Key Government out on its own. No one else to blame!

[blue rider]

Shipley was NZ's first female prime minister and she was just as elected as Helen Clark ... the party not the electorate votes the leader in and the leader becomes PM.

All that bullshit about Helen Clark being our first "elected" PM is just that ... Bullshit!

you missed my point.

my point was that before Helen Clark there was Jenny Shipley. And yes all national Party Leaders are established by the Party, however some People have voted for either a. National or b. Labour and the corresponding head of the party gets to play Dear Leader.

Now again, was Jenny Shipley so bad that Helen Clark was the only option, or was Helen Clark just a different Vagina that Kiwis got to vote for cause there was a lack of penises?

Everyone likes to whinge about Helen Clark the wicked witch, how come that no one ever mentiones Jenny Shipley who was Dear Leader before Helen Clark became Dear Leader.

Essentially why does National whinge so much?

[blue rider]

I know I know its all humbug and debatable sicience if there is any science involved at all....and hey there used to be dinosours and jesus had a pet T-rex.


http://www.actionstation.org.nz/climate

[Ocean1]

Everyone likes to whinge about Helen Clark the wicked witch, how come that no one ever mentiones Jenny Shipley who was Dear Leader before Helen Clark became Dear Leader.

Essentially why does National whinge so much?

'Cause, essentially, Clarke was responsible for spending her way out of the highest income years NZ had seen for decades.

And left nothing but a bad taste.


So, your typical socialist.

[Brian d marge]

im begining to think that when policies are rammed through and not changed or reversed by the next grubbyment . . . the policy was on an agenda

for example asset sales , not working out to well
. . but not one grubby has said we will take back those assets

dont go down the kiwi rail route . . . dont go there girlfriend . ,

[blue rider]

'Cause, essentially, Clarke was responsible for spending her way out of the highest income years NZ had seen for decades.

And left nothing but a bad taste.


So, your typical socialist.

and why did Jenny Shipley not get voted back in or any other National MP? Care to give me an answer to that?

I came to the country when she was PM, but left a few month later to work for Nike in Holland, and when I came back t'was Helen.

And I am sorry mate, if you consider Helen Clark a socialist, i must assume that you have never met one.

But hey....she must be NZ Socialist, cause clearly she gave to the poor, and kept NZ out of the War, and enticed Hollywood to come and do a few movies...and the likes. And yes, the debt, the huge huge debt. I know.

Lucky for you you got to vote for National the last three times, cause they only give to themselves, are going to send NZ to a lost war, took rights away from workers for the film industry and, cut off all the poor buggers for being lazy fucks - even the old, infirm and to young to work - I know priorities. And how is that surplus coming along, that National was going to produce? Oh...yeah, dropping milk prices, dropping NZ dollar, high unemployment - but hey 0 hour work contracts......You must have a permanent National Woody.

[mada]

im begining to think that when policies are rammed through and not changed or reversed by the next grubbyment . . . the policy was on an agenda

for example asset sales , not working out to well
. . but not one grubby has said we will take back those assets

dont go down the kiwi rail route . . . dont go there girlfriend . ,

There's no money to buy them back is mainly the reason why. We'd be having to pay anywhere from double to triple what we sold them for to get them back, given their share price increase, loss of profits, and the free fucking shares Bill and John gave away.

In regards to the earlier comment about reversing Helen Clarkes stuff, I'm sure the extreme right would like to see reversal of interest Free Student Loans, WFF, etc, but I'm not quite sure they would like to see the poverty, crime, and riots that would accompany it - which is why John Key hasn't reversed them, despite being against the policies - and don't kid yourself that he does it for votes, because the bulk of Nats votes comes from the Baby Boomer block who just want their handout pensions. WFF is essentially a subsidy for NZ employers, because the wages in this country are to low, then again its now employers fault that house prices inflated soo much that wages didn't keep up - that's the fault of the bright fuckers who made reforms in the 90s which made property investment worthwhile.

[mada]

Labour didn't have to rebuild Chch or deal with the "GFC" however.

Chch hasn't actually been a cause of much government debt, as most of the money came out of insurance. CHCH rebuild is arguably the main reason why our GDP is remaining positive, without it growth in our economy would be tiny - so you can hardly use it as an excuse for the billions and billions borrowed.

The funny thing about GFC is that it was caused by policies that National are proponents of - less regulation around finance, property investment etc. etc. Arguably if Labour had been more "socialist" and regulated these sectors tighter in NZ, our blows from the GFC would have been smaller.

All of the problems that caused the GFC haven't been rectified either, instead the banks globally were bailed out and in NZ the practice of inflated property investments continues.

If anything the real GFC has yet to occur, and will come when China's economy blows over

[husaberg]

'Cause, essentially, Clarke was responsible for spending her way out of the highest income years NZ had seen for decades.

And left nothing but a bad taste.
So, your typical socialist.

Helen and the labour party were at the time vilified by Don Brash bill English and the national party for not cutting tax's.
they ran budget surplus's on the most part.
National the whole time they have been in government have borrowed and borrowed more and more money they have sold off assets.
Only a few in NZ re currently doing any good, slash that. A few are making out like bandits............

[mada]

'Cause, essentially, Clarke was responsible for spending her way out of the highest income years NZ had seen for decades.

And left nothing but a bad taste.


So, your typical socialist.

Clarke did nothing to reign in the inflated property market, they did nothing to discourage poor investment into property and came up with poor guarantees for finance companies and banks which encouraged them to undertake even greater risks.

They also secured NZ an FTA with China removing tarrifs off many imports, and making it easier for exports to China, before any other Western country.

Hardly the hall marks of a socialist government.

[oldrider]

Helen was the first to win an election, the poeple of NZ knowingly voted in a party with her as leader, not foisted on the
population by 40 or so mp,s, big difference

Get a grip the unions just voted in the Labour party leader and if they get appointed next time he will be prime minister!

Fuck all of the electorate will vote for him as Prime Minister!

At the end of an MMP election all we do is give them permission to select a government from among themselves ... it's a lucky dip!

Helen Clark was never voted in or elected as Prime Minister by the electorate!

[Ocean1]

and why did Jenny Shipley not get voted back in or any other National MP? Care to give me an answer to that?

I came to the country when she was PM, but left a few month later to work for Nike in Holland, and when I came back t'was Helen.

And I am sorry mate, if you consider Helen Clark a socialist, i must assume that you have never met one.

But hey....she must be NZ Socialist, cause clearly she gave to the poor, and kept NZ out of the War, and enticed Hollywood to come and do a few movies...and the likes. And yes, the debt, the huge huge debt. I know.

Lucky for you you got to vote for National the last three times, cause they only give to themselves, are going to send NZ to a lost war, took rights away from workers for the film industry and, cut off all the poor buggers for being lazy fucks - even the old, infirm and to young to work - I know priorities. And how is that surplus coming along, that National was going to produce? Oh...yeah, dropping milk prices, dropping NZ dollar, high unemployment - but hey 0 hour work contracts......You must have a permanent National Woody.

Listen love, it's this simple: governments don't produce surpluses, industry does. And the more you can do to encourage them the more tax they'll pay.

So any socialist leaning govt, (red flavoured union based or blue flavoured) hyper-focused on where they want to spend money and completely oblivious as to where it comes from is always going to create nothing but poverty all round in the long run.

Want a better standard of living for everyone, including your "poor"? Then get the fuck out of the way and let your industrial democracy do it's job.

All clear?

[Brian d marge]

Clarke did nothing to reign in the inflated property market, they did nothing to discourage poor investment into property and came up with poor guarantees for finance companies and banks which encouraged them to undertake even greater risks.

They also secured NZ an FTA with China removing tarrifs off many imports, and making it easier for exports to China, before any other Western country.

Hardly the hall marks of a socialist government.

Which has me wondering that they were " encouraged" to do so by an outside entity .....

I mean , RBNZ , sticks in wheeler whose boss was wolfowitz , the world bank war mongering arsehole

lotta smoke coming from that there fire ........

Stephen

[Ocean1]

Clarke did nothing to reign in the inflated property market, they did nothing to discourage poor investment into property and came up with poor guarantees for finance companies and banks which encouraged them to undertake even greater risks.

They also secured NZ an FTA with China removing tarrifs off many imports, and making it easier for exports to China, before any other Western country.

Hardly the hall marks of a socialist government.

Perhaps she wasn't quite as pathetic as to pretend that govt has any remit, mechanism or reason to mess with the housing market. As for finance companies? What makes you think it's any of govt's or your business to dictate what other people do with their money?

She was as far left as it's possible to get in a democracy and survive an election.

[Ocean1]

Helen and the labour party were at the time vilified by Don Brash bill English and the national party for not cutting tax's.
they ran budget surplus's on the most part.
National the whole time they have been in government have borrowed and borrowed more and more money they have sold off assets.
Only a few in NZ re currently doing any good, slash that. A few are making out like bandits............

Now show us the revenue from which those govts produced those returns.

Labour blew fucking huge surpluses for years, and when they finally got arseholed National inherited the bad times.

They could have borrowed less, I think they should have. But they tread a fine line between stimulating the economy and committing future taxpayers to loan repayments. Are you qualified to comment on the costs./benefits of any particular point on that continuum? And could you bear the whining from the "oh noes, austerity measures" crowd if they'd borrowed less?

Some may be, again there's a balance to be attempted there, between off shore investment and tax liability. I'd like some changes, there.

[blue rider]

Rejoice humble peeps of NZ, Dear Leader has found something else to sell

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=10836045