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Thread: Oddball engines and prototypes

  1. #1186
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    Quote Originally Posted by pete376403 View Post
    When an engine may only last a few hours before the plane is shot down, is it worth the effort to make parts to such fine tolerances?
    That's like saying don't worry about the engine because a bucket race only lasts about quarter of an hour!
    Those guy's lives were at stake and the engines needed to be performing as near perfectly as possible - they didn't all get shot down and as far as they were concerned they weren't going to be!!
    Strokers Galore!

  2. #1187
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    That's like saying don't worry about the engine because a bucket race only lasts about quarter of an hour!
    Those guy's lives were at stake and the engines needed to be performing as near perfectly as possible - they didn't all get shot down and as far as they were concerned they weren't going to be!!
    I am a bit more callous as it took much longer and was much more expensive to train a pilot than build a decent engine.
    Zee Germans took this philosophy too far though. As it didn't matter if their tanks were twice as good as the Russians or the Americans, if the Russians or the Americans built 20X as many tanks.
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  3. #1188
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    Quote Originally Posted by pete376403 View Post
    When an engine may only last a few hours before the plane is shot down, is it worth the effort to make parts to such fine tolerances?
    Yes it was, Pete. It's a bit like the two men who planned a foot safari through lion country, and one of them started looking for the best running shoes.
    His mate sneered: "Do you think you can outrun a lion with those?" The answer was: "I don't need to; I only need to outrun you!"

    But yes, the Germans tended to overdo it with their war tolerances. They can't help themselves; it's in their nature. And I can tell you that it makes a lot of difference,
    whether you do R&D in Germany or in Italy! There's a saying that in heaven you deal with German engineers and Italian Chefs, and in hell it's the other way around .

  4. #1189
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    I think Kevin Cameron mentioned in passing in one of his columns that the Allies made so many of the big radial P&W engines that they probably could have just dropped them instead of making bombs, and in any event it wasn't uncommon for those that returned to have blank spots on the engines where cylinders had blown off in flight to rain down on the countryside below.

    I recently watched a series on warbird restoration that was shot in England and several times they remarked how North American and the other US manufacturers were known for keeping tolerances close enough that it was possible to unbolt a wing or other major part from one plane and bolt it up on another one without any fussing with the fit. I gathered that may not have been quite the case with the English planes.

    cheers,
    Michael

  5. #1190
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    I have an old friend who is now the chief engineer at the Alpine Fighter Collection here in NZ. Don't see him now as he's basically given up bikes. However talking to him about some of the problems encountered doing the restorations was an eye opener. Marks of Spitfire ? They're ALL different....The Russian fighters - of which they have a number - hand built. American ? Just like repairing a car, pull off a wing, bolt another on, no problems.

    Talking WW2, my father had a story...In charge of transport on Crete, when it became apparent that surrender was imminent, gave the order to destroy the trucks and supervised it too. Drained oil and water, drove them to spots that would block any landing zones and revved shit out of them till they seized solid.

    About a week later, after capture and his wounds sorted enough to move him, he was driven to the ship to go to POW camp - in one of his destroyed Bedfords. Apparently it smoked badly and made some ominous noises - but ran.
    They'd been run on a form of synthetic oil supplied from the UK - and they'd been told the trucks wouldn't need any oil changes for as long as they had them.
    He was impressed. Post war in London sitting the last section of his AMIMechE, he asked about the oil. Couldn't be told, still secret.

  6. #1191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Moore View Post
    ....... so I gathered that may not have been quite the case with the English planes.
    cheers,
    Michael
    Michael - British planes! - In the modern UK, the English are English (and considered British), but being British does not not necessarily mean you are English!
    Then, just about everyone else makes that mistake as well (including the Germans) so what the hell!

    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    Marks of Spitfire ? They're ALL different....The Russian fighters - of which they have a number - hand built. American ? Just like repairing a car, pull off a wing, bolt another on, no problems.

    ...............They'd been run on a form of synthetic oil supplied from the UK - and they'd been told the trucks wouldn't need any oil changes for as long as they had them.
    He was impressed. Post war in London sitting the last section of his AMIMechE, he asked about the oil. Couldn't be told, still secret.
    Yes the Americans got it sussed ok and probably all thanks to Henry Ford and others too!

    Don't think that lubricant would be on the secret list now, bet some of the big oil companies have got it by now.
    Strokers Galore!

  7. #1192
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    Speaking of Planes.

    Here is a link to a pretty cool book on aircraft engines, printed back in 1917. (Only 100 yrs. ago)

    http://www.ajhw.co.uk/books/book61/book61.html

    It is amazing how much engine technology had already been pretty highly developed in the years since the Wright bros. flight in 1903.
    (The 2 strokes needed some more work, but. )

    A lot of the development didn't get into American car engines 'til nearly the end of the century.

    Some sections have been censored, due to the US entry to WW1.

    If you like Historical oddball engines it's worth a look.

    Cheers, Daryl.

  8. #1193
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    The pre war two strokes were interesting as well. Below is a NACA tech report on some of the possibilities the Germans were considering.

    lohring Miller

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	naca-tm-776 Types Of Two Stroke Engines.pdf 
Views:	74 
Size:	1.86 MB 
ID:	328277

  9. #1194
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    Tilter

    Just to kickstart this sluggish thread again!

    Note: Even though I didn't reply to, or acknowledge them, I did find the last two posts very interesting.

    These video clips are probably quite old but I admire this Aussie guy's enthusiasm - his design obviously works very well and I'm sure KEN in particular would be interested!
    I am interested because it no doubt feels like a bike - If I rode a two wheeler and fell off, it would be curtains for me, such is my fragile physical state. so I would like to try something like this, I think that would definitely be the machine for me!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KBJOYkMob0
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY3HthkejoI
    Strokers Galore!

  10. #1195
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    Just to kickstart this sluggish thread again!

    Note: Even though I didn't reply to, or acknowledge them, I did find the last two posts very interesting.

    These video clips are probably quite old but I admire this Aussie guy's enthusiasm - his design obviously works very well and I'm sure KEN in particular would be interested!
    I am interested because it no doubt feels like a bike - If I rode a two wheeler and fell off, it would be curtains for me, such is my fragile physical state. so I would like to try something like this, I think that would definitely be the machine for me!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KBJOYkMob0
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY3HthkejoI
    Well, here's a coincidence, just minutes before your post, I was watching this video on youtube about "Honda Riding Assist" which stops the bike from falling over!

    https://youtu.be/zY1l6FdNgfA

  11. #1196
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    https://translate.google.com/transla...-text=&act=url

    I have posted a video of this engine before.
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  12. #1197
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    Some very interesting stuff ( ie in the last few posts) -
    I don't think the Honda balancing act would save me if I threw a leg over a two wheeler though - I could still fall off!

    Also a very interesting Yamaha V4. The guy doesn't even claim to be an engineer but I would say that he is now! - I wonder if someone has translated it into better English yet? it's reasonably easy to get the gist of what he's saying though.
    Strokers Galore!

  13. #1198
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    Some very interesting stuff ( ie in the last few posts) -
    I don't think the Honda balancing act would save me if I threw a leg over a two wheeler though - I could still fall off!

    Also a very interesting Yamaha V4. The guy doesn't even claim to be an engineer but I would say that he is now! - I wonder if someone has translated it into better English yet? it's reasonably easy to get the gist of what he's saying though.
    here is the video it also covers someone elses Honda CB250R 4's turned 5's plus 3'sand a homemade MV
    EDit Actually the Yamaha v4 is a different engine from a different more froggy person as well.


    http://motoreduetempi.blogspot.co.nz...1_archive.html
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  14. #1199
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    Quote Originally Posted by husaberg View Post
    here is the video it also covers someone elses Honda CB250R 4's turned 5's plus 3'sand a homemade MV
    EDit Actually the Yamaha v4 is a different engine from a different more froggy person as well.


    http://motoreduetempi.blogspot.co.nz...1_archive.html
    Weird things happening here again - I'm just getting blank pictures (might be just videos of course) but it's annoying me!
    Probably is only on my computer but just on this site.
    Maybe I pressed a wrong button again somewhere! - can anybody give me a clue?, - I'm clueless! -

    Your last video clip, (the one above) just shows up as a black screen! and it's the last of a lot of "no show" videos.
    Strokers Galore!

  15. #1200
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    Weird things happening here again - I'm just getting blank pictures (might be just videos of course) but it's annoying me!
    Probably is only on my computer but just on this site.
    Maybe I pressed a wrong button again somewhere! - can anybody give me a clue?, - I'm clueless! -

    Your last video clip, (the one above) just shows up as a black screen! and it's the last of a lot of "no show" videos.
    It was working earlier, however seems to have a problem with youtube now!

    Update - working again!

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