Elections are coming up. What are we thinking?

[bogan]

It does speak volumes. People are changing their minds. These are people just like you and me and ocean and oscar and anyone else on here. They're agreeing to do what it takes to get an R.B.E. off the ground. I have no issue with you denying that people are ready for it. They'll learn and things will change. It may take a few years, but people representing R.B.E.'s will crop up all over the country. I don't see it taking long. As long as one is open to the idea of doing what it takes. That democracy has worked is an absolute comfort to me. I'm banking on democracy being instrumental in the ascension, snigger, of R.B.E. parties.

Not too good with numbers are you mashy, <0.01% supporting an idea does not an increasing trend make. What it does say, is the people have spoken, and NOW is not the time for an RBE; perhaps it is because nobody actually has a plausible plan for one that fits the BS you keep spouting. The venus project bloke is on the right track though, you could learn a lot from him; primarily, incentivise productive members of society to join up, rather than try to force them.

[oldrider]

Planet Key .. I reckon that's really good a few contradictions but nothing for Key to worry about ... I bet he wasn't the one who pulled it!

The only bad publicity in politics is "NO" publicity!

[Ocean1]

The allocation of resources is priority one for an R.B.E.

You mean it's priority one for those who manage an rbe.

Whereas it's actually none of their business what resources get allocated to where, that's the prerogative of the resources owners.

[Ocean1]

The venus project bloke is on the right track though, you could learn a lot from him; primarily, incentivise productive members of society to join up, rather than try to force them.

Indeed. All he needs to add is a token of exchange and a means to store value and he'd have a workable system.

[mashman]

Not too good with numbers are you mashy, <0.01% supporting an idea does not an increasing trend make. What it does say, is the people have spoken, and NOW is not the time for an RBE; perhaps it is because nobody actually has a plausible plan for one that fits the BS you keep spouting. The venus project bloke is on the right track though, you could learn a lot from him; primarily, incentivise productive members of society to join up, rather than try to force them.

It's more than there were at the start of the year. Know of any other political party growing at that rate? It only says that the people have spoken once every single one of them has been asked. Who's going to force who? I think one thing Mr Fresco (I have huge respect for the man and his works) doesn't understand, or you have incorrectly translated (my hunch given *), is that if a person decides to vote for a political party that is formed on the principles of an R.B.E., then that person will already be incentivesed. I don't know where the idea of there needing to be coercion has come from... coz it sure don't sound like no thinking that Mr Fresco would have made.

“Democracy is a con game, it is a word invented to outplay people, to make them accept a given institution. All institutions sing ‘we are free’. The minute you hear ‘freedom’ or ‘democracy’ – watch out, because in a truly free nation, no one has to tell you that you’re free,”. I am incentivised.

[mashman]

You mean it's priority one for those who manage an rbe.

Whereas it's actually none of their business what resources get allocated to where, that's the prerogative of the resources owners.

It's currently up to politicians. Your call man. As much as you may not understand just how sincerely this is meant, I would happily see you as one of those who manage those resources.

It's money to them who hold it. Resource holders will be paid what they are currently being paid in "my" R.B.E. scenario.

[bogan]

It's more than there were at the start of the year. Know of any other political party growing at that rate? It only says that the people have spoken once every single one of them has been asked. Who's going to force who? I think one thing Mr Fresco (I have huge respect for the man and his works) doesn't understand, or you have incorrectly translated (my hunch given *), is that if a person decides to vote for a political party that is formed on the principles of an R.B.E., then that person will already be incentivesed. I don't know where the idea of there needing to be coercion has come from... coz it sure don't sound like no thinking that Mr Fresco would have made.

“Democracy is a con game, it is a word invented to outplay people, to make them accept a given institution. All institutions sing ‘we are free’. The minute you hear ‘freedom’ or ‘democracy’ – watch out, because in a truly free nation, no one has to tell you that you’re free,”. I am incentivised.

Yup, mana/internet didn't get any votes last time around either, and they are actually on the ballot too. Like I said, the incumbents have more to worry about from the fat german and his rascist mate.

So, if nobody is forced and voting is the incentivisation, then you are not going for a majority, but a 100% poll result. 0.01% is a long way from that, linear extrapolation gives us 10,000 years to go; good luck with that
That is exactly my point, you seek to force guys like me and ocean to go along with this rubbish if it gets voted through, Mr Fresco takes more of a commune style approach, join us if you like, and prosper within. So how about you fuck right off to a commune and see put you 'money' where you mouth is; see how it actually goes.

There is less freedom in an RBE as the producers do not decide where their produce goes, the consumers do not decide what they can consume.

[mashman]

Yup, mana/internet didn't get any votes last time around either, and they are actually on the ballot too. Like I said, the incumbents have more to worry about from the fat german and his rascist mate.

So, if nobody is forced and voting is the incentivisation, then you are not going for a majority, but a 100% poll result. 0.01% is a long way from that, linear extrapolation gives us 10,000 years to go; good luck with that
That is exactly my point, you seek to force guys like me and ocean to go along with this rubbish if it gets voted through, Mr Fresco takes more of a commune style approach, join us if you like, and prosper within. So how about you fuck right off to a commune and see put you 'money' where you mouth is; see how it actually goes.

There is less freedom in an RBE as the producers do not decide where their produce goes, the consumers do not decide what they can consume.

I disagree on too many levels.

[Ocean1]

It's currently up to politicians. Your call man. As much as you may not understand just how sincerely this is meant, I would happily see you as one of those who manage those resources.

It's money to them who hold it. Resource holders will be paid what they are currently being paid in "my" R.B.E. scenario.

It's not up to politicians, it's up to resource owners, and I already manage those resources I own, that's what owning them means. Anyone else attempting to manage an asset is simply a thief.

And if the owners want to value it monetarily, or in crayfish or gumboots that's also their business. Not yours. Not mine.

History isn't very kind to govts that have nationalised privately held assets. And at that it's a fucking sight kinder than I'd be.

[mashman]

It's not up to politicians, it's up to resource owners, and I already manage those resources I own, that's what owning them means. Anyone else attempting to manage an asset is simply a thief.

And if the owners want to value it monetarily, or in crayfish or gumboots that's also their business. Not yours. Not mine.

History isn't very kind to govts that have nationalised privately held assets. And at that it's a fucking sight kinder than I'd be.

What are you so afraid of losing?

Yup, only when they're a majority.

Privatised? Nah, quite the opposite.

[yokel]

How about some solutions people?

if I was king for a day I'd make anyone reviving assistance from the government to not be eligible to vote due to their bias and their whats in it for me bullshit

oh yeah and add woman on to the not eligible list to haha

[Woodman]

Mashman, your system won't work because we have too much invested in the current one. Who will pay the overseas debt when your system starts? and with what?.

Its too late, move on.

[bogan]

I disagree on too many levels.

And just as the 99.99% disagree with you, democracy works.

Was beginning to lose faith in it a bit given the current crop of political candidates, but since you've explained just how much worse it could be, my faith is mostly restored

[Brian d marge]

Mashman, your system won't work because we have too much invested in the current one. Who will pay the overseas debt when your system starts? and with what?.

Its too late, move on.

watch what happens to Iceland when ya shaft * the man*

My guess it may make yr eyes sting

Stephen

[mashman]

Mashman, your system won't work because we have too much invested in the current one. Who will pay the overseas debt when your system starts? and with what?.

Its too late, move on.

It's not mine. I agree, we do have a lot invested in the current economy. That does not need to change, and won't overnight. Just about everything will have to stay the same for some time, you can't just flip a switch and I would say that until a vote of 75% is pulled at the ballot, that an R.B.E. should be postponed. If human activity isn't limited by financial constraint, what can't be done (i.e. 100 nurses currently unemployed can go straight to work). The valuation of that human activity is remunerated as a salary. Dividing the salary of every nurse to meet the total budget spend for the year is as easy as saying, diving the total number of nurses by the total budget. You have 100 more nurses and all you needed to do was adjust the salaries. In an R.B.E. that would not be a problem, no one would have access to any less than they currently do (food, water, house, sewerage, farfming, technological advancement, less crime, blah blah blah). Using the system against itself would be a piece of piss for economists.

It has been my choice to accept an R.B.E. as a better solution than any of the options put forwards to date. That choice has been made by many other people. It's just the beginning.