Has anyone used Elka rear shocks?

[Robert Taylor]

Very cool looking chassis's man. No shit storm caused as far as I can see mate. Do you have a paticual shock unit in mind to suit the linkage ratio;s you are running on your babies, as you well know that is very important to gain the best for the money you will spend and I can see from your workmanship that you are 100% aware of that. Yes things will fit, but how well they will work is another question.

Shaun is correct, fitting is the relatively easy part. Getting the internal valving of the shock right to match the ''motion ratio'' that the linkage system imparts to it is the tricky part that inevitably takes time and money. Also the spring rate to match both the bike and rider.

No energy to dredge back but are you saying that Elka make a shock specifically to match this chassis and linkage etc? If so and they are as good as their word then go for it BUT very much get a written guarantee. If not then its just another shock that will need valving and springing. That would require the bike to confirm that everything will work as intended, it cannot be done from a distance because it would be little better than guesswork

[mr bucketracer]

Very cool looking chassis's man. No shit storm caused as far as I can see mate. Do you have a paticual shock unit in mind to suit the linkage ratio;s you are running on your babies, as you well know that is very important to gain the best for the money you will spend and I can see from your workmanship that you are 100% aware of that. Yes things will fit, but how well they will work is another question.

most the bikes i have built are all bassed of honda rs 125s(linkage ratio's) @ around 80 -90 kg mark 60-100mm longer , emailed elka and they are happy to set up for the extra weight . don't know if there the go but you never know? not to bad price but more likey 200 more for gst tax to get here . i don't have that much money ' just want to get as much racing in untill my body gives up as i know you know the felling .. cheers

[mr bucketracer]

Shaun is correct, fitting is the relatively easy part. Getting the internal valving of the shock right to match the ''motion ratio'' that the linkage system imparts to it is the tricky part that inevitably takes time and money. Also the spring rate to match both the bike and rider.

No energy to dredge back but are you saying that Elka make a shock specifically to match this chassis and linkage etc? If so and they are as good as their word then go for it BUT very much get a written guarantee. If not then its just another shock that will need valving and springing. That would require the bike to confirm that everything will work as intended, it cannot be done from a distance because it would be little better than guesswork

i know there will be some guesswork in it , i do seem good at riding around alot promblems ( don't know if that the right words ) i know what your saying if something go's wrong who will repair it etc . A lot of thought going into it

[Robert Taylor]

These are some generalised comments from my own long experience:

1) Sponsoring with product that requires trackside optimisation and alternate setting parts ( mainly springs )is a whole load different than say supplying some fine crystal to a charity auction. One is difficult , costly and time consuming, the other is easy

2) Having an inventory of alternate springs is a cost to someone, usually the distributor of the product. Here in NZ we really have done this wrong, we should have many years ago insisted that teams and riders purchased their own spring options. This is neccessary for varying track conditions and alternate tracks, if you are on top of your game. But this also wouldnt have worked because racers being racers they wouldnt purchase all the options they would need and then would grizzle to all and sundry that the suspension wasnt working properly.... for want of springs. Everyone elses fault but their own. Race teams in Europe carry all of their own spring options and spring changers.

3) If we take just the one example of sidecars the said shocks that Shaun is referring to have been very successful on sidecars. But given also that the construction of sidecars can be so individual and variable there is no guarantee that what works on certain chassis in the Northern hemisphere will work straight off here. That is where spring rate options and internal setting parts are locally required. Who then pays for the fuel, labour, accomodation, meals etc ? Just because the cost of such suspension is amount ''X'' that doesnt mean that there is massive margin in the product ( which there most certainly isnt ) to allow for sometimes not insubstanial final optimisation costs.
Given also that there are so few sidecars in NZ what guarantee is there that if you have one set of suspension working very well that you are going to sell a whole load to everyone else? And would the remaining ''prospects ''also insist that these units are also passed on at the same price (no margin), thereby being a continuing and ongoing loss making venture by the reseller?

4) If we take a step back, most of us have day jobs, the companies we either own or work for have to make fair and reasonable margin on product and services to pay the wage bill, all the overheads and to reasonably prosper. Indeed to survive. Why is it that many racers consider that product should either be passed on at very small or no margin or given to them? If that happens it certainly doesnt engender any loyalty if an even fatter Greek comes along bearing even more gifts..............

5) Companies such as Ohlins DO NOT SPONSOR ANYONE, that is a sign of a successful company, as opposed to a few giving product away.

6) You also have to wonder aloud how effective sponsor exposure is in NZ road racing? Arguably though there are people that do it very well in continually plugging way their sponsors in various forms of media. But one shining example is Sloan Frost, also RWR Motorsport.

7) An industry friend of mine is legitimately grizzling at the moment. He has put a LOT of unpaid extra time into helping a successful race team in a related sporting code, but the work he did invoice them for they havent paid him for yet. Its well overdue, so he is feeling rather used and pissed off. Sadly there are some other race teams also stringing him out. That really sucks and my advice to prospective sponsors, look at it long and hard before committing, get legal guarantees and build in penalty fees for beach of contract. Dont get caught up in the emotion and excitement, treat it totally as a business transaction.

[Robert Taylor]

i know there will be some guesswork in it , i do seem good at riding around alot promblems ( don't know if that the right words ) i know what your saying if something go's wrong who will repair it etc . A lot of thought going into it

Ok, I just hope the comments have helped!

[Robert Taylor]

what, you expect something back for giving someone your time, and capital to help them enjoy themselves racing, how dare you !

Thanks Scott, cynical but brutally true!

[Shaun Harris]

[QUOTE=Robert Taylor;1130708291]These are some generalised comments from my own long experience:

1) Sponsoring with product that requires trackside optimisation and alternate setting parts ( mainly springs )is a whole load different than say supplying some fine crystal to a charity auction. One is difficult , costly and time consuming, the other is easy

2) Having an inventory of alternate springs is a cost to someone, usually the distributor of the product. Here in NZ we really have done this wrong, we should have many years ago insisted that teams and riders purchased their own spring options. This is neccessary for varying track conditions and alternate tracks, if you are on top of your game. But this also wouldnt have worked because racers being racers they wouldnt purchase all the options they would need and then would grizzle to all and sundry that the suspension wasnt working properly.... for want of springs. Everyone elses fault but their own. Race teams in Europe carry all of their own spring options and spring changers.




Funny really as it was my offer that bought this post on Robert, and your point No2 above, I will prob be disliked more but O well, " I said exactually that to you years didn;t I haha. I guess there is some kind of a business man in me some where

[nodrog:Me]

............. ouch me eyes hurt............

I was hoping to reply here before you got all dragons Den and created a massive wall of text that would render most of us sick with RSI, obviously I am late.

If you read below and replace the word shocks with hat (ie, something that doesn't require back up or servicing).

So Shaun supplies me some shocks at no financial outlay to himself, and I advertise the IHC all over my sidecar for no financial outlay to Shaun, and thats not a good deal?

Surely you are taking the piss?

Does it seem like anybody is disadvantaged by this agreement? Shaun supplies me with a product, which I pay all costs for (so it costs him nothing), and he gets advertising space on my sidecar. (imagine if he had advertising on the underside of Drew Mairs chair!)

Your argument about backup parts etc is a moot point in this case as I think we all know that Shaun isn't going to have any springs or valves in his lunchbox. And he is far too busy on kiwi biker to be running around the country setting up sidecars.

The offer was to supply some goods, nothing else.

this might help - https://scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/...15500278_n.jpg

[Shaun Harris]

[QUOTE=nodrog; Shaun isn't going to have any springs or valves in his lunchbox. And he is far too busy on kiwi biker to be running around the country setting up sidecars.

and about 10 other sites in between study and you do not get as skinny as me having a lunch box

[nzspokes]

These are some generalised comments from my own long experience:

1) Sponsoring with product that requires trackside optimisation and alternate setting parts ( mainly springs )is a whole load different than say supplying some fine crystal to a charity auction. One is difficult , costly and time consuming, the other is easy

2) Having an inventory of alternate springs is a cost to someone, usually the distributor of the product. Here in NZ we really have done this wrong, we should have many years ago insisted that teams and riders purchased their own spring options. This is neccessary for varying track conditions and alternate tracks, if you are on top of your game. But this also wouldnt have worked because racers being racers they wouldnt purchase all the options they would need and then would grizzle to all and sundry that the suspension wasnt working properly.... for want of springs. Everyone elses fault but their own. Race teams in Europe carry all of their own spring options and spring changers.

3) If we take just the one example of sidecars the said shocks that Shaun is referring to have been very successful on sidecars. But given also that the construction of sidecars can be so individual and variable there is no guarantee that what works on certain chassis in the Northern hemisphere will work straight off here. That is where spring rate options and internal setting parts are locally required. Who then pays for the fuel, labour, accomodation, meals etc ? Just because the cost of such suspension is amount ''X'' that doesnt mean that there is massive margin in the product ( which there most certainly isnt ) to allow for sometimes not insubstanial final optimisation costs.
Given also that there are so few sidecars in NZ what guarantee is there that if you have one set of suspension working very well that you are going to sell a whole load to everyone else? And would the remaining ''prospects ''also insist that these units are also passed on at the same price (no margin), thereby being a continuing and ongoing loss making venture by the reseller?

4) If we take a step back, most of us have day jobs, the companies we either own or work for have to make fair and reasonable margin on product and services to pay the wage bill, all the overheads and to reasonably prosper. Indeed to survive. Why is it that many racers consider that product should either be passed on at very small or no margin or given to them? If that happens it certainly doesnt engender any loyalty if an even fatter Greek comes along bearing even more gifts..............

5) Companies such as Ohlins DO NOT SPONSOR ANYONE, that is a sign of a successful company, as opposed to a few giving product away.

6) You also have to wonder aloud how effective sponsor exposure is in NZ road racing? Arguably though there are people that do it very well in continually plugging way their sponsors in various forms of media. But one shining example is Sloan Frost, also RWR Motorsport.

7) An industry friend of mine is legitimately grizzling at the moment. He has put a LOT of unpaid extra time into helping a successful race team in a related sporting code, but the work he did invoice them for they havent paid him for yet. Its well overdue, so he is feeling rather used and pissed off. Sadly there are some other race teams also stringing him out. That really sucks and my advice to prospective sponsors, look at it long and hard before committing, get legal guarantees and build in penalty fees for beach of contract. Dont get caught up in the emotion and excitement, treat it totally as a business transaction.

This I agree with. I have been involved with sporting sponsorship for many years. It has to be seen as a gift as there is little to no benefit in return even though the competitor thinks them having a sticker on is worth lots of free gear. I daily get requests as "Jonny" is going to be next big thing. He isnt.

[Shaun Harris]

This I agree with. I have been involved with sporting sponsorship for many years. It has to be seen as a gift as there is little to no benefit in return even though the competitor thinks them having a sticker on is worth lots of free gear. I daily get requests as "Jonny" is going to be next big thing. He isnt.

Hello it's Jonny calling. Sponsorship has no real market value in NZ apart from good will PR

[nzspokes]

Hello it's Jonny calling. Sponsorship has no real market value in NZ apart from good will PR

Jonny will often not return gear as per the contract he signed and sell it for his benefit. Its a PR thing only. Dont expect it to be returned in turn over.

[Shaun Harris]

Jonny will often not return gear as per the contract he signed and sell it for his benefit. Its a PR thing only. Dont expect it to be returned in turn over.

Yep I have seen that done here plenty of times. Prize money kept ( When it exsisted) when it was in contracts to hand over to the bike owner


O hell, this has all gotten to negative now for me now, best I go find my meds and a crate of beer

[Robert Taylor]

I was hoping to reply here before you got all dragons Den and created a massive wall of text that would render most of us sick with RSI, obviously I am late.

If you read below and replace the word shocks with hat (ie, something that doesn't require back up or servicing).



Does it seem like anybody is disadvantaged by this agreement? Shaun supplies me with a product, which I pay all costs for (so it costs him nothing), and he gets advertising space on my sidecar. (imagine if he had advertising on the underside of Drew Mairs chair!)

Your argument about backup parts etc is a moot point in this case as I think we all know that Shaun isn't going to have any springs or valves in his lunchbox. And he is far too busy on kiwi biker to be running around the country setting up sidecars.



The offer was to supply some goods, nothing else.

this might help - https://scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/...15500278_n.jpg

So if you were dissatisfied with the delivered settings ( spring rates and valving ) you would then be more than happy to purchase further springs and to pay the going rate to have it revalved? Im struggling to believe you would be as chipper then, even though you would have paid dealer cost for the product. The importance of the availability of after sales availability of setting part options and service ( and costs of thereof ) should never be underestimated plus all of the running around that is associated with it all.


As I eluded to previously its hardly like selling fine china that will just be stored and looked at occassionally. It would be useful if you knew exactly what is involved. And in my own opinion there is no need of anyone to onsell product at no margin. We dont do it for our major customer base ( everyday road riders who dont give a goats arse about road racing, and some car and MX stuff ) Why should it be any different for road racing?

[F5 Dave]

I found a Dyno-Tech sticker the other day and decided I'd put it on my new build. While never actually sponsoring me, Chris was always good to me, so despite the fact the business wound up and he left the country say 15 odd years ago I feel the responsibility to do my bit to repay those free dyno runs.