Like this eh?Originally Posted by husaberg
Fully qualified Sifter.
Like this eh?
Anorak
No the Russian ones are far bigger plus they are incendiary and dropped in civilian areas and they even show them being used on Russia today.
They stay on RT until people see them and post about it on the net. Only then do they try to edit it out.
But that never worried you or Katspama before with the Russians using them did it. So why would it now?
even your old Fav the independant covered it, plus the cover up.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a7093141.html
https://www.hrw.org/news/2016/07/28/...r-munition-use
So why are you so up in arms about others using them you were aware Russia were using them and stayed silent about it.
Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken
The Majestic Metal Wizard
On pure curiosity - I had a look at the cost of a Hellfire Missile and a Reaper drone and it's cost per hour of flight - I'm afraid your Meme is incorrect on all counts.Like this eh?
Physics; Thou art a cruel, heartless Bitch-of-a-Mistress
Just faidin away!
MAJOR FAIL: Why Most of Those Tomahawks Never Hit Their Targets in Syria https://russia-insider.com/en/major-...-syria/ri23177FFS
Fully qualified Sifter.
It's the thought that counts!
The Majestic Metal Wizard
And clearly, that thought was a little wayward
Physics; Thou art a cruel, heartless Bitch-of-a-Mistress
Anorak
Not to mention missiles have a shelf life.
Mostly the only time 75 squadron was ever allowed to live fire was when they were due to expire.
Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken
Hardcore Biker
As requested.
Your request was for identification of various changes occurring in the UK story. Not all the following
required a response on the Russians part, but many still led to confusion for both the Russians and
other observers around the world.
A. Poison Allegedly Involved
1. A Novichuk or "some similar product" (true identity was not confirmed by lab analysis until Skripal
samples had actually been sent to Porton Downs).
2. Novichuk could be manufactured "only by Russia" ( This was disproven by evidence from Iran - 2016,
and by response from senior organic chemists at US Cornell University).
3. Novichuk used in the Skripal poisoning was "manufactured and supplied by Russia" (still unproven to this
date).
4. Novichuk was "military grade" (even though advice was that "military grade" dispersed in even very low
concentration could have killed a considerable number of people within a 200 metre radius of the point of
application).
5. Novichuk could be manufactured only by a "state actor" (promptly contradicted by organic chemists at
Cornell university).
6. Confirmation of Novichuk by Porton Downs staff (source of the sample used by them in verification of
identity ?)
Poisoning occurred on 4 March 2018.
B. Initial Behaviour by the UK Authorities
The initial activity performed by the UK authorities focused more on condemning Russia, engaging allied
support and then expelling Russian diplomats. Whilst at the same time denying any meaningful assistance
to the Russians.
1. Novichuk was being touted as the agent involved by UK politicians within 36 hours of the poisoning,
yet it required one week minimum for Porton Down analysis - following provision of samples - for them
to be able to verify its identity with confidence. In the meanwhile, the UK levelled accusations against
Russia, issued an ultimatum and then (after a quite understandable refusal by the Russians) initiated the
expulsion of 23 Russian diplomats from the UK (whilst pushing for expulsion of diplomats from other allied
countries).
2. Scotland Yard identified no prospective suspects. No-one was seen on CCTV (in a country of CCTV
cameras). No images, composites or photos of likely suspects was ever released by UK Police. No persons
of interest were ever circulated.
3. Despite being a signatory to OPCW, the UK refused to co-operate with Russian authorities from the
outset (in terms of provision of information on the poison suspected).
4. The UK denied Russia the opportunity to come and either (i) take its own samples (ii) inspect existing
samples from the alleged scene - which is an action permitted under OPCW rules.
5. The UK chose to instead quickly pursue a "political" course of action (through the issuing of a two day
ultimatum to Russia, and then the immediate apportioning of blame to Russia - well prior to any detailed
analysis work by qualified lab staff (at Porton Downs).
6. UK issued an ultimatum to Russia, demanding that it confirm either that a Novichuk attack had been
performed by Russia, or that it was a result of alleged Russian Novichuk stockholding falling into third
party hands (as if these were the only plausible explanations, and each of which implied some Russian
responsibility). This is comparable to the old "Do you still beat your wife" question.
7. UK engagement with allies led to the expulsion of Russian diplomats from those countries (i.e. US = 60;
Ukraine = 13; Germany = 4 ; Canada = 4; Poland = 4; France = 4; Lithuania = 3; Moldova = 3; Czech Rep = 3;
Australia = 2). This required the Russians to focus on their staff exiting overseas embassies, whilst at the
same time seeking definitive information from the UK on the poisoning itself.
8. The UK did not provide Russia with any ongoing information on the health status of the Skripals while
they were recovering in hospital (they are still Russian citizens). Updates had been requested by Russian
embassy staff from Day One.
9. Russian Embassy staff were denied access to the Skripals or to UK medical staff while the Skripals were
in hospital (denying the Russians the opportunity to verify the situation for themselves, and to discuss
the Skripals condition with UK medical staff).
10. The UK Foreign Minister (Boris Johnson) categorically stated that Porton Downs staff had been able
to verify the source of the product ("absolutely sure that it was made by Russia"), only to be quickly
contradicted and his statement denied by Porton Down management (Boris was caught out in a lie).
11. OPCW staff first arrived in London to collect Skripal samples well over a week after the UK had issued
its ultimatum to Russia (and had already initiated the expulsion of UK diplomats).
C. Political Defence Required by Russia in the Interim
1. Accusations in UK Parliament by Theresa May and Boris Johnson prior to availability of any concrete
laboratory evidence. Resistance by other politicians requesting the UK Government to await test results
was brushed aside (Jeremy Corbyn; George Galloway).
2. Unprofessional response by UK Defence Secretary Gavin Williamson ( "Putin is like Hitler"; "Russians
probably did it"; "Shut up and go home" [ Husaberg, very much like your own instruction written to me
in Danish .... very polite ...... 8-)
3. Preparation and issue of a PowerPoint slideshow to allies to justify the expulsion of Russian diplomats,
where the slideshow contained a number of completely unrelated allegations of Russian involvement -
all without any evidence to substantiate them (e.g. 2006 - Litvinenko; 2007 - DDOS attack on Estonian
Internet; 2008 - Russian response in Georgia; 2014 - MH17 airliner; 2014 - Crimea and Ukraine Donbass;
2015 - Bundestag data hack; 2015 - Danish Defence Ministry data hack; 2016 - US election meddling;
2016 - Coup attempt in Montenegro; 2017 - NotPetra ransomware cyber attacks).
D. Poisoning Location and Vector
Considerable variation on both location and vector used in the alleged poisoning over time.
1. Poisoning of Skripals by food ingested at a restaurant, then
2. Poisoning caused by being in contact with a park bench at the restaurant, then
3. Poisoning occurred in the car transporting the Skripals home, then
4. Subsequent advice by London Metropolitan Police Commissioner that poisoning had instead occurred at
the Skripals house.
This was contradicted by subsequent reports from other diners present at the restaurant, who stated that
the Skripals already appeared to be in a disoriented state back at the restaurant.
When poisoning was said to have occurred at their house:
5. Poisoning by door knob, then
6. Poisoning by Wheat bags, then
7. Poisoning via items brought back via travel luggage transported by other persons (who were apparently
not affected).
8. Guinea pigs and a cat at the Skripals home died (not by poisoning, but by their subsequent incarceration
in the house unattended without food and water). Animals were promptly cremated (samples were not taken
and made available for analysis).
9. Detective Nick Bailey (the minder poisoned at the same time as the Skripals) - was reported to still be in
"critical condition" after several weeks - yet following a reporter enquiry, he was then found to have been
released in good health (no adverse effects) well over a week earlier.
E. Treatment of Other Persons
1. The London Times reported that poison exposure had required the treatment for "up to 40 people from the
restaurant" (yet Emergency Medicine at Salisbury NHS Foundation Trust - March 14 - advised that over that
given period, no patients had experienced "nerve agent" poisoning in Salisbury, and there only three patients
had been admitted suffering from a "significant poisoning").
2. If a "nerve agent" was suspected, why were those diners at the restaurant allegedly sent to a District
Hospital - instead of either nearby Porton Downs (which apparently had chemicals able to mitigate such
poisoning) or to the University Hospital at nearby Southampton. (Both locations were far better equipped
to handle a poisoning due to a "nerve agent").
3. No action was taken to avoid harm to firemen / police / doctors attending either the restaurant or
the Skripals home (Responders were not advised to wear protective gear, despite a statement that a
"nerve agent" might be involved).
4. Once a public statement had been made via the press that a "nerve agent" was possibly involved, over
a full week elapsed before Public Health England actually advised other diners present at the restaurant
on that same day to take some action to avoid risk of poisoning from their clothing (why such a time delay
if a "nerve agent" was suspected).
5. Advice to those diners was simply to wash their clothes in warm water/detergent or to use baby wipes.
(This is hardly appropriate treatment, given the alleged Novichuk toxicity - 5 to 8x more lethal than VX -
and where only 10 milligrams of VX is required to cause death).
F. Collection and Analysis of Skripal Samples
1. The amount of "initial doubt" surrounding the timing and taking of blood and other samples from the
Skripals, and whether the chain of evidence (from the Skripals through to the lab tasked with performing
the analysis) had actually been preserved.
2. The fact that on 23 March, a UK High Court contested Boris Johnson's claims about "Russian" Novichuk
being involved, and ordered the taking of fresh samples from the Skripals (which were the ones that were
actually forwarded to OPCW).
3. The fact that "high purity" Novichuk was still found to be present in the Skripal samples supplied to the
OPCW, even though several weeks had elapsed since poisoning (the second set of samples - those sent to
OPCW - were not taken until nearly 3 weeks after the poisoning - product decomposition and elimination
should have been expected).
G. Skripals Post Recovery
1. The daughter contacted a Russian cousin by mobile pay phone and advised that she and her father had both
recovered. Cousin wished to visit. When the UK authorities found out, they contacted the cousin back to say
the daughter did not wish any contact. Daughter was not permitted contact with cousin. Denial of UK visa to
the cousin.
2. Discussions on possible creation of new identities and relocation of the Skripals to another country.
3. Russian authorities are still denied access to the Skripals even to this date.
Trust that this should be sufficient.
Cheers,
Viking
Fully qualified Sifter.
Lol. Yeah. I'd say so. Glenn won't though!
Anorak
Not really no again I asked for the changes to the british story you suggested had occured, not many if any of that list actually fit that brief now do they
so maybe stick to the origional question. Using quotes of what the british officials have said that were later contricted by other british officials. Also add in the source of the information. Then we will have something sufficent.
What is funny is you would not comment why a Russian minister might wilfully make misleading statements.
here is one of your posts you called the british account a red herring yet you still now refuse to do the same when in your own words have been proven to be totally incorrect.
Well was it accurate................
Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken
is currently sulking in the Sin Bin
He's supplied you with more than enough information to raise serious questions regarding the British involvement in this case.
That you choose to ignore it all comes as no surprise.
is currently sulking in the Sin Bin
Not by much, it would appear.
https://www.fcnl.org/updates/understanding-drones-43
is currently sulking in the Sin Bin
And an interesting perspective on America's drone programme.
https://www.johnlaurits.com/2017/hel...pending-price/
Anorak
I never asked for a heap of conspiracy theory.
I asked a clear question
He chose instead to put a text wall, only people like you become confused by these.
Some of that information he put up is repeated 3 times to puff it out.
I asked for changes to the official british version, IE such as
it was Sarin, then no sarin doesn't exist, then no we never had sarin then, no sarin is odourless, then no sarin has a pungent odour, no the test reveal it was Chlorine, the British developed chlorine, we got rid of all our Nerve agent years ago, so what if sarin wasn’t on the list. Sarin was never developed in Russia, no sarin want ever developed in the Soviet Union, no so what if it was, no the sarin lab of the Former USSR was cleaned up by the Americans.
is currently sulking in the Sin Bin
Fuck me, you're even more autistic than TDL.
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