New Zealand. What a back water shit hole.

[Paul in NZ]

Possibly any country that Europeans invaded disadvantaged the existing population.

Its too late to turn the clock back and probably would have been worse if the Dutch or French got a foothold.

The Irish suffered from years of British rule and were treated badly and sent to Prison colonies, seem to have done ok since

they left.

Jeeze you guys need to read some history of NZ. The pre treaty ear is really interesting and its not at all like you probably learnt at school.

The potted history…

The earliest people arrived with ocean going technology and very quickly discovered everything worth knowing about the assets and positions of valuable resources like seal colonies, minerals, sea food and moa etc. After a few hundred years the open ocean tech was largely lost and trips back to the homeland stopped. Voyaging became a coastal thing but very seldom did any one place have enough resources for everything so coastal voyaging, overland trips and multiple residences became the norm. Moriori are not overly different but there were always war like tribes and peaceful ones. Ie eaters and the eaten…

The first permanent European residents here were driven by greed or god.

Maori encouraged settlement because they valued education and trade. It was the only way they could get European goods. Local chiefs actively competed to collect bigger and better European settlements and sponsored schools etc.

Once the population got to a certain size it became ‘difficult’ so structure was needed (or so it was said) but the Colonial office was not at all keen on NZ simply because of the logistics involved. It was sold to them with the idea that the local Maori would be exploited so there was a mix now of greed, go and concern. Then the French showed interest and they were not having that thank you – hence the dreadful rush and the ongoing issues…

Once we had a colonial government – oh dear things started going really badly for Maori as the commerce (plunder) people got really well organised and obtained an army…

[Crasherfromwayback]

Once we had a colonial government – oh dear things started going really badly for Maori as the commerce (plunder) people got really well organised and obtained an army…

Think you're wasting your time mate. It's obvious why Maori make up the numbers they do in prisons. The have brown skin. All people with brown skin are bad people and far more likely to break the law.

Well, that's the fucking simpletons version they love.

[mashman]

Think you're wasting your time mate. It's obvious why Maori make up the numbers they do in prisons. The have brown skin. All people with brown skin are bad people and far more likely to break the law.

Well, that's the fucking simpletons version they love.

Similar to Oz, the US it seems. Mind you, it's never as black and white as that... even when it is.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Similar to Oz, the US it seems. Mind you, it's never as black and white as that... even when it is.

Practically any country the honkies colonized. Odd that.

[TheDemonLord]

Think you're wasting your time mate. It's obvious why Maori make up the numbers they do in prisons. The have brown skin. All people with brown skin are bad people and far more likely to break the law.

Well, that's the fucking simpletons version they love.

There's a bit of data that suggests certain character attributes that are valuable in a tribal society and that appear to have a Genetic component - don't translate well into larger village/city living.

And as a thought experiment - imagine if you had 2 groups of people:

1 group had spent the better part of 1,500 years living in large(ish) communities that aren't tribal in nature and weren't closely related familial groups
1 group had spent only 200-300 years living in the same conditions.

Which group do you think might have more trouble living in large villages/towns/cities?

[Crasherfromwayback]

There's a bit of data that suggests certain character attributes that are valuable in a tribal society and that appear to have a Genetic component - don't translate well into larger village/city living.

Esp if you add alcohol. Hardly their fault though is it?

[TheDemonLord]

Esp if you add alcohol.

Definitely.

Hardly their fault though is it?

There is the conundrum - let's assume it's a genetic predisposition:

Does it absolve them of responsibility for committing crime?
Do we have different sentancing, taking into account a persons Genetic Makeup (cause that's not the epitome of Racist)
Do we merely wait for Evolution to take it's slow and Glacial course?
Do we need to raise Ethnic children differently to give them tools to deal with this predisposition (cause that worked so well for the Stolen Generation in Australia)

Point is - it's a massive Can of Worms, no matter which way you slice it. And as far as I can tell, there are no good solutions.

I'd even go so far as to say that all of them are equally Shit.

[jasonu]

3 1/2 years and a strong message. What a joke!!!
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=12011269

[eldog]

Think you're wasting your time mate. It's obvious why Maori make up the numbers they do in prisons.

Time for change or are we wasting our time and need a more permanent solution.

need to intervene before crime. Take control and Stop the stereotype themselves.

Idle hands and minds, lack of resources or want to do stuff.

easier to do crime and act like a gangster than be like us simpletons.

too many areas in NZ with lack of non criminal activity to improve ones lot.

[Akzle]

You been a naughty boy again? I see we can't add rep to you...

yes, and al me posts are on moderation. which seems like more of a punishment for the mods that still have to read through everything i type, whether it makes it to your screen or not.
and this time it's not even c*ssina related.
well.Maybe it is. they're all related down that way.

[Akzle]

There's a bit of data that suggests certain character attributes that are valuable in a tribal society and that appear to have a Genetic component - don't translate well into larger village/city living.

And as a thought experiment - imagine if you had 2 groups of people:

1 group had spent the better part of 1,500 years living in large(ish) communities that aren't tribal in nature and weren't closely related familial groups
1 group had spent only 200-300 years living in the same conditions.

Which group do you think might have more trouble living in large villages/towns/cities?

a) it's perfectly anyone's choice to live in a city.
(except the dole office pays higher if you live in town, so the government would appear to encourage poor people to live in slum areas of the nearest town)
b)watch two flocks of women approach each other at a shopping mall, and tell me it's not tribal in nature.
or anywhere, really. (anti)social cliques persist. you stay se to your own for a sense of security.

[slofox]

whitey (after the fashion of the romans) assimilated other cultures.
whitey itself, really has no "culture" (except, perhaps, rape and pillage and holy grails) (and fucken dickheads on the internet)
arabic decimal, i've been given to understand (and never bothered to learn) is base 7.Metric suffers base 10. we really should be duodecimal by now but the gregorian pope wasnt too happy about progress. but hey. at least we're not US and trying to make the world in binary (base 2)

I taught 7 year olds maths using a multibase approach. Maths was the most popular subject in my classroom...

[TheDemonLord]

b)watch two flocks of women approach each other at a shopping mall, and tell me it's not tribal in nature.
or anywhere, really. (anti)social cliques persist. you stay se to your own for a sense of security.

Good point - I 100% agree we have tribalistic hangovers - a good example is Football Hooliganism - it's modern day tribal Warfare. Hell, I think you could reasonably argue that ALL sport is a derivative of Tribal Combat - in the same way that Jerking off is a derivative of Sex.

There's other examples I can think of - religious denominations is another great one.

For me the question is - how well can we control them?

[Crasherfromwayback]

Time for change or are we wasting our time and need a more permanent solution.

.

Agree 100% with that. As for the rest of your post...not so much.

[eldog]

Agree 100% with that. As for the rest of your post...not so much.

I didn’t expect anyone to agree with me. Far too many people afraid to speak up about the cotton wool applied to people who run rampant with others hard earnt possessions.
true prison would reform most people, there is also a good portion of people who rely on the system to provide a living whether it be on a benefit, prison, criminal activity etc. to have a good time at the expense of others.

Last weekend past thru Kaikohe, a car had driven off the main road and a couple of locals where stripping it by the looks. A few more local kids tried to intimidate the people around them. Cutting in front of cars on their pushies. My rellies lived in this area and I think held in good respect. Myself I will only go back for the road and petrol. Pity really.

cant please everyone at that time of the morning when you haven’t had much sleep for a few weeks and lots of things weighing on you mind.