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Thread: Oddball engines and prototypes

  1. #3061
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilDun View Post
    KATINAS,
    In the photos of your "Ryger" type engine (which I seem to have lost), the 'crosshead?/gudgeon pin holder'? appears to be retained by being threaded into the narrow part of the piston?
    Am I correct?
    Will to see any picture a user has posted click on their user name and view attachments by user
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  2. #3062
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    WilDun, alloy part with piston pin is threaded into the steel tube. Tube wall thickness 1.3 mm.
    All this complicated piston construction, with small fixing bolt inside, is designed only to make engine as compact as possible, but at the same time maintaining a longer thrust for smaller piston part at TDC (28 mm in my case ) and not to let piston pin hole to clash with lower cylinder seal as masked gudgeon pin is higher than seal at TDC.
    So with 50.6 mm stroke, the minimum height of additional plate under the cylinder, that I could do, was 20 mm.
    But after every test threaded part little lose, so it s not a good solution. Maybe longer height of that threaded small part could help, but fixing still needed.
    Perhaps better chose solid piston with thin steel liner (I even already have it made from a tractor piston pin 38 mm dia. x 0.9 mm thick) and open hole for piston pin from one side, with normal circlip. Of course this add another 8-10 mm to plate so cylinder must be rise from 20 mm to 30 mm.
    On Ryger pistons they use special key for pin from one side, but they still must use two bolts to fix it. Narrower part of Ryger piston was coated.

  3. #3063
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    10th February 2005 - 20:25
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    Quote Originally Posted by katinas View Post
    WilDun, alloy part with piston pin is threaded into the steel tube. ..................

    On Ryger pistons they use special key for pin from one side, but they still must use two bolts to fix it. Narrower part of Ryger piston was coated.
    Tapered thread? ..... or threads with slightly different pitch?

    ...............................................

    Thanks HUSA, - why the hell didn't I think of that??
    Strokers Galore!

  4. #3064
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    The biggest downside of threaded joint, is that after two or three heat cycles, thread tightening between steel and aluminium changed, but piston exhaust side skirt must be fixed always at the same position. Higher accurate could be with bigger thread pitch, but this add more weight and less space.
    But yes, tapered thread with side fixing screw, could be a good option without too much complications and helps to save 10 mm in height. Thanks WilDun.

    Not in theme. I hadn’t been interested in things like torpedoes at all before, but I found this. Four con rods on one crank pin.
    And good example of scaled "Rounded piston theme" with sharp edge at C, although the purpose is different

    https://hmvf.co.uk/topic/39632-8-cyl...e-restoration/
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  5. #3065
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    Quote Originally Posted by katinas View Post
    The biggest downside of threaded joint, is that after two or three heat cycles, thread tightening between steel and aluminium changed,.......................................... .................................................. ........
    I was thinking since I suggested that as a solution - when a taper is used in that situation it may tend to expand the tube and maybe not such a good idea after all .......I do still believe that two very slightly different thread pitches might work ( so long as they could be made to lock up at exactly the right place!).

    Torpedo motors look very interesting too, (even though I don't know exactly how they work!). I believe the Germans made a very tidy little V8 fourstroke engine for their torpedoes (I may find a pic later) - pity it was made to be blown up! -

    Who wants wars? - but then all leaders want to be great (and at the expense of others!). - the military men want to play with their new weapons even if it means sacrificing beautiful engines !!
    Strokers Galore!

  6. #3066
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    This is V8 Junkers Jumo K8 engine with head disc valves. PDF format in first post https://ww2aircraft.net/forum/thread...o-engine.7556/

    Yes WillDun, passenger liners Goya, Steuben and Wilhelm Gustloff, mostly with civilian refugees on board, one of the most terrible attack that soviets done with five or six torpedos at the nearly end of War. 20 000 deaths.
    And nothing changed, they will do the same now in Belarus with own people, just now days internet not let them go too far.

    In 1940 Stalin had all the latest German military equipment. Hitler gave away to soviets a few of the latest planes, tanks, ships (torpedo) for testing and for study, as Stalin abandoned some of the territories that were included in the Ribbentrop Molotov Pact.
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  7. #3067
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    Quote Originally Posted by katinas View Post
    This is V8 Junkers Jumo K8 engine with head disc valves. PDF format in first post .................................................. ..................................
    In 1940 Stalin had all the latest German military equipment. Hitler gave away to soviets a few of the latest planes, tanks, ships (torpedo) for testing and for study, as Stalin abandoned some of the territories that were included in the Ribbentrop Molotov Pact.
    Yes that V8 is the one I was meaning - very interesting!

    War to me is obscene and the only interest I have in it came from the fact that I was born in the last years of WW2 (I must admit I do find the technology fascinating though, especially the aircraft stuff),
    So I was more or less interested by things like two Bristol (sleeve valve??) radial engines from a crashed wartime Wellington bomber which had been hanging from a high cliff for years and was eventually taken down and sent to the local scrapyard, which I visited regularly (on the way home from school, around 1957) - just to check that they were ok!. - but eventually they were taken away and no doubt got melted down, just like all the rest of the precious wartime machinery!
    Strokers Galore!

  8. #3068
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    Engine reaction to horizontal exhaust divider. Slightly stronger until 6000 rpm, but when engine is on the pipe, from 9000 rpm power is noticeably reduced. Tried 3 times directly on the road as it only takes a few minutes for changes.
    Idea was to see how engine reacts to first part of exhaust opening with compact ex port , but of course is confrontation with returning process as separated lower exhaust part is closed as mix still returned.
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  9. #3069
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    My old mate in Aussie found this photo on the net and sent it to me a couple of days ago (I think that it might actually have been the only photo ever taken of it!). - never thought I'd ever see it again! - dunno who took the photo though, but it was quite good! - thought that I'd send it in anyway just to prove that I'm not ALL talk!

    The guy (on board) got me to design and build a frame and somehow install 2X (co joined) Ariel Arrow engines in it just for an experiment.
    The bottom engine was original and the top one had the gearbox sawn off and I made an adaptor to take the rest - The frame was made to accept a Triumph front end and he did all the other stuff ( technically it was his bike).
    We got it going quite well (with quite a few problems to overcome) but we did get it going - not too badly! ...... this, I think was around 1969 - 70?

    Sorry about the rusty pipes - it was sitting around in a shed for a couple of months prior to this!

    Photo was taken at Bay Park (Mt Maunganui) around 1969 - 70 from memory. ........ a lot of sideburns etc, also people with white coats! - I wonder if there was any significance in that ?? .......... think that was maybe a drag race day - I dunno, - think I was in hospital at the time!

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    Strokers Galore!

  10. #3070
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    WilDun, wonderful photo, it should be a great feeling to see your work from another world.
    It reminded me of my youth’s attempt to put together two outboard 488 cc twins, but in the end the task turned out to be too difficult. The interconnection of the engines was with the chain and the big problem was finding space for the exhaust. At that time I had no way to work with the machinery, all the tools were files, metal saws and drill. Unfortunately no photo left (red where there was a second engine)
    So finished with only one engine.
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  11. #3071
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    Yours looks to be well into the seventies (or later?) - did you design it yourself? - I don't recognize it!
    Gives a lot of pleasure to look back on them ...... ours also used chain drive but the outrigger bearings gave us endless problems!

    I remember not having any machinery at home so I did it at work using all their welding equipment and tube benders etc - couldn't use their lathes though (they were always locked up in the toolmakers area) - it was a furniture factory where I worked for about 1 year - the factory foreman was a good guy who, although he wasn't really interested in bikes and actually quite strict, sometimes turned a blind eye to what I was getting up to! - ( I was a MIG welder and always got my quota done ASAP before building the bike!).

    Unfortunately that wasn't me on the bike - but he did probably a good 50% of the work on it (I just designed the frame, built it and fitted the engines - he did the rest to finish it off.

    To tell the truth I had lost interest by then and was more interested in racing a (near new) T20 Suzuki!
    Having done that, I think I really should probably have got a speedway bike, because a little later I worked with a couple of ex speedway champions, who had a wealth of knowledge and could have helped me big time - I do regret not doing that!

    But - all good fun!
    Strokers Galore!

  12. #3072
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    The base for this bike was Jawa 638 ( photo ), but probably difficult to recognize it.
    I modified it through years and the latest version was with custom made disc brake, as I started to work at racing car factory with huge machinery in 1991.
    Until now I clearly remember the first touch to disc brake lever, absolutely shock with rear in the air, after many km s with drums. Impressive feelings.
    At the same time in this factory, with such good machinery, I could even make a "racing" bicycle with disc brakes and rear with thumb brake. It was in 1994 and yes Mick Doohan inspired this. I like this rear thumb brake so much and later use them on all the bikes, even on of road. Control was so natural and harmonic.
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  13. #3073
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    Pretty Cool Will. Plus Very innovative, using a knobby on the rear for maximum Drag-strip traction!

    Cheers, Daryl

  14. #3074
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pursang View Post
    Pretty Cool Will. Plus Very innovative, using a knobby on the rear for maximum Drag-strip traction!

    Cheers, Daryl
    Well, as I said I only made the frame and fitted the engine - I wasn't there when the photo was taken,
    I was in hospital (for 8 weeks) suffering from burns after having a slight mishap at a beach race (we were having a bit of a party at the end of the beach afterwards and had a fire going. A bottle of meths was sitting too close to the bonfire and it exploded all over my legs!) and I guess the beach race explains the rust! - The rear knobbly was actually used at the beach and he must have taken it to the drags "as is".
    Last I heard of him was that he highsided his Bultaco at Pukekohe (at over 70 years old!) ie when his gearbox blew up - that cut his racing career short! I haven't heard from him for quite a few years now! - but he sure did enjoy his racing though!

    Katinas,
    That machine was a very impressive piece of work, and I did think that brake was a bit before it's time (moto GP have only just got near that dimeter recently!). The "push" bike is also very impressive!
    Strokers Galore!

  15. #3075
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    No reflection on you Will.

    Did anyone else notice that Elwood Blues was a race official at that event?Name:  icon6.png
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    Cheers, Daryl

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