ESE's works engine tuner

[Flettner]

Ultimatly they are all air cooled. What cools the radiator? The liquid is only a heat transfer system.

[jasonu]

Attachment 291294 Chapter 24 Miniature RR (Buckets)

F4 2 stroke engines over 104cc are restricted to carburation equivalent to a single 24mm carburetor.

Attachment 291295 Appendix D Championship Classes, Solo motorcycles shall have :-


F4
2 stroke 55 -100cc.
2 stroke 55 - 125cc air cooled.
4 stroke 55 -150cc.


So you have to look in at least two places to read the rules covering 125cc F4 2T's. And liquid cooled is not mentioned, only the term "air cooled" is used, and does air cooled mean you can't use a drop of oil to thermally connect a heat source to its cooling element?

This interests me as I intend using a lot of copper wire and copper dust wetted with oil for themal contact, to transport heat from its source to the heat sinks.

Bit if you are using a drop of oil to thermally connect a heat source to its cooling element then is it now not air cooled?

[Flettner]

What if air is cold enough to be liquid?

[Yow Ling]

detail of aircooled rg150 barrel

[husaberg]

What if air is cold enough to be liquid?

Air is 80% Nitrogen Neil.........boils -196 degrees or so..........
Oxygen boils at -182c
CO2 -56c
I would be very interesting in seeing a how an Air cooled head is copy cast and how to make a tool for a air cooled cylinder to say go around one of these.

[Flettner]

The head is easy, all my 350 heads have been cast at Thames. The cylinder? I've never cast an air cooled one, I've got the beginnings of patterns here to cast a 350 cylinder ( air cooled ) with modern porting inside but have never gone any further. Too busy dicking around with sleeves etc. I'm sure it would be not a big deal. The mould to make the sand mould ( outside ) would need to be steel I think and the core baked in shell sand. Or in this case lost wax system, maybe? A die is still needed to make the wax original anyway.
Surely a proper ( modern ) constructed 100 cc water cooled would be the go? Perhaps making it a two cylinder with vairable rotary valves.
If E85 were legal, then air cooled would be less of a problem. Internal liquid / vapor cooling.
Having the original core boxes for that cylinder ( you show in the picture ) would be a big help.

[kel]

Bit if you are using a drop of oil to thermally connect a heat source to its cooling element then is it now not air cooled?

The object would no longer be direct cooled, it can still be air cooled.
I'm with Neil on this one.

[TZ350]

detail of aircooled rg150 barrel

Thats is very clever.

I would be very interesting in seeing a how an Air cooled head is copy cast and how to make a tool for a air cooled cylinder to say go around one of these.

The head is easy, all my 350 heads have been cast at Thames. The cylinder? I've never cast an air cooled one. Having the original core boxes for that cylinder ( you show in the picture ) would be a big help.

I would love an air cooled cylinder with deep fining and a modern port layout.



I am an air cooled sort of guy.

[mr bucketracer]

the foundery here have a rotating platform when poring air cooled cylinders to fling out the aluminum, seems to work a treat

[Ocean1]

A die is still needed to make the wax original anyway.

Nah, just print it. There's even a dirt cheap kit to make one... :http://www.theshedmag.co.nz/online/c...&category_id=1

[Ocean1]

the foundery here have a rotating platform when poring air cooled cylinders to fling out the aluminum, seems to work a treat

Most SG iron liners are centrifugally cast, makes for less porosity.

[Flettner]

Nah, just print it. There's even a dirt cheap kit to make one... :http://www.theshedmag.co.nz/online/c...&category_id=1

My mistake, I afraid I'm still a little old school. I hate those 3D printers but perhaps there is a use for them in printing wax? Can they print wax? Perhaps I could CNC 3D machine a pattern direct, out of wax? No, just better off machining a steel die for shell sand. No, perhaps better off machining a male in carbon and spark eroding into steel. Cover the steel mould in ceramic paint and you have a die cast setup, pour straight in the steel die with hard sand cores locked inside, that way we could make lots and lots of them real quick!
In reality I'm sure it could be done with a wood mould making CO2 sand outer. Split the fins and make each one separate and glue together, layer ( fin ) after layer ( to make the wood mould ) paying great attention to surface finish and enough taper to make the mould slide appart with out sticking.
Actualy just get one of those 3D metal printers Frits has.

[Ocean1]

My mistake, I afraid I'm still a little old school. I hate those 3D printers but perhaps there is a use for them in printing wax? Can they print wax? Perhaps I could CNC 3D machine a pattern direct, out of wax? No, just better off machining a steel die for shell sand. No, perhaps better off machining a male in carbon and spark eroding into steel. Cover the steel mould in ceramic paint and you have a die cast setup, pour straight in the steel die with hard sand cores locked inside, that way we could make lots and lots of them real quick!
In reality I'm sure it could be done with a wood mould making CO2 sand outer. Split the fins and make each one separate and glue together, layer ( fin ) after layer ( to make the wood mould ) paying great attention to surface finish and enough taper to make the mould slide appart with out sticking.
Actualy just get one of those 3D metal printers Frits has.

My school's older than yours.

And yeah, you can print wax, jewellery industry has been doing it for a while. Amazing resolution too.

Don't know what toys Frits has. But quite a while ago I got involved on the outskirts of the development of printing metal powders. It was just market-ready then, with a limited range of tool steels and Ti. The one major advantage, of course is the ability to make hollow shapes impossible for any other process. I believe Volvo make pump impellors using the system, but I'd be surprised if they've ironed the wrinkles so far yet as to allow printing 7000 series aluminium.

Hideously expensive, of course. But then, so was printing ink when I were a nipper...

[husaberg]

Surely a proper ( modern ) constructed 100 cc water cooled would be the go?

I agree i was more meaning for Robs

Having the original core boxes for that cylinder ( you show in the picture ) would be a big help.

You have the pics in your email somewhere...........

[husaberg]

My mistake, I afraid I'm still a little old school.
In reality I'm sure it could be done with a wood mould making CO2 sand outer. Split the fins and make each one separate and glue together, layer ( fin ) after layer ( to make the wood mould ) paying great attention to surface finish and enough taper to make the mould slide appart with out sticking.
Actualy just get one of those 3D metal printers Frits has.

I have only seen a couple of pics of aircooled cylinder males one for a Devimead A65 jumbo and another for a Older excelsior V twin.
My little musing was to cut open an old MX cylinder and use that to make one and add filler where necessary. using the Sprilia like sand core.

this thread i was following on Pit lane was impressive on its use of technology.
http://www.pit-lane.biz/t3187-50cc-s...light=50cc+ktm