Need help to get my old girl back on the road!

[LoveMyBike]

Fellow bike lovers!

I have a head scratcher of a problem and I am reaching out to my fellow bike enthusiasts to see if anyone has had the same problem or similar who could tell me what is going wrong for me or just to offer me some friendly advice. I have a 1986 Honda NV400SP (D Model) and she runs like a dream, was purchased from an elderly gentleman who was frightened by its speed and wanted it to go to a classic bike lover and I'm that person. 38k on the clock and has always been maintained well and obviously never thrashed. The only thing that wasn't well on the bike was the clutch, the cable was horribly adjusted and was fed the wrong way through the frame etc and it never had enough slack to fully engage so the clutch started slipping at higher revs. Replace the clutch, simple right? Well I thought so but this is where it has turned to custard.

I replaced the friction plates, steel plates, judder seat + spring, pressure plate, springs. Torqued up every nut and bolt using a torque wrench to correct values, and criss crossed when doing up the springs (as you should). I have the adjustment on the cable perfect and it feels great at the lever. I also use "wet clutch" oil in the bike and buy the kind I always have. I am no qualified motorcycle mechanic but I am very mechanically minded.

Now after all of this when I try and get the bike rolling the clutch barely moves the bike and is quite "bitey" at some stages. If I flintstone the bike it will get rolling but it just slips like buggery. It is like it is letting go harshly under load and is generally slipping. Quite jumpy.

I have had everyone I know who has done plenty of clutches before look at my work and they all tell me that it is looking great and can't quite work out why it is misbehaving. I have had the clutch on and off too many times at this point, same result every time.

If anyone out there can help shed some light on this problem it would be greatly appreciated, my old girl has been sitting for months and is longing for a ride. Thank You!

Grant


P.S. The plates that came out were paper thin and smelt completely burnt!

[MSTRS:Me]

Are the 'fingers' in the basket smooth?

[Drew]

Are the 'fingers' in the basket smooth?

This was my first question also.

Where the friction plates poke out and rest on the basket 'fingers', are said fingers pretty straight and smooth?

If the steels weren't able to slide on the drum/hub properly I could see it presenting this way too, so maybe check that too.

Does the clutch actuate on the basket side, or through from the left hand side via push rod? Bent push rod might explain some stuff, but I don't recall having a had a Honda that worked that way.

[LoveMyBike]

Thank you guys for the reply

I did consider the fingers on the basket and was very cheeky and door-knocked a retired bike mechanic in my town and asked him very nicely to inspect the basket and he said it was pretty good but offered to clean it up anyway if I wanted and of course I said yes please. When I picked it up it looked fantastic, it was obvious that he had slowly and carefully smoothed the fingers. Unfortunately for me he is very busy and sadly didn't have any spare time to help me out. So I am happy that the fingers are not the problem.

My clutch is the push rod style clutch as pictured here.



What puzzles me is that with the old worn clutch, it still worked surprisingly well and with simply replacing the serviceable parts it stops working.

How would I test/check my push rod? I cant see it being bent from me replacing the plates, but it is a thought at this point.

Thanks for your help guys

Grant

[HenryDorsetCase]

have you verified that the stack height is the correct height to allow the thing to work? Even comparing it to the old plates might be instructive. The diameter and number of flanges and such could be correct, but maybe it was mislabelled or they sold you an incorrect clutch pack.

is the wee lever free to turn, and straight?

Apart from that, I got nothing.

[MSTRS:Me]

That diagram shows a typical Honda clutch actuator set-up. It is NOT a pushrod, but rather a cam (I think). It is probably way out of adjustment. The described wear on the old clutch, along with the new clutch slipping under load, leads me to think that the actuator needs to be backed off heaps.

[Drew]

That diagram shows a typical Honda clutch actuator set-up. It is NOT a pushrod, but rather a cam (I think). It is probably way out of adjustment. The described wear on the old clutch, along with the new clutch slipping under load, leads me to think that the actuator needs to be backed off heaps.

Isn't the actuator on those like a claw? As it turns, it pulls on the 'T' piece which in turn pulls the pressure plate?

Were any of those things not installed correctly or worn, (or possibly as was suggested, the stack height) symptoms could match what he's experiencing.

Edit. After a closer more careful look at the exploded view...that is the most fucked up Honda-esque clutch design I've ever seen.

So many extra bits to achieve no gain on a conventional system, why do Honda over complicate things?

I have no experience with anything like it to my knowledge sorry, I would print out the exploded view and just make sure I had everything in the right order again.

[LoveMyBike]

Hi guys,

To be quite honest I'm not sure what part is the actuator. It uses a lifter plate and a lifter rod controlled by the cable. Rod pushes in against the lifter plate to loosen the plates (disengage). I have added photos to clarify, my description is pretty shit.



I assembled the clutch exactly like the diagram many times and it just doesn't go.


Thanks again guys for your help, much appreciated.

Grant

[HenryDorsetCase]

things I wonder about:

have you got the big washer behind the plates (don't giggle I have done things like that before).

if it has been misadjusted for a while, could the cam part of the lifter actuator thingy be worn to a point where its profile is different than it should be. perhaps it has worn in its initial take up so the cam is in effect steeper than factory (I think you would need a known good one to compare side by side with to check i.e. ESTT)

[LoveMyBike]

By the "big washer" do you mean the judder seat and spring? I have them inside the "starter" disc.

I am defiantly going to investigate the lifter rod asap.


Grant