

Medical groups and corporations grow when communities suffer

See the real enemy here. Profit over people

[Drew]

The problems for maori and for the mentally diverse are not just limited to parts of society. All of society is practising ostracisation of these groups.

Yet both groups work quite hard to continue the segragation of society!

The people who run the show, who dictate policy from the top down, are the real offenders here.

Might not be doing all they can, but they have to battle both sides at once. Why fucken bother?

[Banditbandit]

Now let's get this straight - I do not see it as a Māori issue ... sure there is a correlation between crime stats and Māori ethnicity .. howver it is a crrelation and not a causality ...

Crime and proverty are pretty strongly linked as a causality (not hard to find this stuff) ... "high risk" groups are the lower decile groups ... if you look at pre-sentnece incomes of prisoners and other crims, I'll lay good money that a huge percentage (and I'm thinking here 80-90%) will be less than $40,000. Or less than the average wage. Sure there are white collar crims and a few high earners .. but most earn bugger all money ...

Māori happen to be in the lower decile groups ... action of the immigrant culture of the past 200 years have put Māori into these groups ...

During the first half of the 19th Century our ancestors were buiolding this country into an international trading country - they grew food (fruit and vegetables) and sold these in the growing towns and shopped them to Australia . they went aroud the world and saw other countries .. they learnt to read and write faster than any other indigenous population ..

Then what happened? The forces of the incoming group wiped everything out in the wars - and there was no chance to rebuild ... Māori had huge tracts of land confiscated and were consigned to the lower echelons of the new society - schools were established to teach Māori boys to be farm labourers and Māori girls to be doemstic servants - when they had been the owners and producers on their own land ... Thyat was a massive loss of economic power and the consignment of Māori to the ranks of the poor ..

Now we are all reaping the harvest of what was sown then ... Māori are still disproportionally represented in the lower income groups - and therefore into the flow on effects - disproportionally represented in the prison population, poor health and education outcomes ... and all the consequences that go with high rates of poverty ...

You will find these things common in the poor of European-descent as well ... crime, child abuse, alcohol and drug abuse, domestic violence, low education, poor health ...

This is not a Māori issue - it's a poverty issue ... compounded by the racist system run by racist people ... especially those who will see this as an ethnicity argument and refuse to see that it is a poverty issue ...

Until people see this as a povertry issue and deal with it as such nothing will change ..

[Drew]

Now let's get this straight - I do not see it as a Māori issue ... sure there is a correlation between crime stats and Māori ethnicity .. howver it is a crrelation and not a causality ...

Crime and proverty are pretty strongly linked as a causality (not hard to find this stuff) ... "high risk" groups are the lower decile groups ... if you look at pre-sentnece incomes of prisoners and other crims, I'll lay good money that a huge percentage (and I'm thinking here 80-90%) will be less than $40,000. Or less than the average wage. Sure there are white collar crims and a few high earners .. but most earn bugger all money ...

Māori happen to be in the lower decile groups ... action of the immigrant culture of the past 200 years have put Māori into these groups ...

During the first half of the 19th Century our ancestors were buiolding this country into an international trading country - they grew food (fruit and vegetables) and sold these in the growing towns and shopped them to Australia . they went aroud the world and saw other countries .. they learnt to read and write faster than any other indigenous population ..

Then what happened? The forces of the incoming group wiped everything out in the wars - and there was no chance to rebuild ... Māori had huge tracts of land confiscated and were consigned to the lower echelons of the new society - schools were established to teach Māori boys to be farm labourers and Māori girls to be doemstic servants - when they had been the owners and producers on their own land ... Thyat was a massive loss of economic power and the consignment of Māori to the ranks of the poor ..

Now we are all reaping the harvest of what was sown then ... Māori are still disproportionally represented in the lower income groups - and therefore into the flow on effects - disproportionally represented in the prison population, poor health and education outcomes ... and all the consequences that go with high rates of poverty ...

You will find these things common in the poor of European-descent as well ... crime, child abuse, alcohol and drug abuse, domestic violence, low education, poor health ...

This is not a Māori issue - it's a poverty issue ... compounded by the racist system run by racist people ... especially those who will see this as an ethnicity argument and refuse to see that it is a poverty issue ...

Until people see this as a povertry issue and deal with it as such nothing will change ..

Shut up you. I'm trying to start an argument with the spastics!