Charter schools

[awa355]

Parata outlines the details of the charter schools that will fire up next year. They appear to be targetting specific groups.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=11126190

To me, this concept goes against everything that education should be. If a society wants its' people educated, then secrecy and profits have no place in that education system.
The current system needs major overhauling, but this charter schools is not the answer.

[Akzle]

come to the school of akzle.

[Oakie]

None of the five schools seem to be secretive at all and each seems to have and end goal that is not just profit (although good on them if they can deliver quality outcomes and make a profit).

It'll be interesting to see how it plays out. It has the potential to be good. Shame it's going to be a political football.

[MisterD]

then secrecy and profits have no place in that education system.

Go and tell the teachers that they're not allowed to make any money out of teaching...because that's what they're doing, making a profit out of selling their skills and experience to the school.

[awa355]

Go and tell the teachers that they're not allowed to make any money out of teaching...because that's what they're doing, making a profit out of selling their skills and experience to the school.

Getting paid a wage is not the same as commercial corporate profits. We all get paid for our work skills.

[Oscar]

Parata outlines the details of the charter schools that will fire up next year. They appear to be targetting specific groups.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=11126190

To me, this concept goes against everything that education should be. If a society wants its' people educated, then secrecy and profits have no place in that education system.
The current system needs major overhauling, but this charter schools is not the answer.

Four of those schools are run by not for profit charities.
They will have to make an annual return to the Charities Commission.

[scott411]

Parata outlines the details of the charter schools that will fire up next year. They appear to be targetting specific groups.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=11126190

To me, this concept goes against everything that education should be. If a society wants its' people educated, then secrecy and profits have no place in that education system.
The current system needs major overhauling, but this charter schools is not the answer.

the bottom 20% are failing, if this can stop it how can it be a bad thing,

the teacher unions are looking awful over this IMO, the community groups that havc set up to start these 5 seem very good at a quick glace, and to have the PPTA telling all schools and their members to haev nothing to do with them and treat the students like lepers,

and denying destiny church one was a good move,

[Oakie]

the bottom 20% are failing, if this can stop it how can it be a bad thing,

the teacher unions are looking awful over this IMO, the community groups that havc set up to start these 5 seem very good at a quick glace, and to have the PPTA telling all schools and their members to haev nothing to do with them and treat the students like lepers,

and denying destiny church one was a good move,

PPTA and teachers in general are strongly Labour biased anyway so their rabid opposition was always a given.

[Robert Taylor]

the bottom 20% are failing, if this can stop it how can it be a bad thing,

the teacher unions are looking awful over this IMO, the community groups that havc set up to start these 5 seem very good at a quick glace, and to have the PPTA telling all schools and their members to haev nothing to do with them and treat the students like lepers,

and denying destiny church one was a good move,

If these schools work well ( maybe they will, maybe they wont ) its going to make the current teaching establishment ( Labour party sympathetic ) look bad. Thats probably part of what they worry about and why they are so bitter and twisted. Bad luck....

[mansell]

If these schools work well ( maybe they will, maybe they wont ) its going to make the current teaching establishment ( Labour party sympathetic ) look bad. Thats probably part of what they worry about and why they are so bitter and twisted. Bad luck....

I think this is a flawed example of reasoning, there is already evidence to prove Charter Schools are not the best idea. BTW I am a teacher in an urban High School, if the government were really concerned about the bottom 20% there are much better models for increasing their achievement (smaller classes and more resourcing comes to mind). I question a government that consistently wants our education system (5th in the world) to resenble that of the mighty USA (ranked between 20th and 30th). Mind you this information is a bit old, we are still waiting on the latest PISA results.

[mashman]

If these schools work well ( maybe they will, maybe they wont ) its going to make the current teaching establishment ( Labour party sympathetic ) look bad. Thats probably part of what they worry about and why they are so bitter and twisted. Bad luck....

Whilst I've no doubt that saving face probably is a concern, it's a bit of a skewed playing field innit? as the Charter Schools seem to have the power to move away from the curriculum. Seems like they're all comparing apples with oranges and as you allude to, should the charter schools do well based on the performance criteria set, it'll become a political football. Kinda shit given that the education system is supposed to be providing the best education for every child in the country.

[oldrider]

Getting paid a wage is not the same as commercial corporate profits. We all get paid for our work skills.

Mediocre performance rewarded with top level remuneration and no performance measures (accountability) to get in the way!

This equates to "appearance money" for the average school teachers but hey it's all about "participation" rather than "performance" these days, isn't it!

That what gets measured gets done, when there are no measures it's little more than participation .... everybody is happy ... no winners, just losers! (students)

[mansell]

Mediocre performance rewarded with top level remuneration and no performance measures (accountability) to get in the way!

This equates to "appearance money" for the average school teachers but hey it's all about "participation" rather than "performance" these days, isn't it!

That what gets measured gets done, when there are no measures it's little more than participation .... everybody is happy ... no winners, just losers! (students)

Been a while since you had anything to do with schools has it. Its all about bloody performance measurement now and the "gurus" seem to think that equates to results, in a class of 20 kids there are 20 different circumstances and each student has a different set of problems. This move to results based appraisal is what is driving a lot of very talented teacher out of the profession. In an earlier posting I taught at a decile 1 High School in South Auckland, and for some of those students getting them to turn up was the main measure of success.
BTW if anyone thinks they can do a better job than trained professionals (yes-that is what we are) feel free to set up your own school, just stop taking money away from where it is needed.

[Winston001]

I'm uncertain about charter schools but 5 is a tiny number out of approx 2000 schools in NZ. It's worth trying.

[oldrider]

Been a while since you had anything to do with schools has it. Its all about bloody performance measurement now and the "gurus" seem to think that equates to results, in a class of 20 kids there are 20 different circumstances and each student has a different set of problems. This move to results based appraisal is what is driving a lot of very talented teacher out of the profession. In an earlier posting I taught at a decile 1 High School in South Auckland, and for some of those students getting them to turn up was the main measure of success.
BTW if anyone thinks they can do a better job than trained professionals (yes-that is what we are) feel free to set up your own school, just stop taking money away from where it is needed.

As a senior manager of a group of major industrial factories I was actually a customer of your schools with respect to the product that you turned out!

I don't think that the schools of today prepare their students for the work force because we always had to restart the process from the beginning!

Sure there were some very gifted students came to us but there gifts were relatively undeveloped or misdirected and the recovery costs to both the new recruit and to the company were often major and could have been sorted long before they left school!

I don't believe that very many teachers have any idea about the requirements industry has of school levers because it is not part of their own psychology or experience!

I take on board your comments about my current knowledge of schools and their workings, things do change and I am out of that loop now, hope I am wrong!