VJ Day (Victory over Japan)

[oldrider]

I am disappointed that there was not one mention of VJ day on this forum.
Is it just my age or doesn't anybody really care about that anymore.
I recall how close we were to being invaded and what that would have meant for me and other children (at that time). It was a lot closer than Auntie Helen likes to make out. She calls it a benign territory but it was nearly invaded 60yrs ago by Japan, if it wasn't for the USA it would have been. If it wasn't for the USA today it would be easy pickins again. I personally saw a hostile Japanese warplane fly over our house. It was a sea plane off a submarine based off the Wairarapa Coast. A Harvard from Ohakea chased it but had no guns to do anything about it anyway. (Helen would have been proud of that) They were very frightening times. I would not like to see our children and grandchildren threatened like that again. Love or hate America Try being without them for a while it could get very rough. Thank you to all those who died or suffered that we might live in peace. Cheers John.

[mstriumph]

It's not that nobody cares, John ---- it's just that it's [thankfully] all so distant.

People have died and suffered throughout history to bring us to this point in time............ where we can live in relative freedom, plenty and peace ......

... when we make use of that gift by living life to the full and to the best of our abilities, I think we are probably honouring those people in a fundemental and very valid way

[LB]

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I watched the parade in Wellington and waved a flag. The parade brought a tear(s) to my eye. Those guys went through hell that we can't even begin to imagine in the wars, and I certainly appreciate what they did for our country.

It was also horrific to watch the documentary (was it late last Saturday night?) on the Hiroshima bomb, where they told the stories of some of the survivors. I'm not saying that they shouldn't have dropped the bomb, but jeez, the power of it was horrendous - and that was 60 years ago, imagine what would happen now.

The sad thing is that Man hasn't learnt a thing from all the previous wars.
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[Hitcher]

I watched the parade go by as well. I couldn't help thinking that there was probably more military equipment owned by private individuals in New Zealand than there is by the armed farces. While our parents and grandparents fought to defend future generations who could live together happily and peacefully, I'm not sure what many would think about the erosion of New Zealand's military capabilities to a point where they may hopefully compete well at a Scout jamboree...

[Hitcher]

And on the subject of nuclear bombs, more people were killed in single cities by conventional bombing e.g. Dresden, Tokyo...

I don't believe the rhetoric that has been used about nuclear bombs shortening WWII. I think some American leaders just wanted to make a point.

[Mooch]

It made the news in London, BBC have run some excellent informative documentaries on WWII, have learnt more about the wars in the last 4 months than the previous 30 years. Most have been around VE, but they’ve also ran a good one on Gallipoli which I now finally understand. You don't get many on NZ TV (Apart from Sky). Have met very few WWII veterans in my life time. They've manily been reluctant to talk about the War. (apart from a WWII Air Carrier fighter pilot) I guess for obvious reasons, apart from the "old scallywag up to mischief" type stories.I tended to hear more about what they did for New Zealand at funerals.
I second John’s sentiments. Thank you for you sacrifices.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/d...00/3581971.stm

[SARGE]

thank you OldRider.. nice to se that there are still some folks around who appriciate what the US ( and other nations) did during that time in history

green rep in spades

[placidfemme]

I am disappointed that there was not one mention of VJ day on this forum.
Is it just my age or doesn't anybody really care about that anymore.
I recall how close we were to being invaded and what that would have meant for me and other children (at that time). It was a lot closer than Auntie Helen likes to make out. She calls it a benign territory but it was nearly invaded 60yrs ago by Japan, if it wasn't for the USA it would have been. If it wasn't for the USA today it would be easy pickins again. I personally saw a hostile Japanese warplane fly over our house. It was a sea plane off a submarine based off the Wairarapa Coast. A Harvard from Ohakea chased it but had no guns to do anything about it anyway. (Helen would have been proud of that) They were very frightening times. I would not like to see our children and grandchildren threatened like that again. Love or hate America Try being without them for a while it could get very rough. Thank you to all those who died or suffered that we might live in peace. Cheers John.

Hey Mate... I never even knew that happened.... how sad am I?

LMAO @ A Harvard from Ohakea chased it but had no guns to do anything about it anyway. (Helen would have been proud of that)

Things havn't changed much since then... still have no guns

[MacD]

It's not that nobody cares, John ---- it's just that it's [thankfully] all so distant.

It's not really that distant, my father spent six years overseas during WWII, in both the Pacific and Europe (he turns 90 in November). The older I get the more I respect the sacrifices my parent's generation made, and the more annoyed I get by neo-cons like George Bush who use war as an economic tool.

[Lou Girardin]

I was more interested in the commemoration of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the 'victimisation' of the Japanese.
Nary a mention of the atrocities they committed, the rape of Nanking, the slaughter of civilians in Manilla, the disgusting treatment of prisoners of war.
Doubtless the Merkins had many motivators to use the bomb, but first and foremost it saved 100,000's of lives by avoiding the need to invade Japan. Although, they still didn't surrender after Hiroshima, Hirohito had to unilaterally declare surrender after the Nagasaki bomb.
And, still, the Japanese try to revise history and their part in it. Unlike the Germans, they have never truly aplogised for their actions. Merely expressed "regret".

[MikeL]

It was a lot closer than Auntie Helen likes to make out... Helen would have been proud of that

John, while I respect your political opinions, and share your sentiments about the significance of the sacrifices made in World War II, I think that your attempt to link today's foreign and military policies with the situation 60 years ago amounts to little more than a gratuitous dig at a PM who, with all due respect, has a better grasp of the realities of power than you.

[Oscar]

And on the subject of nuclear bombs, more people were killed in single cities by conventional bombing e.g. Dresden, Tokyo...

I don't believe the rhetoric that has been used about nuclear bombs shortening WWII. I think some American leaders just wanted to make a point.

If you don't believe that the A-Bombs shortened the war, you need to do more research. If you look at the casualties from Okinawa and project them onto an invasion of Japan, you get 1m Allied Dead & Wounded and God knows how many Japanese. I saw an interview with a Jap who was 12 in 1945 and he told of being taught how to run at a US tank with a satchel charge and roll underneath to then blow himself up.

The fact was that both the Chief of Staff, Gen. Marshall, and President Truman were leaning away from an invasion, due to the concentration of Jap troops in proposed invasion sites. Their only alternative was continued carpet bombing and a naval blockade. As you mentioned, convential bombing was quite capable of inflicting horrendous casualties (the fire bombing of Tokyo killed 100,000 in one night). The war would have dragged on much longer and many more deaths would have ensued...

The interesting thing was that in the end, the threat of the USSR entering the war was as troubling to the Jap Govt. as the A-Bombs - and one prompted the other. Joe Stalin had promised the Allies that the Soviets would attack Japan (through Manchuria) toward the end of 1945. When the first A-Bomb bomb was dropped, this operation was brought forward, as Stalin feared he would miss out....

[Oscar]

I was more interested in the commemoration of Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the 'victimisation' of the Japanese.
Nary a mention of the atrocities they committed, the rape of Nanking, the slaughter of civilians in Manilla, the disgusting treatment of prisoners of war.
Doubtless the Merkins had many motivators to use the bomb, but first and foremost it saved 100,000's of lives by avoiding the need to invade Japan. Although, they still didn't surrender after Hiroshima, Hirohito had to unilaterally declare surrender after the Nagasaki bomb.
And, still, the Japanese try to revise history and their part in it. Unlike the Germans, they have never truly aplogised for their actions. Merely expressed "regret".

Hirohito's intial surrender overtures seemed to be more about his position than that of his people. He wanted to be left with his full power as head of state, with no interference by the Allies in constitutional matters (the first response to Soviet overtures was that no occupation would take place). I have no doubt that Hirohito was a war criminal and should have been tired accordingly. The fact that he wasn't is just as bad as the Japanese Govts. subsequent refusal to apologise for any of their actions...

[Hitcher]

If you don't believe that the A-Bombs shortened the war, you need to do more research. If you look at the casualties from Okinawa and project them onto an invasion of Japan, you get 1m Allied Dead & Wounded and God knows how many Japanese. I saw an interview with a Jap who was 12 in 1945 and he told of being taught how to run at a US tank with a satchel charge and roll underneath to then blow himself up.

That's if the allies had decided to invade Japan. There was no rush. The Japanese by that stage of the war had no navy and no air force. They weren't going anywhere. The allies could have continued to have bombed cities and industrial targets and starved them into surrender.

[Oscar]

That's if the allies had decided to invade Japan. There was no rush. The Japanese by that stage of the war had no navy and no air force. They weren't going anywhere. The allies could have continued to have bombed cities and industrial targets and starved them into surrender.

On the contrary - the Japanese Airforce in August 1945 still had 3500 operational planes. The practicality of a blockade would have invovled living with kamikaze planes, ships and submarines which were a major source of casualties at Okinawa.

The fact was that there was no discussion about using the bomb or not in the US Govt. After four years of total war, the opportunity to finish it so quickly was enthusiastically taken.

Any extended fire bombing of major cities would have (and did) result in many more casualties than the two A-Bombs. I just can't see how a blockade would have been a better result....