Page 4 of 10 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 46 to 60 of 140

Thread: Take the $100,000 Global Warming Believer Challenge!

  1. #46
    Join Date
    18th February 2008 - 17:34
    Bike
    Zooks 85 GS1100G and 84 GSX1100E
    Location
    North Shore, New Zealand
    Posts
    1,082
    Quote Originally Posted by bogan View Post
    Perhaps you should google it, cos that terminology refers to slowly and gradually being exposed to a thing, not highlighted and shoved in faces, not shell shocked. I find a lot of conspiracy theorists fit the term very well.
    No need. It's just your comprehension that is out of whack.

    Put a frog in hot water it will jump out to save it self, but put it in cold water and slowly bring it to the boil and it won't even register in the frogs head that it is in trouble. It will happily boil to death.

    No matter how many times you whisper a warning in it's ear (via cranking up the temperature) the frog won't pay any attention. It will cook. May as well throw a hand grenade into the pot to try to wake the stupid fuckers up (like the shock of going from cold to hot in a big jump does). Maybe the blast will throw some of you out of the pot.
    Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.

  2. #47
    Join Date
    25th April 2009 - 17:38
    Bike
    RC36, RC31, KR-E, CR125
    Location
    Manawatu
    Posts
    7,364
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingcrocodile46 View Post
    No need. It's just your comprehension that is out of whack.

    Put a frog in hot water it will jump out to save it self, but put it in cold water and slowly bring it to the boil and it won't even register in the frogs head that it is in trouble. It will happily boil to death.

    No matter how many times you whisper a warning in it's ear (via cranking up the temperature) the frog won't pay any attention. It will cook. May as well throw a hand grenade into the pot to try to wake the stupid fuckers up (like the shock of going from cold to hot in a big jump does). Maybe the blast will throw some of you out of the pot.
    Just which bit of that did my comprehension miss? you just rewrote what I did, then scrambled to make your piss poor metaphor fit a little bit better. These are the types of gradual changes indicative of conspiracy frogs finding reasons to stay in the pot.
    "A shark on whiskey is mighty risky, but a shark on beer is a beer engineer" - Tad Ghostal

  3. #48
    Join Date
    27th September 2008 - 18:14
    Bike
    SWM RS 650R
    Location
    Richmond
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingcrocodile46 View Post

    Put a frog in hot water it will jump out to save it self, but put it in cold water and slowly bring it to the boil and it won't even register in the frogs head that it is in trouble. It will happily boil to death.
    Cheers man, thats actually a bloody great analogy for climate change deniers
    I mentioned vegetables once, but I think I got away with it...........

  4. #49
    Join Date
    25th October 2002 - 12:00
    Bike
    Old Blue, Little blue
    Location
    31.29.57.11, 116.22.22.22
    Posts
    4,859
    Quote Originally Posted by yokel View Post

    But his arguments on climate change like the issues regrading computer modelling are solid, the models are wrong so they are usless.


    “- He felt that his whole life was some kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.”

  5. #50
    Join Date
    25th October 2002 - 12:00
    Bike
    Old Blue, Little blue
    Location
    31.29.57.11, 116.22.22.22
    Posts
    4,859
    Quote Originally Posted by flyingcrocodile46 View Post
    The typical response of the ignorant but ever denying sheeple.

    When presented with solid factual evidence that the climate hoaxers (cLIEmate pseudo-scientists) have consistently fudged criteria of analysis and falsified factual data (re-balancing the scales) to suit the narrative of 'cLIEmate change/Global warming'. (Unpalatable evidence that suggests that the nipple they have so eagerly and innocently chugged on, is in fact a 'cock').

    Rather than succumb to a loss of face for being a cock sucker, or even attempting to debate the evidence, they reject it out of hand (swallow the load) then attempt to make themselves feel better about the niggling aftertaste by playing the player instead of the ball.

    As if casting aspersions on the players off field character somehow negates the fact that the player's adversary (the cock in your mouth) has consistently cheated and refused to wear protection multiple times and that the only line traversed by the adversary runs from your arse to your mouth.

    Don't be ashamed. Chug with pride.
    I follow the science. If the science is sound, and it is, no matter how often the conspiracy theorists try and rewrite and reinterpret the basic laws of physics and chemistry and pass it off as solid factual evidence, I'll tend to believe the scientific method. Deniers will never change their minds, so the main argument is trying to point people, who don't know what's actually going on and are bombarded by claim and counterclaim, to places they can find out what's what.
    AGW is not opinion, it's not dogma, it's not belief, it's a simple matter of physics and chemistry that is effecting the only planet we live on, in ways that will make it rather less comfortable to live on in the future -due mainly to mankind's bloody minded numptiness! I'm old enough, it's not going to affect me much, which is a pity....I'd like to see how things play out. Based on Paleogeograhical and climatical research, it's going to be fun!
    “- He felt that his whole life was some kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.”

  6. #51
    Join Date
    25th October 2002 - 12:00
    Bike
    Old Blue, Little blue
    Location
    31.29.57.11, 116.22.22.22
    Posts
    4,859
    Quote Originally Posted by iYRe View Post
    safest 100k ever.
    I asked an aquaintance about this, His reply....
    The prize is relatively easy to make unwinnable,and do so fairly.
    A data set containing noise of a particular type can be generated.
    That data will by chance have trends in it.
    Make sure the actual trends you add are so small they cant be detected reliably.
    Muck around some more, and make sure the odds of doing it by chance are such that the $10 entry fee means it a very good bet you will have more than 100K in entry fees before someone would guess and your done.

    To make the contest dishonest that can also be done if you want to and done in a way that is pretty much undetectable. (Well kinda)
    Create an algorithm, a PseudoNRG (see the web there's recipes) then pick seed using a real RNG .Generate your test set. Check if its quite nasty as you got lucky and the trends tended to be added to random data sets with opposite trends. If it didn't, run it again with new seed. Stop when you have problem that cant be solved.

    But as I said there is no need to do that. There are indeed limits to what size trends can be detected.

    If you don't have apriori knowledge about what the earths temperature evolution might look like, and no sanity limits on what time scales, there might just be chaotic butterfly like effects. Then there is indeed no amount of evidence that will ever be sufficient to reach statistical conclusion about climate.

    To keep his $100K, he just denies there are any limits on the size of the timescales for random noise due to factors we dont know about.
    he just presupposes the existence of an ever larger magic variation by unknown causes, until all evidence fails to show AGGC forever.
    That we in fact have such good handle on why so many climatic events happened.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RffPSrRpq_g is something he will ignore.

    That we have direct physical evidence that CO2 blocks IR radiation, and that outgoing radiation has in fact changed over time. Is something he will ignore.

    That if you do the physics of line by line analysis of the emission spectra and what happens when you add Co2 to the atmosphere, then you get a climate signal response similar to what happened.
    All that^^^^ for instance is actually in the IPPC reports yet he claims there is no basis for expecting a roughly linear increase in temps since about 1980, due to the changes that occurred in CO2.
    And while that is a low order approximation, the GCM provide comprehensive solid physical basis for the expectation of just what shape the Climate change will be.
    One of the details that has been worked out in recent years si we know the models are bad at predicting just when EL Nino will change phases. The models do change phases periodically, and in a way that looks like the real pattern of El ninos and La ninas, but being chaotic processes with strong feed backs, it does not predict just when.

    If you take climate model modelling all the basic Physics, and artificially force it to get the SST in one region of the pacific correct, then the rest of the model correctly simulates the rest of the climate, and then suddenly the model not only predicts the warming trend but now also matches the whole lot of the wiggles.

    That demonstrates that the bit the models don't get right is the timing of El nino.
    There is in fact extraordinary amounts of evidence justifying the shapes of the models used to fit Climate data.

    Pretty sure arguing with him will be about as ineffectual as arguing with some of the nay sayers I have seen on this forum. So if you felt you must I couldn't suggest you shouldn't.
    Just don't be surprised if the semi obvious happens.
    “- He felt that his whole life was some kind of dream and he sometimes wondered whose it was and whether they were enjoying it.”

  7. #52
    Join Date
    7th January 2014 - 14:45
    Bike
    Not a Hayabusa anymore
    Location
    Not Gulf Harbour Either
    Posts
    1,460
    Quote Originally Posted by SPman View Post
    I asked an aquaintance about this, His reply....
    I'm interested - any additional info from your Aquaintance? in particular the about historical causes of climate changes
    Physics; Thou art a cruel, heartless Bitch-of-a-Mistress

  8. #53
    Join Date
    18th February 2008 - 17:34
    Bike
    Zooks 85 GS1100G and 84 GSX1100E
    Location
    North Shore, New Zealand
    Posts
    1,082
    Quote Originally Posted by SPman View Post
    I follow the science. If the science is sound, and it is, no matter how often the conspiracy theorists try and rewrite and reinterpret the basic laws of physics and chemistry and pass it off as solid factual evidence, I'll tend to believe the scientific method. Deniers will never change their minds, so the main argument is trying to point people, who don't know what's actually going on and are bombarded by claim and counterclaim, to places they can find out what's what.
    AGW is not opinion, it's not dogma, it's not belief, it's a simple matter of physics and chemistry that is effecting the only planet we live on, in ways that will make it rather less comfortable to live on in the future -due mainly to mankind's bloody minded numptiness! I'm old enough, it's not going to affect me much, which is a pity....I'd like to see how things play out. Based on Paleogeograhical and climatical research, it's going to be fun!

    You are so full of shit that you going over the same crap over and over. It's not the science when you falsify (balance without disclosure) the facts. It is just simple lies told to manipulate the gullible (that's you).
    Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.

  9. #54
    Join Date
    18th February 2008 - 17:34
    Bike
    Zooks 85 GS1100G and 84 GSX1100E
    Location
    North Shore, New Zealand
    Posts
    1,082
    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemonLord View Post
    I'm interested - any additional info from your Aquaintance? in particular the about historical causes of climate changes
    Yeah! Sounds like he is very familiar with data manipulation. You know, the same sort of fine balancing and re-framing that the cLIEmate scientists have employed. Bet spam didn't ask him if the same sort of subtle manipulation can/was used to falsify the cLIEmate data (that has been debunked so often that they have to keep changing the name of the calamity).

    A funny thing happened after the ice age. Fuck no! It's only started to happen now.
    Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.

  10. #55
    Join Date
    21st August 2004 - 12:00
    Bike
    2017 Suzuki Dl1000
    Location
    Picton
    Posts
    5,162
    Quote Originally Posted by SPman View Post
    Nope. Water is just a multiplier forcing agent. CO2 does the heavy lifting.....
    Quote Originally Posted by SPman View Post
    I follow the science. ....
    I have been away at a conference for the past week, so haven't been on here and missed this thread.

    If you really followed the science then you would know that your first statement I have quoted is wrong. So very wrong. Water is a GHG in its own right. It works in a slightly different part of the spectrum to CO2, but with an overlap. Each molecule of H2O is not as efficient as CO2 in converting UV to IR, but as there is so much more H2O in the atmosphere it is the primary GHG, not CO2.

    The multiplier theory you are alluding to is that as the atmosphere warms it has a capacity to hold more H2O, and hence multiply the effect that CO2 has on the warming. That theory has already been disproven as it neglected the fact that more H2O in the atmosphere also leads to more cloud cover, which leads to less energy reaching the earth's surface, so less warming. Rather than being a multiplier, H2O is a climate regulator.

    Oh, that conference I was at was the New Zealand Hydrological conference where climate change and climate indices form a large part of the discussion.
    Time to ride

  11. #56
    Join Date
    21st August 2004 - 12:00
    Bike
    2017 Suzuki Dl1000
    Location
    Picton
    Posts
    5,162
    Here are a few questions for the warmists:

    1. If NZ was to immediately stop ALL CO2 emissions, by how much would that change NZ's projected temperature rise?

    2. How much would we have to reduce NZ's CO2 emissions by to see any measurable change in NZ's temperature?

    3. Which climate database shows the change in temperatures that most closely reflects the measured changes in rainfall and streamflows world wide?
    Time to ride

  12. #57
    Join Date
    27th September 2008 - 18:14
    Bike
    SWM RS 650R
    Location
    Richmond
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Jantar View Post
    Here are a few questions for the warmists:

    1. If NZ was to immediately stop ALL CO2 emissions, by how much would that change NZ's projected temperature rise?

    2. How much would we have to reduce NZ's CO2 emissions by to see any measurable change in NZ's temperature?

    3. Which climate database shows the change in temperatures that most closely reflects the measured changes in rainfall and streamflows world wide?
    So is flyingcroc correct then?
    I mentioned vegetables once, but I think I got away with it...........

  13. #58
    Join Date
    21st August 2004 - 12:00
    Bike
    2017 Suzuki Dl1000
    Location
    Picton
    Posts
    5,162
    Quote Originally Posted by Woodman View Post
    So is flyingcroc correct then?
    I'm not sure which of flyingcroc's posts you are referring to. Overall, he is mostly right; there are a few items and/or numbers that I don't completely agree with, but they are ones that don't change the entire premise that AGW is overhyped both in amount and affect.
    Time to ride

  14. #59
    Join Date
    20th January 2008 - 17:29
    Bike
    1972 Norton Commando
    Location
    Auckland NZ's Epicentre
    Posts
    3,554
    [QUOTE=Jantar;1130927230]Here are a few questions for the warmists:

    1. If NZ was to immediately stop ALL CO2 emissions, by how much would that change NZ's projected temperature rise?

    2. How much would we have to reduce NZ's CO2 emissions by to see any measurable change in NZ's temperature?

    3. Which climate database shows the change in temperatures that most closely reflects the measured changes in rainfall and streamflows world wide?[/QUOTE


    The polar ice is melting due to all the Penguins and Eskimo activity then...

    I imagine if NZ had 100 million people and an industry along the lines of China we might have some local impact.

    The changing water temperatures of the Pacific are what is affecting NZ.
    DeMyer's Laws - an argument that consists primarily of rambling quotes isn't worth bothering with.

  15. #60
    Join Date
    21st August 2004 - 12:00
    Bike
    2017 Suzuki Dl1000
    Location
    Picton
    Posts
    5,162
    Quote Originally Posted by Voltaire View Post

    The polar ice is melting due to all the Penguins and Eskimo activity then...
    Is it? That is new. I haven't read any papers that suggest penguins and/or Eskimo activity is causing polar ice to melt. Do you have a reference for that? In fact do you have a reference that shows that Antarctic ice is even decreasing at all? Do you have a reference that shows that Arctic ice volume has NOT been increasing over the past 4 years?

    Quote Originally Posted by Voltaire View Post
    I imagine if NZ had 100 million people and an industry along the lines of China we might have some local impact.
    But as we don't have 100 million people then are you saying we have no local impact? If that is the case then why is there such a push for NZ to cut emissions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Voltaire View Post
    The changing water temperatures of the Pacific are what is affecting NZ.
    I fully agree with you. In fact there is a paper being published in this months Journal of Hydrology NZ that makes just that point. (Taylor & Bardsley, 2015: Journal of Hydrology (NZ) 54 (2): 115-124 2015)
    Last edited by Jantar; 6th December 2015 at 13:58.
    Time to ride

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •