This cunt got what he deserved!

[TheDemonLord]

Deal .

Gentlemanly Handshake

[Katman]

Gentlemanly Handshake

.

[unstuck]

I wonder if Ed will reveal the FULL story, so we can all be well informed with ALL the facts that have been peer reviewed and gotten scientific backing.

Oh how the mighty are falling.

[pritch]

Well, it turns out he stole the gun from Walmart and was only threatening to shoot himself.

That's a fair description. He probably should have been in the funny farm rather than on the street but nobody does that much anymore. Whether you agree with the way it was handled or not, it was a piece of quick thinking by the cop and the only person hurt is the offender who is still alive. A good result.

This event was given considerable coverage in US news sources when it happened last week(ish), nothing in our local news but then it's nothing to do with us.

[jasonu]

What if you don't ever go on a rampage with a deadly weapon?

Can I still laugh and make disparaging remarks about you?

Like that has ever stopped you before....

[Bikemad]

I seem to recall some debate around this at the time - around what was correct police procedure:

if I get this wrong - I apologise, I CBF digging up the records - but it was something along the lines that in a situation where there was no danger to the public, the correct procedure was to back off and wait for the Armed Offenders squad. The debate was whether or not there was danger to the Public or the officer himself: The courts in the end sided with the Officer that when Williams advanced on him and I think threw a club or bat at the Officer that was grounds for the Officer to use Deadly force - and that Williams dropped about 5 m from the Officer (which isn't a great deal of distance)

for a start the victims name was WALLACE.........there were 3 officers on the scene......dogs on the way..........they had already contained him for 20-30 minutes......whats another 20-30 minutes....did the club/bat hit cuntstable abbott..NO..........would you expect someone who is drunk,under the influence of drugs,maybe a bit crazy and emotional,for whatever reason we will never know,or all of the above,to act with common sense and reason when confronted with someone pointing a gun at him.....police officer or not.
Abbott swore an oath to protect and serve ALL NZers.......Stephen Wallace included.From what i understand this behavior was out of character for Wallace and he probably would of apologised and paid for any damage he did,sadly he didn't get the chance

[Katman]

This event was given considerable coverage in US news sources when it happened last week(ish), nothing in our local news but then it's nothing to do with us.

I think you'll find it actually happened a couple of months ago.

The video has only just surfaced in the last week.

A cynic might wonder whether the police needed a couple of months to get their stories straight.

[Swoop]

He probably should have been in the funny farm rather than on the street

Sadly, that is exactly the same nowadays...
After the politicians shut down the looney-bins and threw them into "community care".

[unstuck]

This event was given considerable coverage in US news sources when it happened last week(ish), nothing in our local news but then it's nothing to do with us.

February the 19th is when it happened. See how things get out of wack when we dont have ALL the facts.

[jasonu]

and that Williams dropped about 5 m from the Officer (which isn't a great deal of distance)

You are dead right. At 6 meters a bad guy with a knife, hammer, golf club can be right on you in less than 2 seconds. That doesn't give you much time to think about what he might do with the weapon, if he is going to use it on you, what the press might say or wether some know it all wanker experts on motorcycle forums are going to tell you what you should have done.

[TheDemonLord]

for a start the victims name was WALLACE.........there were 3 officers on the scene......dogs on the way..........they had already contained him for 20-30 minutes......whats another 20-30 minutes....did the club/bat hit cuntstable abbott..NO..........would you expect someone who is drunk,under the influence of drugs,maybe a bit crazy and emotional,for whatever reason we will never know,or all of the above,to act with common sense and reason when confronted with someone pointing a gun at him.....police officer or not.
Abbott swore an oath to protect and serve ALL NZers.......Stephen Wallace included.From what i understand this behavior was out of character for Wallace and he probably would of apologised and paid for any damage he did,sadly he didn't get the chance

Like I said - I was going off memory...

There are so many parts of this statement that I could pick apart, but at the end of the day, the Jury(s) that attended the courts (so not the IPCA) were the ones that found that the Officer acted reasonably.

[Bikemad]

Like I said - I was going off memory...

There are so many parts of this statement that I could pick apart, but at the end of the day, the Jury(s) that attended the courts (so not the IPCA) were the ones that found that the Officer acted reasonably.

and Jurys NEVER make BAD decisions......ever
please feel free to pick apart my statement........i'm curious to know what you think is wrong with it

[TheDemonLord]

and Jurys NEVER make BAD decisions......ever
please feel free to pick apart my statement........i'm curious to know what you think is wrong with it

Sure, Juries are imperfect, but if multiple Juries come the the same decision (I seem to remember a trial, a high court hearing then a re-trial) then

Oh well, since you asked:

they had already contained him for 20-30 minutes......whats another 20-30 minutes

Volatile situations like this one can change alot in 20-30 minutes, especially when dealing with Drunk/Mentally Unstable/High people (who can change rapidly as they get frustrated/confused/irritated)

did the club/bat hit cuntstable abbott..NO

Not the point - it was attempted assault with a deadly weapon against a police officer (yes a Golf Club can be considered a Deadly Weapon) - doing some reading on this, it only missed because the Officer ducked, not by any virtue of Mr Wallace. Ask yourself this - would you expect the police to act differently if Mr Wallace had fired a weapon at them and missed or if he had tried to stab the officer with a knife and missed?

would you expect someone who is drunk,under the influence of drugs,maybe a bit crazy and emotional,for whatever reason we will never know,or all of the above,to act with common sense and reason when confronted with someone pointing a gun at him.....police officer or not.

If someone is in such a state that they show no fear when being presented with someone pointing a gun at them then they are a very dangerous individual - if they have no regard for their own life, what regard will they have for others?

As for Alcohol or drugs being a mitigating factor - I've been drunk, I've been high and I've never done anything to that degree of recklessness, sure I have done minor silly things, but never to the point of challenging someone who is armed (and yes, I have been intoxicated around someone that was armed) because despite being drunk, I still rather liked the prospect of living.

Abbott swore an oath to protect and serve ALL NZers.......Stephen Wallace included.

What gives Mr Wallace the right then to ignore direction from the police and act with impunity? The police are also charged with maintaining Law and are obligated to act when Laws are being breached - in the same way that the Police are allowed to engage in a pursuit to apprehend a driver. There is a point at which the seriousness of the offending mandates that the Police cannot back down - both from a societal perception PoV but also from a Moral PoV.

From what i understand this behavior was out of character for Wallace and he probably would of apologised and paid for any damage he did,sadly he didn't get thechance

I'm going to quote BigDog on this part:

"The family says he was just acting out and he would never hurt anyone"

If that is truly the families position then reading into it:

They were neither shocked nor surprised by his action: 'Just acting out' which tends to suggest that something similar has happened before (maybe not to the same degree) either that or his family has no comprehension of the consequences of actions

so with scenario one - we have someone who should have been committed to recieve help for a condition where they could go batshit crazy
or
Scenario two - he was raised in an environment where he thought he could do what he wanted and nothing bad would happen.

[Katman]

As for Alcohol or drugs being a mitigating factor - I've been drunk, I've been high and I've never done anything to that degree of recklessness, sure I have done minor silly things, but never to the point of challenging someone who is armed (and yes, I have been intoxicated around someone that was armed) because despite being drunk, I still rather liked the prospect of living.

Have you ever suffered from mental illness?

(Aside from the time you spend on here, of course).

[TheDemonLord]

Have you ever suffered from mental illness?

(Aside from the time you spend on here, of course).

No I have not - would having Mental Illness (and not getting it treated) give me Carte Blanche to do as I please free from consequences, no it does not.