Learning from accidents

**unstuck** · 6th February 2015, 17:41

Originally Posted by FJRider

I've had plenty of "Issues" with 'Possums ... their heads don't crush under the front wheel and usually just roll off it to the side ...

Yeah, them and hares seem to have hard heads.

**FJRider** · 6th February 2015, 17:47

Originally Posted by swbarnett

Grab a dictionary and look up "Peripheral Vision". Learn to use it!

A lack of Peripheral vision ... might mean Tunnel vision is the issue.

**bluninja** · 6th February 2015, 17:48

Originally Posted by cassina

I only had one accident when I was learning that I could put down to inexperience and that was coming off when stopping for lights on the downhill of a bridge on a wet day and I possibly either gave it too much front brake or did not watch for painted lines. I know I would have been taught to watch out for painted lines in a riding school but like I said they were not around in the late 70s.

Is this included in the 4 accidents?? Did the traffic lights come out of nowhere so fast you didn't have time to brake ?

**FJRider** · 6th February 2015, 18:04

Originally Posted by cassina

I only had one accident when I was learning ...

If you have already stopped Learning ... there really is no hope for you. More accidents are then a certainty ...

Good luck with that.

**bluninja** · 6th February 2015, 18:04

Originally Posted by bluninja

SNIP......
BTW immediately after a 2 day advanced training course I tried to add this skill/technique to my riding and it made my riding less safe and did my head in as I was trying to implement all I'd learnt at once. I had to prioritise the skills and practice them one by one and then habituate them within my riding so that they become automatic. When something becomes habituated it takes less conscious effort (less tiring) and is quicker than processing it consciously.

Here's what I typed... and your misinterpretation below

Originally Posted by cassina

SNIP
You said what you were taught made you feel unsafe which does not sound like the sort of riding school I would want to go to. Now you follow their instructions automatically whose to say in theory you are any less unsafe?

At no point did I say what I was taught made me feel unsafe. It was my attempt to implement a whole series of techniques into my existing riding style, in one hit, that made my riding less safe. I recognised this, and embedded the new skills and techniques over a longer period of time. The instructor at Shire Training Services died of a stroke having never had an RTA on a motorbike. I'd take his training and advice over yours any day.

My riding techniques and skills are habituated so that I no longer need to consciously think about them. That is completely different to your assertion that I follow their instructions (based on UK Police Roadcraft) automatically.

Two questions: Was there no Star Rider scheme in NZ in the 70's (which would have had you riding more than 34 years since you say it's continuous riding) for you to learn. Why do you presume that all current rider training is aimed at going faster on the track?

**FJRider** · 6th February 2015, 18:10

Originally Posted by bluninja

Why do you presume that all current rider training is aimed at going faster on the track?

I have always believed Rider training is intended to save your life ... not save your time.

**nzspokes** · 6th February 2015, 18:23

Originally Posted by FJRider

I have always believed Rider training is intended to save your life ... not save your time.

I do regular track training. Speed is not spoken of, in fact we have to tape up our speedos. And no timing is allowed.

What is spoken about is good lines. Good braking. Looking through turns. Good gear changing. Never speed. Main word used is smooth.

**nzspokes** · 6th February 2015, 18:25

Originally Posted by bluninja

Is this included in the 4 accidents?? Did the traffic lights come out of nowhere so fast you didn't have time to brake ?

Back in the 70s the fuckers just jumped up like bamboo.

Really, 4 crashes? Maybe time to give up then.

**Katman** · 6th February 2015, 18:26

Originally Posted by bluninja

Two questions: Was there no Star Rider scheme in NZ in the 70's (which would have had you riding more than 34 years since you say it's continuous riding) for you to learn. Why do you presume that all current rider training is aimed at going faster on the track?

I did the Apple Riding Course back in 1982 so there was that sort of scheme available if you looked for it. ( Not sure what year Apple started though).

Just checked - they started in 1973. (Don't know what year they started offering the riding course though).

**samgab** · 6th February 2015, 21:40

Thankfully, due to the "ignore" setting, I'm spared a lot of what I've concluded, based on the replies, is some fairly tedious reading in this thread from a certain user who seems unsafe to be on public roads...
However, I think it all comes down to two key words:
"Situational Awareness".
2-wheeled riders need to have it!

We should be aware of everything that is going on around us at all times. Potential hazards, pedestrians, kids, parked cars, driveways, potholes, ice, oil patches, gravel, metal covers, road paint, oncoming vehicles, vehicles at intersections, other vehicles going the same direction that might accelerate, swerve, or brake unexpectedly, the list is endless. It can all be seen and prepared for by experienced and skillful riders. I always anticipate the possibility of every other road user making the wrong move, making the wrong choice, pulling out in front of me or cutting me off. Then I'm prepared with an escape plan when it inevitably does happen. When you get used to doing that all the time, it becomes second nature, as indicated by other commenters here.

Still, mistakes can happen, but they're less likely when riding with a healthy pessimistic view of other road users skills, attitudes, and abilities.

I only ride a scooter at the moment, because it's an incredibly cheap way to commute, but I've been riding various motorbikes, farm bikes, and trail bikes for 27 years, and I've only had one minor crash where I was the rider, when I was a young over-confident schoolboy, on my way home from school, turned into my home street, and road workers had poured some fresh gravel onto the street where I live during the day. A road I thought I knew the surface of well, gave me false confidence, my front wheel slid out and I slid off to the side of the road, not hitting anything, fortunately. But I learnt my lesson, and now as well as all the other things I need to be aware of, I'm very conscious of road surface condition, even on roads I think I know well.

**unstuck** · 7th February 2015, 05:29