Regaining confidence after a fall

[shflbm]

I have a genuine question.

I feel uneasy going around roundabouts and turning into streets on my new bike. 1st seems too little and 2nd too much. So, I've been in 2nd, pull in the clutch only slightly while still on the throttle so that I don't "coast" hope that makes sense. I feel confused though, feel like I'm doing the wrong thing?

Yes I think that's what my husband does - there's a big difference between touching the clutch to increase control and pulling the clutch completely in. I wonder if all the somewhat nasty toing and froing in this conversation re. clutch around corners is just because of peoples' differing terminology for the clutch being fully in vs. being controlled with your hand.

[shflbm]

I just checked a motorcycle riding school website and they talk about using the clutch on corners as "power tuning" as opposed to "slipping" or as I said "coasting" I guess the word coast does create an illusion of holding the clutch in for a large part of the turn which is not what I do at all and I am able to engage the gears smoothly on exit, although with a new bike and getting to know the power band some snatch or jerk does happen which maybe the problem
poster 1 was having as I have had the same issue with new bikes.

Yeah I think this whole conversation (if you can call it that) about clutch around corners has been a misunderstanding of clutch terminology! Good idea looking at the website though...

[caseye]

For clarity please ask them both, if disengaging the clutch while leaned and in a corner is an acceptable practice.
I'd appreciate that.
For the record, I believe that unless you have straightened the bike up and are coming to a controlled stop the answer will be NO, an emphatic no, at that.
These forums are for all KB and guests to air their views, and ask questions, if things get a little heated there are usually reasons, the biggest reason things get heated here in KB is because those who ride don't want those that advise without a clue as to what they are advising to do so.
There are enough inexperienced motorcycle riders out there without turning otherwise careful and open to learning experience riders into idiots who do things because a fool says it's OK to do so.

[shflbm]

For clarity please ask them both, if disengaging the clutch while leaned and in a corner is an acceptable practice.
I'd appreciate that.
For the record, I believe that unless you have straightened the bike up and are coming to a controlled stop the answer will be NO, an emphatic no, at that.
These forums are for all KB and guests to air their views, and ask questions, if things get a little heated there are usually reasons, the biggest reason things get heated here in KB is because those who ride don't want those that advise without a clue as to what they are advising to do so.
There are enough inexperienced motorcycle riders out there without turning otherwise careful and open to learning experience riders into idiots who do things because a fool says it's OK to do so.

I will try to remember - it will probably come out in the conversation anyway. But I need to know too since it appears the Bandit is too low in first (slow and not smooth) and too high in second to go round roundabouts for example, for me.

I appreciate people giving advice, of course, and the discussions that ensue are obviously valuable. But I don't appreciate why people find the need to swear and call other people names! It's like we're all twelve or something. I guess some people are just used to talking like that in every day conversations so that's how they talk on here.

[duckonin]

Note I said a TIGHT bend. I have been riding for 37 years and have NEVER fallen off on a bend and should in theory be dead by your theory eh sport!!!!!

Fuck it is a WONDER you made the 37 years intact. Drew is right "don't give advise on riding anything at all . Buggar me the shit in this thread is bad for any person wanting to learn to ride well or for that matter wanting to stay upright. Yep I have seen riders and drivers come to grief big time using a clutch at the wrong time, it can and will kill you !. Learn to be in the right gear; not too low not too high.

[george formby]

I will try to remember - it will probably come out in the conversation anyway. But I need to know too since it appears the Bandit is too low in first (slow and not smooth) and too high in second to go round roundabouts for example, for me.

I appreciate people giving advice, of course, and the discussions that ensue are obviously valuable. But I don't appreciate why people find the need to swear and call other people names! It's like we're all twelve or something. I guess some people are just used to talking like that in every day conversations so that's how they talk on here.

The truth is in here shflbm and I think your doing exactly the right thing with your on going training. Only so much you can get from the interwebs. I took up the opportunity of some training awhile ago & was amazed at how it improved my riding. And how much I did not know after 35 years on bikes... It also gave me an appetite to continue learning & improving. Just makes the whole bike experience get better & better.

Now that I'm used to it I enjoy the play ground atmosphere of KB, would never get away with it in real life.

[cbfb]

Yeah I think this whole conversation (if you can call it that) about clutch around corners has been a misunderstanding of clutch terminology! Good idea looking at the website though...

No it was just crap advice that started it off: " If I get in the wrong gear on a tight bend/roundabout I pull the cluch lever in and coast around as often first gear can be too low and second too high. "

Don't think anyone would be unclear on what coast means.

But on the plus side maybe it made a few people think about this after Drew etc set the record straight.

But I don't appreciate why people find the need to swear and call other people names! It's like we're all twelve or something. I guess some people are just used to talking like that in every day conversations so that's how they talk on here.

I'm actually quite polite on KB. I'm a proper grumpy bastard in real life.

All the best with your training.

[Mushu]

Well, isn't this an interesting argument, has the OP figured the reason for the crash that started this thread?

As far as the clutch thing, the word coast (implying a fully disengaged clutch, ie no drive to the rear wheel) is what caused the argument, I think anybody with any real experience will tell you that's a no no, to maintain grip while cornering at speed requires you to accelerate through the corner and your better off learning to roll on the throttle through a corner at low speeds so if you ever do come into a corner too hot you have the skill to use all of the grip available.

Clutch in while cornering may be an effect of fear, like when inexperienced riders tend to snap the throttle closed when they find themselves in trouble (which in most cases only makes things worse)

Slipping the clutch is fine, as long as you maintain drive to the rear wheel, but my preferred method for tight corners and roundabouts is to drag the rear brake through the corner and if it works on my R6, it'll work on a bandit.

[george formby]

Well, isn't this an interesting argument, has the OP figured the reason for the crash that started this thread?

As far as the clutch thing, the word coast (implying a fully disengaged clutch, ie no drive to the rear wheel) is what caused the argument, I think anybody with any real experience will tell you that's a no no, to maintain grip while cornering at speed requires you to accelerate through the corner and your better off learning to roll on the throttle through a corner at low speeds so if you ever do come into a corner too hot you have the skill to use all of the grip available.

Clutch in while cornering may be an effect of fear, like when inexperienced riders tend to snap the throttle closed when they find themselves in trouble (which in most cases only makes things worse)

Slipping the clutch is fine, as long as you maintain drive to the rear wheel, but my preferred method for tight corners and roundabouts is to drag the rear brake through the corner and if it works on my R6, it'll work on a bandit.

Their is a plan D, too. Maintain a steady throttle & lean it in some mawr. Unless of course you think a safety margin is the vertical line on a piece of paper.

[Mushu]

Their is a plan D, too. Maintain a steady throttle & lean it in some mawr. Unless of course you think a safety margin is the vertical line on a piece of paper.

A slight roll on the throttle allows more grip to be available, doesn't have to be much, constant throttle still allows the bike to slow through the corner, putting unnecessary stress on the front tire at that point even a slight loss of grip can put you off.

If accelerating hard enough front wheel grip is doing bugger all and a rear wheel slide is easily recoverable. Have a look how the guys who race do things, whatever works on a race track works on the road as long as you remove speed.

[shflbm]

Their is a plan D, too. Maintain a steady throttle & lean it in some mawr. Unless of course you think a safety margin is the vertical line on a piece of paper.

Plan D was what I tried on this particular occasion! Still trying to figure out what went wrong...

[george formby]

Works in a car park, too. I think it was Teach Mcneil.. memory might be sketchy, said after a demonstration that if it works at 20kmh it will work at 120kmh.
It was at a motogymkhana day & if memory serves he rode part of the course facing backwards on the bike. Messed with my head that did.

[george formby]

Plan D was what I tried on this particular occasion! Still trying to figure out what went wrong...

That indeed is what you need to figure out. No doubt when you do you will turn a corner, excuse the pun, and be a bit happier with the bike. It seems to boil down to too much or too little throttle. Might have got my to's mixed up there. You would have to be an awfully long way over to run out of tire. Speaking of which, have you looked at the back tire for clues? If it spun out with to much throttle you can probably see it.

I rolled off the G/F's bike recently, doing some practice. First time ever that I have bit the dust with no warning. At the start of the second I was up, full lock, leaned over to the max (I know this), at the end of the second I was lying down, nothing in between. I ran out of front tire but had no sensation of it washing out because I was at full lock.

Make a point of discussing your topple on Sunday, getting to the bottom of it and learning how to avoid it in future.
Their are only a couple of reasons why it happened despite the chewing & meandering in this thread.

[shflbm]

That indeed is what you need to figure out. No doubt when you do you will turn a corner, excuse the pun, and be a bit happier with the bike. It seems to boil down to too much or too little throttle. Might have got my to's mixed up there. You would have to be an awfully long way over to run out of tire. Speaking of which, have you looked at the back tire for clues? If it spun out with to much throttle you can probably see it.

I rolled off the G/F's bike recently, doing some practice. First time ever that I have bit the dust with no warning. At the start of the second I was up, full lock, leaned over to the max (I know this), at the end of the second I was lying down, nothing in between. I ran out of front tire but had no sensation of it washing out because I was at full lock.

Make a point of discussing your topple on Sunday, getting to the bottom of it and learning how to avoid it in future.
Their are only a couple of reasons why it happened despite the chewing & meandering in this thread.

The guy who came to pick us up looked at the back tire and said that the scratch on there was evident of it 'running out'. More and more I'm thinking what happened is I was in second gear at too low revs and leaning too far. Bike didn't have enough inertia to keep going upright so it just... sat down. That's what I'm thinking. Because I know that if I did the same thing on the ER6 it would have been fine, and that's (I think) because it's got more torque at low revs.

[george formby]

The guy who came to pick us up looked at the back tire and said that the scratch on there was evident of it 'running out'. More and more I'm thinking what happened is I was in second gear at too low revs and leaning too far. Bike didn't have enough inertia to keep going upright so it just... sat down. That's what I'm thinking. Because I know that if I did the same thing on the ER6 it would have been fine, and that's (I think) because it's got more torque at low revs.

I ride a twin & know that it will happily pull from just above idle in 2nd & 3rd. That's why I like it, it's lazy. I stand to be corrected but I don't think this a forte of middleweight fours, even mildly tuned ones. Been years since I rode one & that was a CBR which liked revs.
Seems like we're moving ahead. Interested to read the take from other contributors.