Why housing costs are so ridiculously high

[Ocean1]

Sorry, I dont understand the problem, is there a reason why the property shouldnt be sold at market rates?
Like I said earlier, there are places people can buy houses other than Auckland. Believe it or not there is a whole country of small & affordable towns south of the Bombays, so no need to live under a bridge, unless your head is firmly up your arse.

Never mind that shit, what rent are all these bridge tenants paying? And to who?

[husaberg]

I don't recall any election promises to provide knock down cheap housing for the lazy & stupid.

There was some discussion about changing local authority processes to help reduce costs. Some movement there, but I'm keen to see the fuckers charging a bunch less for developments they're not actually paying for. Arseholes.

Re the compliance That's not completely true they gave developers some dispensations to not have to comply with a lot of legally set rules such as NZECP34. Now that is going to cost a lot of tax payers a lot of money later.

Keys plans Private consortiums, mmm the wonder who the big players will be.

To watch Key's speech, visit: tinyurl.com/nzuzh7l

Housing NZ is to accelerate reviews of its existing tenants from about 2000 announced previously to 5000 over the next two years. Reviews will target the 3300 tenants already paying market rents and others on near-market rates, requiring many of them to move into private rentals or home ownership.

Fletcher Housing director Alan Jackson said private developers would be interested in forming consortiums with community agencies. Labour housing spokesman Phil Twyford said ministers were trying to hose down public alarm about a large-scale sell-off of state housing.

"It is clear that they are moving to a different model of social housing where anybody can own the houses and the Government just pays a subsidy," he said.

"The legislation and their public statements have explicitly left the door open to for-profit providers."


Selling state houses


Why is the Government selling state houses?
Ministers want to encourage "a more diverse ownership of social housing with more innovation and responsiveness to tenants and communities".

How many will be sold?
About 1000-2000 in the next year and up to 8000 in the next three years.

Who can buy them?
Anyone, in theory, but they must be managed by registered community housing providers. They may form consortiums with iwi and private developers or financiers.

What are the conditions?
Properties will have to stay in social housing unless the Government grants an exception, such as for a mixed public/private development of more intensive housing on a site.

What else is changing?
About 5000 existing state house tenants will have their tenancies reviewed in the next two years and those whose incomes are high enough to rent or buy in the private market may be required to move out, making room for some of the 3600 people on the priority social housing waiting list.

Building far less per year than they sell. market rents for the rest.
Creates demand when there was little That needs to be filled by private interests, the market dictates lol
Machiavellian at its best.

F-ing glad I am not poor in Auckland. Or poor, or don't own my own house. Or live near Auckland or think Auckland's the only place in the world worth living in.

The land was bought by HNZ to provide state housing under the HNZ banner. HNZ are now selling it at a profit, rather than complete the plan that was expected.

After they said that they would use the money from the sales of now affluent area houses to build lots of new ones

[Ocean1]

Re the compliance That's not completely true they gave developers some dispensations to not have to comply with a lot of legally set rules such as NZECP34. Now that is going to cost a lot of tax payers a lot of money later.

Keys plans Private consortiums, mmm the wonder who the big players will be.



Building far less per year than they sell. market rents for the rest.
Creates demand when there was little That needs to be filled by private interests, the market dictates lol
Machiavellian at its best.

F-ing glad I am not poor in Auckland.

Oh I wasn't bothered about govt not providing knock down cheap housing for the lazy & stupid themselves. I just figured it's a given that's a bad idea.

I was kinda hoping they'd simply shoo the parasites away from the communal housing production industry trough. So that those simply wanting to build a house can just get on with it without having to pay for all of the attendant bullshit.

Can't comment on that particular std, but it's true that a large number of standards are more barriers to competition than protection for consumers. And there's nothing preventing house builders making their houses to whatever advisory criteria they see fit.

I was talking to a guy today that's been battling his local council for two years and $40k over compliance work on his 120 year old guest house. He's about ready to break out the 12swg and settle it once and for all. Can't say I wouldn't be there, calling in targeting.

[husaberg]

Oh I wasn't bothered about govt not providing knock down cheap housing for the lazy & stupid themselves. I just figured it's a given that's a bad idea.

I was kinda hoping they'd simply shoo the parasites away from the communal housing production industry trough. So that those simply wanting to build a house can just get on with it without having to pay for all of the attendant bullshit.

Can't comment on that particular std, but it's true that a large number of standards are more barriers to competition than protection for consumers. And there's nothing preventing house builders making their houses to whatever advisory criteria they see fit.

I was talking to a guy today that's been battling his local council for two years and $40k over compliance work on his 120 year old guest house. He's about ready to break out the 12swg and settle it once and for all. Can't say I wouldn't be there, calling in targeting.

Google what NZECP34, is its a barrier all right, But a very important one, it was put in place for a very good reason though, to protect people from being electrocuted in their homes.
Some of the new housing doesn't have to comply with it or consider it at all.
I like the Councils will take up the slack bit best with the new builds so who pays for that.

Don't get me started on Consents today, I have to notify a local council now as well when we do works on DOC land now.

[Ocean1]

Google what NZECP34, is its a barrier all right, But a very important one, it was put in place for a very good reason though, to protect people from being electrocuted in their homes.
Some of the new housing doesn't have to comply with it or consider it at all.
I like the Councils will take up the slack bit best with the new builds so who pays for that.

Don't get me started on Consents today, I have to notify a local council now as well when we do works on DOC land now.

Serve them right then eh? Seriously, sounds like there's more to that story.

I don't want councils to take up any slack, I just want them to charge reasonable fees for supplying the services their clients want, rather than the currently fashionable charging whatever the fuck they like for supplying nothing anyone really wants simply because they have a monopoly on supply.

You have my deepest sympathies, nobody should ever have to soil their day to the extent of having to interact with either "organisation", and if I had to deal with both on the same piece of business I think I'd slit my wrists. Actually, on mature reflection I'd probably slit their wrists, far better solution.

[husaberg]

Serve them right then eh? Seriously, sounds like there's more to that story.

No the people who buy the houses ill pay ,that are compliant with the fast track regs they are built too rather than the appropriate legal acts, Its the the government that has said they could this bypass (RED TAPE) to speed up stuff.
So the owners and the councils and utilities will end up paying to sort it. By the time someone decides this is utter madness and tries to solve what the heck has been allowed to occur, by then The developers will be long gone.

I don't want councils to take up any slack, I just want them to charge reasonable fees for supplying the services their clients want, rather than the currently fashionable charging whatever the fuck they like for supplying nothing anyone really wants simply because they have a monopoly on supply.

Its not that its just councils are paid by us still they will just carry the can to fill the gaps to revent people living on the streets

You have my deepest sympathies, nobody should ever have to soil their day to the extent of having to interact with either "organisation", and if I had to deal with both on the same piece of business I think I'd slit my wrists. Actually, on mature reflection I'd probably slit their wrists, far better solution.

Hell No, In my experience DOC are bloody awesome to deal with, on the level I deal with them anyway.
The councils and I deal with 5, of them 3 are excellent 1 is "interesting" in what concerns them and one is extremely bureaucratic and condescending, but yet do not hold themselves to any where near the same level of scrutiny.
In fairness to them a lot of the compliance stuff has been forced on the councils they would rather be out of it. but we are at the stage where we are having multiple consents from multiple authorities to do one job.

[sidecar bob]

Nothing.

If you can't afford to buy, you rent, or you work harder, or find something cheaper. Not owning a house isn't the end of the world.

So when you reach an age at which you would like to retire & you have no assets or money, you live exactly how? By getting a cheap Govt subsidised flat in shitsville & a benefit until you die in poverty & misery?

[Swoop]

Some of the new housing doesn't have to comply with it or consider it at all.
I like the Councils will take up the slack bit best with the new builds so who pays for that.

Apart from the regular fun-filled time of dealing with retards at Council, what is concerning me more is the work done by Asian and indian builders.
There is some particularly scary shit going on out there and it will come back to bite a home-owner who believes that he has purchased a decent building (which has been signed off by council).

[husaberg]

So when you reach an age at which you would like to retire & you have no assets or money, you live exactly how? By getting a cheap Govt subsidised flat in shitsville & a benefit until you die in poverty & misery?

Yeah but it will be fast can't have the poor lingering on wasting resources.
because you wont be able to afford the free health care or decent electricity for heating or be able to buy food by then.

Apart from the regular fun-filled time of dealing with retards at Council, what is concerning me more is the work done by Asian and indian builders.
There is some particularly scary shit going on out there and it will come back to bite a home-owner who believes that he has purchased a decent building (which has been signed off by council).

I'm in the same situation I will be the one that will be told that he has to tell them its not right afterwards and has to be sorted.

[bogan]

So when you reach an age at which you would like to retire & you have no assets or money, you live exactly how? By getting a cheap Govt subsidised flat in shitsville & a benefit until you die in poverty & misery?

House ownership is not the only form of having assets, or money.

[blue rider]

bludgers
some are more deserving that others

[sidecar bob]

House ownership is not the only form of having assets, or money.

I'm very well aware of that. It's called a balanced portfolio.

[Ocean1]

No the people who buy the houses ill pay ,that are compliant with the fast track regs they are built too rather than the appropriate legal acts, Its the the government that has said they could this bypass (RED TAPE) to speed up stuff.
So the owners and the councils and utilities will end up paying to sort it. By the time someone decides this is utter madness and tries to solve what the heck has been allowed to occur, by then The developers will be long gone.


Its not that its just councils are paid by us still they will just carry the can to fill the gaps to revent people living on the streets


Hell No, In my experience DOC are bloody awesome to deal with, on the level I deal with them anyway.
The councils and I deal with 5, of them 3 are excellent 1 is "interesting" in what concerns them and one is extremely bureaucratic and condescending, but yet do not hold themselves to any where near the same level of scrutiny.
In fairness to them a lot of the compliance stuff has been forced on the councils they would rather be out of it. but we are at the stage where we are having multiple consents from multiple authorities to do one job.

If the houses were built to current reg's then there's only one person responsible for any future modifications: the owner. The developer did his job, not his fault. The council did theirs, why should they pay? The whole thing about council being some responsible for build quality as defined by standards is bullshit. If the guy paying for the house wants it built to any given standard then that's his call, and his cost.

Yes the councils are paid by us, my point is that we want very little of what they charge us for. Given the choice, if building I'd be selecting and defining my own standards and if necessary hiring an inspector to manage compliance.

In my experience councils have just one objective: to maximise rates and the number of properties that pay them, requiring any new builds to pay way too much for the privilege and spending as little as possible to achieve that end. This does not make for a "service" most ratepayers want.

And welcome to the thick end of the bureaucratic bandwagon caused by people bitching about "govt should do this/that".

[Ocean1]

Apart from the regular fun-filled time of dealing with retards at Council, what is concerning me more is the work done by Asian and indian builders.
There is some particularly scary shit going on out there and it will come back to bite a home-owner who believes that he has purchased a decent building (which has been signed off by council).

Exactly. What fucking use is a standard if it's not applied? And yet I hear from an inspector mate that no councils make any money from that part of their "service". Pretty sure SGS or one of the other independents could make it work for a fucking sight less.

[husaberg]

If the houses were built to current reg's then there's only one person responsible for any future modifications: the owner. The developer did his job, not his fault. The council did theirs, why should they pay? The whole thing about council being some responsible for build quality as defined by standards is bullshit. If the guy paying for the house wants it built to any given standard then that's his call, and his cost.

Yes the councils are paid by us, my point is that we want very little of what they charge us for. Given the choice, if building I'd be selecting and defining my own standards and if necessary hiring an inspector to manage compliance.

In my experience councils have just one objective: to maximise rates and the number of properties that pay them, requiring any new builds to pay way too much for the privilege and spending as little as possible to achieve that end. This does not make for a "service" most ratepayers want.

And welcome to the thick end of the bureaucratic bandwagon caused by people bitching about "govt should do this/that".

Read what NZECP34 is about before you leap to conclusions too much.
There is regulations acts and laws.
It’s not about the houses it’s about the fact where they are in relation to their proximity to other things.