Leather jackets - cheap vs expensive?

[GrayWolf]

I have never seen anything advertised as 2mm thick. Everything from 1tonne to qmoto to a* is around 1.2-1.4mm. Care to link an example?

Exactly my point 1tonne-Qmoto, Cnell all are basically budget price suppliers...
Yes you're right there are those that buy gear to wank off on it (Paint job helmets of 'race riders' is a fine example) I am referring to gear that you buy as a KNOWN quality brand, not the 'wank factor'....

As for the thickness of leather, here's a link to a site discussing leather quality... read the bit about fine/full grained leather (highest quality hides)

http://www.chuckhawks.com/motorcycle_leather.htm

and Byson leather's in the UK/.. 1.5 to 2mm thick is recommended
http://www.bysonleather.co.uk/BYSON%...utLeathers.htm

quote:
Leather for motorcycle clothing.

You are buying protective clothing so don't sacrifice safety and function to form and fashion. It could be a blood sacrifice.

Leather is used for motorcycle clothing because of it's abrasion resistance, comfort and appearance. "Moto" grade leather for bike use wants to be at least 1.5 - 2mm thick to give a reasonable degree of protection. Thinner than this and it will not protect your valuable hide if you slide down the road (the exception here is kangaroo hide which because of its structure can provide equivalent levels of protection at 1½ mm thickness). Leather up to 3mm thick is flexible enough to use for leathers but over and about this thickness you start noticing the sheer weight of the stuff. A compromise is often used where especially vulnerable areas - hips, arse, shoulders elbows and knees - are "double leathered" to provide extra protection without incurring the weight penalty of a thicker suit / jacket. Additional protection in these areas is also provided by body armor and Kevlar™ backing. Thinned down leather is also used for lettering and artwork but this is not thick enough to provide significant protection. Full grain leather is the best quality, but is not colour fast and is expensive. The best "moto" grade leather is "top grain" and "corrected grain" which are refinished leathers. These are lower quality than full grain leather but more practical.
Just a quick aside here. Leather does not stretch. At least, leather suitable for motorcycle clothing does not stretch appreciably in any sensible time frame. So if a sales person sells you a suit / jacket / jeans which are a bit on the tight side, they are going to stay on the tight side and they will not be comfortable. Ever. end quote:


Ah, cool, the jacket you refer to finding out by chance - was it one of those particular trademe ones or???

yes it was a trademe advertiser, but not one of the jackets being discussed by the OP, it was from a 'known' trader, is all I will say. I found out about the seam (arm to body) due to the fact a poorly cut liner seam split, as it was 'smaller' than the actual jacket. Thankfully both of these jackets are just used for casual wear, not for riding.

[Road kill]

Six months ago I bought a Cnell jacket,was going to buy 1Tonne at the same $$ but I could drop into Cnells shop and try on and inspect so I did that instead.

Got it home an the Mrs who buys and reconditions saddles as a side line went over it an gave it the thumbs up,so I went back last week an bought a new pair of leather jeans as well.

The only issue is after riding in the same old Leather Fashions jacket and what ever leather jeans since 1988 I now look like I just stepped out of AMPS after buying all the bikie gear to go with my new Hog.

Mind you,I didn't pay $800 for my new jacket like I did for the LF jacket and I'm going to be dead before this jacket is so it's all good.

[1tonne]

You may find that a suit made of 2mm leather to be not as comfortable or flexible as one that has thinner leather. You may notice that on many suits including ours we have double layers of leather on the buttocks area. So that means that there is more than 2mm of leather on the butt. Thinner leather is used in places that need more flexibility while thicker or double layers are used in area that need extra protection.

[Robert Taylor]

All my experience with cheap gear has been the same. It does not last. Protection in an off is a moot point, really. A $3000 race suit will not help if you hit a power pole.
Cheap gear goes at the seams, zips crap out or come away, studs pop out, cuffs & collars fray, they rip under the arms etc. Quite often the sizing & cut is a lottery.

There is no evidence of MotoGP or WSBK riders wearing and trusting in the said brand. Whilst there are of course variables the level of protection is almost directly linked to the cost and the pedigree of the brand.

Gravel rash is a similiar event at most points of the globe and doesnt discriminate whether you are racing at a very top level or get taken out whilst you are on the way to the local Chinese dairy for your legal highs.

Back in 85 I had a major accident and am very thankful for the Dainese gear that I was wearing and Bell helmet. Many years later Alpinestars is doing a stellar job and its one of only a handful that Id even consider.

Cheap always costs in other ways.

[1tonne]

There is no evidence of MotoGP or WSBK riders wearing and trusting in the said brand. Whilst there are of course variables the level of protection is almost directly linked to the cost and the pedigree of the brand.

"Said brand". I am not sure if you are talking about "1Tonne" or not. I am presuming that you are not as we have Sam Croft (numer24) who wears our gear in the European Junior Cup.
http://www.worldsbk.com/en/teams-e-riders/ejc/2013.html
http://www.europeanjuniorcup.com/eur...ider=sam_croft

[Robert Taylor]

"Said brand". I am not sure if you are talking about "1Tonne" or not. I am presuming that you are not as we have Sam Croft (numer24) who wears our gear in the European Junior Cup.
http://www.worldsbk.com/en/teams-e-riders/ejc/2013.html
http://www.europeanjuniorcup.com/eur...ider=sam_croft

Respectfully , my points remain nonetheless.

[Floppy disk]

That "leather" looks like a cat's skin.

[macka77]

Respectfully , my points remain nonetheless.

ive never seen a new alpinestars one piece at a race meeting yet , you will spot them sipping latte an having brunch on a sunday morning trip or on their shiny new bike
your point is

[Robert Taylor]

ive never seen a new alpinestars one piece at a race meeting yet , you will spot them sipping latte an having brunch on a sunday morning trip or on their shiny new bike
your point is

So you don't watch MotoGP and WSBK? So you are also not aware that the three Spaniards who almost always are 1,2, 3 on the MotoGP podium all wear topline protection from Alpinestars?
Its also sounds like you have an ''us and them'' mentality. Im not fond of latte myself or the often maligned image of latte drinkers but it might or might not have occurred to you that many people in general ( irrespective of whether they have a latte addiction or not ) may have worked really hard to have the means to purchase their ''shiny new bike''. And good on them!
I think that as a generalisation its a little disingenuous to make out that budget priced products will perform just as well as the pedigree and higher priced products that have extensive R&D facilities that assist no end in the work that goes into achieving a high level of protection.
My limited little world of motorcycle riding is restricted these days to test riding suspension improvements several times per week. ( Riding for recreation escaped my world 20 odd years ago ) The test routine is not a massive distance or a great deal of time but I still see the need to ( always ) gear up with high protection, quality riding gear. Dainese / Bell helped save me from major trauma coming up to 30 years ago, with that experience in mind Im not about to increase my chances of gravel rash or head injuries any further by purchasing budget protection.

[1tonne]

Paying more often does work out to get you a better quality product but it is not always so. A lot of the time you are paying a lot extra for the name. If you can get rid of that extra name cost you will be paying a lot less. We use manufacturers that are some of the best in their game and we do not put on the massive mark up for our brand name.
Our Races suits are very much up there.

[Robert Taylor]

Paying more often does work out to get you a better quality product but it is not always so. A lot of the time you are paying a lot extra for the name. If you can get rid of that extra name cost you will be paying a lot less. We use manufacturers that are some of the best in their game and we do not put on the massive mark up for our brand name.
Our Races suits are very much up there.

The point I made ( of many ) has been missed. Those name brands have huge R&D facility, the results often copied by the ''followers'' in the industry who have no R&D budget. R&D inevitably costs.

In the end people will choose what they want and the reason for price differences are very real, especially where manufacturers find ways of cheapening product ( and Im not only talking about leather ) Of course its always only too easy to say there are huge markups when in fact the reasons are usually more compelling and devoid of emotive and simplistic assumptions

[Erelyes]

disingenuous

Careful, Edbear might sue you for using that word.

I think the argument has swung here from 'Cheap vs expensive' to 'Midrange vs expensive'. I would consider 1tonne, Qmoto etc midrange.

No question that Dianese, A*s etc are top end of the market, but like most products, the top end of the market gives you a much higher pricetag for a little extra benefit.

The original Q was whether the cheap jackets on trademe can perform anywhere near something brandname. Noone's had experience with the ones I linked (Graywolf tried something similar); I was kinda hoping someone had binned in one.

Nevermind, general concensus seems to be that one can get a proven product (e.g. 1tonne, qmoto, cnell) for not much more than the trademe stuff. A*, Dianese are just out my pricerange (secondhand excepted)

Cheers

[Robert Taylor]

Careful, Edbear might sue you for using that word.

I think the argument has swung here from 'Cheap vs expensive' to 'Midrange vs expensive'. I would consider 1tonne, Qmoto etc midrange.

No question that Dianese, A*s etc are top end of the market, but like most products, the top end of the market gives you a much higher pricetag for a little extra benefit.

The original Q was whether the cheap jackets on trademe can perform anywhere near something brandname. Noone's had experience with the ones I linked (Graywolf tried something similar); I was kinda hoping someone had binned in one.

Nevermind, general concensus seems to be that one can get a proven product (e.g. 1tonne, qmoto, cnell) for not much more than the trademe stuff. A*, Dianese are just out my pricerange (secondhand excepted)

Cheers

We will have to agree to disagree then. There is one thing though that most of us will agree on, too many people ride motorcycles with inadequate levels of protection.

[1tonne]

We will have to agree to disagree then. There is one thing though that most of us will agree on, too many people ride motorcycles with inadequate levels of protection.

Yes your are right. They are dumb if they do.

[1tonne]

The point I made ( of many ) has been missed. Those name brands have huge R&D facility, the results often copied by the ''followers'' in the industry who have no R&D budget. R&D inevitably costs.

You are also right with this. A home grown NZ Brand cannot put millions of dollars into R&D. In saying this it's not long before our manufactures catch up to the big name brands. (Note: Our manufacturers do make for some pretty big brands anyway)