Give me some tips for riding in the rain!

[Metastable]

1994 by Professor Wilde of kingstone university, canada.

LOL - never heard that university before. Queens University in Kingston.... maybe.

[biketimus_prime]

That's the other lever down by my foot, opposite side to the gear stick isn't it???

I'm actually amazed how many people say they never use the back brake. I use it almost as much as my front... Even on the motorway to brush off some speed I gently apply it and use my front brake for the last bit of braking. Never had an issue stopping but I'm just as comfortable using only my front to stop if needed. I'd just rather have the rear lock out or lose grip than the front, such as when coming to a stop at lights and slipping over oil and other road grime as has happened a few times.

[awayatc]

Thing I remember about riding a 250 was insistent quest to increase speed rather then decrease.....



for what its worth:

Large portions of Merikens apparently only use rearbrake......
Main reason why linked brakes came in existence......

Sounds to me your bike is very light at rear, thats why it locks up so easily....
also means it doesnt do a great job slowing you down much....
with or without locking up...
So just ride, and don't overthink it to much...

[Berries]

I'd just rather have the rear lock out or lose grip than the front, such as when coming to a stop at lights and slipping over oil and other road grime as has happened a few times.

Wow. If you are having to rely on your back brake because you lock the front under non emergency braking then I would suggest you have a problem with either your technique or the bike.

I'm actually amazed how many people say they never use the back brake. I use it almost as much as my front.

Out of interest, how long have you been riding?

[BlackSheepLogic]

I'm just as comfortable using only my front to stop if needed.

Your front brakes account for 80% or more of your bikes brakes, make use of them.

I'd just rather have the rear lock out or lose grip than the front, such as when coming to a stop at lights and slipping over oil and other road grime as has happened a few times.

You need to get more comfortable with using your front brakes under heavy braking situations - practice emergency breaking which is a very good skill to have on a bike.

[Ender EnZed]

I'm actually amazed how many people say they never use the back brake. I use it almost as much as my front... Even on the motorway to brush off some speed I gently apply it and use my front brake for the last bit of braking. Never had an issue stopping but I'm just as comfortable using only my front to stop if needed. I'd just rather have the rear lock out or lose grip than the front, such as when coming to a stop at lights and slipping over oil and other road grime as has happened a few times.

You're not using enough front brake. Have you ever locked it? If so, did you snatch at it? If you think that you locked it after exceeding peak stopping ability then you're imagining things and you need more practice.

For maximum stopping power I rest my toe on the rear brake and devote ~100% of my attention to the front.

[biketimus_prime]

I've been riding since 10th March 2014, so 7 months or so.

I think you guys are coming off with the wrong impression. It's not that I'm uncomfortable using the front or that I don't know how to, it's that I rarely need the huge braking power the front provides when I ride around. The weak back brake stops me just fine when coupled with engine braking with a bit of light front braking, sometimes. I've braked hard enough on the front where the rear wheel has almost come up before but I just never need to brake that hard most of the time. The only time I've had the front slip is when I went over gravel while coming to a stop and another time at the lights where it slipped a bit as I was braking. Not due to me braking suddenly or anything and I just said I'd rather a situation where my rear slipped in that case than the front.

It's only when I do practice braking that hard that I find the rear locks up well before the front and wondered what to do in that situation. Whether to ease off the back or the front.

[Ender EnZed]

I've been riding since 10th March 2014, so 7 months or so.

I think you guys are coming off with the wrong impression. It's not that I'm uncomfortable using the front or that I don't know how to, it's that I rarely need the huge braking power the front provides when I ride around. The weak back brake stops me just fine when coupled with engine braking with a bit of light front braking, sometimes. I've braked hard enough on the front where the rear wheel has almost come up before but I just never need to brake that hard most of the time. The only time I've had the front slip is when I went over gravel while coming to a stop and another time at the lights where it slipped a bit as I was braking. Not due to me braking suddenly or anything and I just said I'd rather a situation where my rear slipped in that case than the front.

It's only when I do practice braking that hard that I find the rear locks up well before the front and wondered what to do in that situation. Whether to ease off the back or the front.

The main point to understand is that the back brake has almost nothing to offer in terms of stopping capacity. The fact that you use it a lot in everyday riding does not in any way contradict this, it just means you don't use much of your available braking capacity.

That's fine, neither do I. I probably use the back as much as the front under 80km/h but I only use it under 15km/h.

I'll say it again: The important point here is that if you want to slow down quickly, use the front brake.

[BlackSheepLogic]

I'll say it again: The important point here is that if you want to slow down quickly, use the front brake.

Ender EnZed, Agree 100% with what you said, but I would like to expand on one of your point a little bit.

biketimus_prime, in a high stress situation how we react is often by reflex, if you generally slow down using the back brake and touch the front brake once in a while it is quite likely when in a stressful situation and need to slow down quickly that you will instinctively hammer the back brake and it may be the last thing you ever do. You also seem from your post to be apprehensive of the front brake and the potential loss of control - this WILL impact your decision under stress.

While Ender EnZed a more experienced rider may only use the back brake at speeds < 15Km/h I'm suggesting for you to train yourself to use both brakes all of the time. This will help your confidence in using the front brake, gain confidence in control of the bike under braking and you will make better decisions under stress. Front slips deal with it if it happens - if you have that level of confidence it won't impact you decision process.

[Ender EnZed]

biketimus_prime, in a high stress situation how we react is often by reflex, if you generally slow down using the back brake and touch the front brake once in a while it is quite likely when in a stressful situation and need to slow down quickly that you will instinctively hammer the back brake and it may be the last thing you ever do. You also seem from your post to be apprehensive of the front brake and the potential loss of control - this WILL impact your decision under stress.

Couldn't agree more. When the shit hits the fan you're going to do the thing you're used to doing. It's wildly unrealistic to think that immediately after a car pulls out on you on your way to work is going to be the point in time that you apply the skills you've read about on the internet.

[biketimus_prime]

I never thought about it as how I'd deal under a high stress situation... I do keep 3 fingers over my brake lever when I lane split etc but I suppose if I always brake with the back brake at other times, It'll impact how I react when I need to brake quick.
I think I am a bit worried about the front brake, yes. I'm actually shit scared of locking up the front and falling off. I have had many RWD cars before bikes and I feel a lot more comfortable with the rear losing grip. This whole front end losing grip is new to me, it's nothing like understeer in a car as such.

I mean I can brake with the front and brake hard and well without locking up HOWEVER whenever I come to fast stop. BUT only if I really tell myself to use it more than the rear.
Otherwise it's always been my rear that locks up. Even the other night I told myself "I will stop before that white line aaaaand now" and braked really hard. I stopped well before the line, surprised myself too, but my rear was wiggling all the way as I came to a stop. I subconsciously apply more rear brake than front. The rear even went out a bit far enough to buck me off and back down, mini highside. Need more practice believing in the front brake I suppose.

[oneofsix]

I never thought about it as how I'd deal under a high stress situation... I do keep 3 fingers over my brake lever when I lane split etc but I suppose if I always brake with the back brake at other times, It'll impact how I react when I need to brake quick.
I think I am a bit worried about the front brake, yes. I'm actually shit scared of locking up the front and falling off. I have had many RWD cars before bikes and I feel a lot more comfortable with the rear losing grip. This whole front end losing grip is new to me, it's nothing like understeer in a car as such.

I mean I can brake with the front and brake hard and well without locking up HOWEVER whenever I come to fast stop. BUT only if I really tell myself to use it more than the rear.
Otherwise it's always been my rear that locks up. Even the other night I told myself "I will stop before that white line aaaaand now" and braked really hard. I stopped well before the line, surprised myself too, but my rear was wiggling all the way as I came to a stop. I subconsciously apply more rear brake than front. The rear even went out a bit far enough to buck me off and back down, mini highside. Need more practice believing in the front brake I suppose.

Sounds like you are starting to get the point. How at least go do one of the ACC sponsored courses and learn a bit more. As the bike stops the weight goes forward, this extra pressure on the front keeps it rotating as it presses into the road. Stop looking down at the white line, you are aren't you? Head up and that rear wheel is more likely to stay in line. Once stopped is the time to check how well you did.

[Ender EnZed]

I think I am a bit worried about the front brake, yes. I'm actually shit scared of locking up the front and falling off.....
Need more practice believing in the front brake I suppose.

Give it some proper practice. i.e. In a car park with trial runs increasing the amount you squeeze focusing on doing it smoothly and progressively until you either lock the front or lift the rear.

Under these kind of conditions, when you're ready for it, locking the front isn't that bad. I'm seen noobs do it for the first time ever several times on a variety of bikes and they didn't bin it. Neither did I. Don't fear it like the devil. I've seen very ordinary bikes lift the rear wheel with the front in a puddle.

Can't say I've tried an 04 GSX250 personally but it's not a cruiser or a big tourer so there's a very high chance that maximum stopping power happens somewhere very much toward if not beyond the point where the back wheel is just slightly off the ground. i.e. 100% on the front tyre.

[Ender EnZed]

Stop looking down at the white line, you are aren't you? Head up and that rear wheel is more likely to stay in line. Once stopped is the time to check how well you did.

That's a good point.

Head up, eyes forward (don't look down), elbows bent and arms tensed enough to react but definitely not rigid. And most of all squeeze that front brake lever like you're juicing a lemon in a small car all over 12 guys worth of fish 'n chips.

[Berries]

I've been riding since 10th March 2014, so 7 months or so.

I guessed as much. Practice/experience is all you need.

It's not that I'm uncomfortable using the front or that I don't know how to, it's that I rarely need the huge braking power the front provides when I ride around.

The huge braking power at the front only comes from how much you squeeze the lever. The only time I need huge braking power is when I have fucked up, the person in front of me has fucked up or I want to enjoy huge braking power by braking late. I very rarely need 'huge' braking power, but the only time I use my back brake is when going down my steep clay drive in the wet, on ice, and when the road looks really dodgy and I think I have overcooked it. And when stopped on a hill.

But then who's to say I am right? I could use the back brake more, but I go back to my pushbike days when the back brake was for wicked skids while the front brake was for actual stopping. If you stop you stop, who is to say which is right or wrong as long as you don't fall off?

I think I am a bit worried about the front brake, yes. I'm actually shit scared of locking up the front and falling off. I have had many RWD cars before bikes and I feel a lot more comfortable with the rear losing grip. This whole front end losing grip is new to me, it's nothing like understeer in a car as such.

Yep, cars can be fun but best not compare them to bikes. Bikes hurt much more and much quicker when you get it wrong.

I mean I can brake with the front and brake hard and well without locking up HOWEVER whenever I come to fast stop. BUT only if I really tell myself to use it more than the rear. Otherwise it's always been my rear that locks up. Even the other night I told myself "I will stop before that white line aaaaand now" and braked really hard. I stopped well before the line, surprised myself too, but my rear was wiggling all the way as I came to a stop. I subconsciously apply more rear brake than front. The rear even went out a bit far enough to buck me off and back down, mini highside. Need more practice believing in the front brake I suppose.

So with 7 months experience, who told you to use the back brake so much? I am not kidding when I say I don't use it on a day to day basis. Simple physics dictates that the front brake is going to be more powerful so why not just concentrate on getting to know how that one works? You might not lose the fear of locking it, but when you know how far you can go you'll be surprised how hard you can brake.

Practice is what you need, that's all. I wouldn't rely too much on KB advice because it is so varied, just get out and ride and put a bit more trust in your front brakes.