Flag?

[Ocean1]

One surprise for me after the referendum rssults came out was that i live in one of the two electorates in the SI to have voted in favour of change...The ChCh city electorate that did was no surprise, Key could ask residents there to carry suicide vests and they would. But Selwyn is mainly rural - and many, many farming families out here got their start on the land from the postwar resettlement programmes for returned servicemen. Plus most of the long established farming dynasties have a tradition of military service...
Given the RSA's stand on the flag they fought for, where was the loyalty ?

Maybe they were the one place in NZ that actually voted on the merits of the available choices.

Rather than the usual twisted tribal popularity contest. http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/poli...od-flag-attack

Stupid bint.

[Banditbandit]

One surprise for me after the referendum rssults came out was that i live in one of the two electorates in the SI to have voted in favour of change...The ChCh city electorate that did was no surprise, Key could ask residents there to carry suicide vests and they would. But Selwyn is mainly rural - and many, many farming families out here got their start on the land from the postwar resettlement programmes for returned servicemen. Plus most of the long established farming dynasties have a tradition of military service...
Given the RSA's stand on the flag they fought for, where was the loyalty ?

Rural electorates are changing. When I lived in rural Hawke's Bay more than 50% of the people in the area where life-stylers - the farmers sold off parts of their land i.e. one farming family sells five 10-acre blocks - they are now out-numbered five to one ...

That's changing the nature of rural electorates right across the country .. the life-stylers will be less conservative than the farming families ...

Selwyn will include the life-stylers on the Port Hills, across the plains ..

[MarkH]

Given the RSA's stand on the flag they fought for, where was the loyalty ?

Maybe some of those people are smart enough to know that the RSA is full of shit on this issue?
When did ANY New Zealander fight for a flag? The great NZ flag war?
I would put it to you that no NZer has ever fought for our flag and I'd wager that plenty of servicemen and ex-servicemen would be completely OK with NZ changing the flag (had that been the wish of the majority).

[Katman]

Maybe some of those people are smart enough to know that the RSA is full of shit on this issue?
When did ANY New Zealander fight for a flag? The great NZ flag war?
I would put it to you that no NZer has ever fought for our flag and I'd wager that plenty of servicemen and ex-servicemen would be completely OK with NZ changing the flag (had that been the wish of the majority).

It's last week's news.

Get over it.

[Swoop]

Any idea why these labour voters are so keen on the union jack?

Quite simply because of the leftist brainwashing that "Key supports this, so therefore it's bad" approach.

[MarkH]

It's last week's news.

Get over it.

Wow, just how big an idiot are you?
Why the hell are you reading and joining in on this thread?
If you are so over the flag thing then how big a fool would you estimate yourself to be for posting here?

My pet peeve on internet forums:
People that post in a thread to let those in the thread know how little the subject of the thread interests them.
What the hell is up with that?

[Grumph]

That's changing the nature of rural electorates right across the country .. the life-stylers will be less conservative than the farming families ...

The wife's got a meeting with Amy Adams tomorrow - I'll ask her to put that to Amy...

Doubt she'll agree with you....

[bogan]

Maybe some of those people are smart enough to know that the RSA is full of shit on this issue?
When did ANY New Zealander fight for a flag? The great NZ flag war?
I would put it to you that no NZer has ever fought for our flag and I'd wager that plenty of servicemen and ex-servicemen would be completely OK with NZ changing the flag (had that been the wish of the majority).

You might find that's a straw man argument, the RSA have a point in that this flag is what New Zealanders fought under, and to keep it is a sign of respect for their sacrifices.

Wow, just how big an idiot are you?
Why the hell are you reading and joining in on this thread?
If you are so over the flag thing then how big a fool would you estimate yourself to be for posting here?

My pet peeve on internet forums:
People that post in a thread to let those in the thread know how little the subject of the thread interests them.
What the hell is up with that?

Could it be...


... a false flag operation?

[MarkH]

Could it be...


... a false flag operation?

Lol!

You might find that's a straw man argument, the RSA have a point in that this flag is what New Zealanders fought under, and to keep it is a sign of respect for their sacrifices.

That's pretty ridiculous!
Let's honour the sacrifices of men that fought for our freedom by never exercising that freedom?
Did they really hope that we would never change our flag and fight a war to ensure we wouldn't? Of course not!

I have trouble imagining how you could even go about trying to convince people that a way of honouring our fallen soldiers would be by never changing our flag, I'd laugh right in the face of someone telling me that.
Would they not have fought had our flag been different?
Did they really care about the flag or was it their country and fellow countrymen that they were fighting for?
This sounds like the moronic crap that people that hate change would come up with to avoid change.

[Katman]

Lol!



That's pretty ridiculous!
Let's honour the sacrifices of men that fought for our freedom by never exercising that freedom?
Did they really hope that we would never change our flag and fight a war to ensure we wouldn't? Of course not!

I have trouble imagining how you could even go about trying to convince people that a way of honouring our fallen soldiers would be by never changing our flag, I'd laugh right in the face of someone telling me that.
Would they not have fought had our flag been different?
Did they really care about the flag or was it their country and fellow countrymen that they were fighting for?
This sounds like the moronic crap that people that hate change would come up with to avoid change.

Dude, let it go.

[bogan]

Lol!



That's pretty ridiculous!
Let's honour the sacrifices of men that fought for our freedom by never exercising that freedom?
Did they really hope that we would never change our flag and fight a war to ensure we wouldn't? Of course not!

I have trouble imagining how you could even go about trying to convince people that a way of honouring our fallen soldiers would be by never changing our flag, I'd laugh right in the face of someone telling me that.
Would they not have fought had our flag been different?
Did they really care about the flag or was it their country and fellow countrymen that they were fighting for?
This sounds like the moronic crap that people that hate change would come up with to avoid change.

Ahhh, but if we choose not to change the flag, like we did, freedom is still exercised. Remember it was/is an argument against changing the flag, not against being able to choose.

It's not about any muppet going to war for the flag, why do you keep to that strawman? it because they went to a just war, under the flag. The flag was a symbol for them, so to keep that symbol for us, is to honor their sacrifice. Lest we forget.

Obviously this is just one argument against chaning it, and there are many others for changing it (as I voted this way), but lets not fail the democratic process any further by misrepresenting the valid points being made.

[MarkH]

Dude, let it go.

You still posting this thread?
Why?
Why are you so invested in this thread, why can't you let go of this subject?

You should tell everyone you meet that you like to go onto discussion forums and tell people to stop discussing stuff, you know, just to make sure they know what sort of person they have met!

[Katman]

You still posting this thread?
Why?

I'm concerned about your blood pressure.

[MarkH]

Ahhh, but if we choose not to change the flag, like we did, freedom is still exercised. Remember it was/is an argument against changing the flag, not against being able to choose.

It's not about any muppet going to war for the flag, why do you keep to that strawman? it because they went to a just war, under the flag. The flag was a symbol for them, so to keep that symbol for us, is to honor their sacrifice. Lest we forget.

Obviously this is just one argument against chaning it, and there are many others for changing it (as I voted this way), but lets not fail the democratic process any further by misrepresenting the valid points being made.

Sorry dude, but I just happen to disagree with that point and I don't believe that having an opinion in any way fails the democratic process.
I don't believe that changing the flag would dishonour those that fought for this country while we had a previous flag and I don't believe that keeping the flag in any way honours the servicemen that fought for our country.
I don't believe that the soldiers that fought were inspired by our flag and I doubt that they really thought that much about the flag.

The way I see it, this was one of the many mistaken ideas that led to us keeping the old flag, people not wanting to dishonour soldiers or wanting to honour soldiers by keeping the flag.

There have been other countries that changed flags, did they in each case dishonour their fallen soldiers when they did so?
For example: Canada changed flags after WW2 to the current maple leaf design, was that a slap in the face to the soldiers that died in WW1 & WW2?
In my opinion it wasn't.

[bogan]

Sorry dude, but I just happen to disagree with that point and I don't believe that having an opinion in any way fails the democratic process.
I don't believe that changing the flag would dishonour those that fought for this country while we had a previous flag and I don't believe that keeping the flag in any way honours the servicemen that fought for our country.
I don't believe that the soldiers that fought were inspired by our flag and I doubt that they really thought that much about the flag.

The way I see it, this was one of the many mistaken ideas that led to us keeping the old flag, people not wanting to dishonour soldiers or wanting to honour soldiers by keeping the flag.

There have been other countries that changed flags, did they in each case dishonour their fallen soldiers when they did so?
For example: Canada changed flags after WW2 to the current maple leaf design, was that a slap in the face to the soldiers that died in WW1 & WW2?
In my opinion it wasn't.

Of course having an opinion doesn't, misrepresenting the opinions and points other make however, does.

I don't think it dishonors them either, not sure why you bring this up.

The servicemen are literally telling you that keeping the flag is a way to honor them.

It's not a mistaken idea, it's an opinion.