Rule change submissions close 1 March 2016 - be in to win.

[FastFred]

Hi Henk You are seriously beating a dead horse here! As I have stated before the leaf blower guy has moved on.

To be honest Belinda I am not sure it was Henk who beat the horse to death, but thank you for promoting a discussion that clarified the status of pitbikes. Glad to hear you have moved on to racing something more appropriate.

[bucketracer]

Attachment 320248

The underlying ethos of Buckets is to take a non competition bike/engine and make something of it.

Attachment 320249

A Bucket can be as simple as a FXR150 with the road gear stripped off and ridden for shits and giggles. And that is enough for some people. Others might like to take it a little further and fit more suitable wheels and slicks and then there are the tuning crazies like myself.

Buckets is about making something from a bike that was not originally intended for competition, the defining requirement is having to make changes to the original purpose of the bike.

Attachment 320237

It is hard to think of a pitbike as a serious competition machine but it fails the Bucket legal test because it is a purpose built bike, made to be ridden in competitive events with no work required. To compete with it you do not have to make any changes to its original purpose and that is what puts it off side legally with Buckets.

Organizers and particularly the steward carry quite a legal liability if things go wrong at a meeting. So it is pretty easy to see that allowing an inappropriate bike on the track that is then involved in an injury incident would leave them very legally exposed. That alone justifies the organizers right to be picky about what bikes are Bucket and track appropriate.

So as I see it Belinda there are two requirements, not only does it have to be Bucket legal, maybe more importantly the organizers have to be comfortable with it or they are within their rights to not let it out on the track.

Obvious when its spelled out .....

[BelindaS]

Obvious when its spelled out .....

Hi bucketracer

Here is a little test for just you. And the question is !!!!

What engine is in this road legal bike?
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

And to make it as easy as I can for you. Is it this engine from the same site.
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...155hocrate.htm

Is it YES or NO!

[bucketracer]

Hi bucketracer

Here is a little test for just you. And the question is !!!!

What engine is in this road legal bike?
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

And to make it as easy as I can for you. Is it this engine from the same site.
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...155hocrate.htm

Is it YES or NO!

The real question is, and this is just a question for you! are the organizers comfortable with it..... Is it YES or NO!

In the end the organizers have a right to refuse entry to whatever makes them feel uncomfortable.l

[Drew]

Hi bucketracer

Here is a little test for just you. And the question is !!!!

What engine is in this road legal bike?
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

And to make it as easy as I can for you. Is it this engine from the same site.
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...155hocrate.htm

Is it YES or NO!

That's black and white. Motor from a road bike, legal for buckets as long as it's inside the capacity limit. Since motors are being built left and right at the over bore limit, due to off the shelf piston availability , run it like it is and wait for a protest.

[bucketracer]

Buckets is about making something from a bike that was not originally intended for competition, the defining requirement is having to make changes to the original purpose of the bike.

Attachment 320237

It is hard to think of a pitbike as a serious competition machine but it fails the Bucket legal test because it is a purpose built bike, made to be ridden in competitive events with no work required. To compete with it you do not have to make any changes to its original purpose and that is what puts it off side legally with Buckets.

Maybe if the engine by itself is found to be legal, like purchased as a crate engine with the same specs as an overseas road legal mini bike and the rolling chassis by itself is certainly legal but probably not appropriate for Buckets. Use the engine in something else like a FXR chassis, or buy a pitbike chassis of Trade me for $5 and fit an FXR150 motor or something like a TF/TS125 to it, you would have something because both scenarios look like they could be legit, although they maybe not that welcome.

What you cant do is pickup a cheap pitbike rolling chassis and fit a pitbike engine sourced from somewhere else because that is just a restored pitbike.

And to make it as easy as I can for you Belinda. I have quoted TZ again.

[mr bucketracer]

And to make it as easy as I can for you. I have quoted TZ again.

Belinda are you reading any of this, or are you just enjoying flapping your gums. Is it YES or NO!

you...................

[Bert]

The real question is, and this is just a question for you! are the organizers comfortable with it..... Is it YES or NO!

That's black and white. Motor from a road bike, legal for buckets as long as it's inside the capacity limit. Since motors are being built left and right at the over bore limit, due to off the shelf piston availability , run it like it is and wait for a protest.

Go back three pages and I'm sure I point that out too.
No different to grabbing a C90 and grafting a XL200 cylinder and head (or a GY150 scooter cylinder &head).

I'd really be concerned about the class/sport if this type of engine was not allowed to be grafted into a roller (FXR etc.). I don't know why you would ever consider it but, but that up to you.

But if you are a constant dickhead about things - then I wouldn't hold anything against any organiser for telling you to fuck off. Don't forget your entry doesn't need to be accepted & the code of conduct that all riders have to adher too f your entry is accepted (you signed the entry form - adher to the rules). Worthy of note - riders can be banned very easily (breaches of the code of conduct are actually the easiest to action)..

AM6 motors.... Now that's another can of worms. But given their wide spread use from little road engines to miniMX: it's almost impossible to not allow them under the same pretence... Forget about the designation or name on the side of the engine - they are all the same.

[BelindaS]

And to make it as easy as I can for you Belinda. I have quoted TZ again.

Hi Bucketracer you failed to answer the question.

lets try this again!! One more time. Is this engine, in this bike, if the motor was de-stroked to below 150cc. Legal YES or NO
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

Bucketracer. Please read Drew's reply

That's black and white. Motor from a road bike, legal for buckets as long as it's inside the capacity limit. Since motors are being built left and right at the over bore limit, due to off the shelf piston availability , run it like it is and wait for a protest.

Thank you Drew for your reply

[bucketracer]

Hi Bucketracer you failed to answer the question. lets try this again!! One more time. Is this engine, in this bike, if the motor was de-stroked to below 150cc. Legal YES or NO http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

Belinda ...... you failed to answer the question lets try this again!! One more time.

The real question is, and this is just a question for you! are the organizers comfortable with it..... Is it YES or NO!

[BelindaS]

Go back three pages and I'm sure I point that out too.
No different to grabbing a C90 and grafting a XL200 cylinder and head (or a GY150 scooter cylinder &head).

I'd really be concerned about the class/sport if this type of engine was not allowed to be grafted into a roller (FXR etc.). I don't know why you would ever consider it but, but that up to you.

But if you are a constant dickhead about things - then I wouldn't hold anything against any organiser for telling you to fuck off. Don't forget your entry doesn't need to be accepted & the code of conduct that all riders have to adher too f your entry is accepted (you signed the entry form - adher to the rules). Worthy of note - riders can be banned very easily (breaches of the code of conduct are actually the easiest to action)..

AM6 motors.... Now that's another can of worms. But given their wide spread use from little road engines to miniMX: it's almost impossible to not allow them under the same pretence... Forget about the designation or name on the side of the engine - they are all the same.

Hi Bert.

The decision to not only ban the engine but the bike as well, was done with no consultation with use at all.

As I have stated earlier we have moved on with a FXR.

But bucketracer was goading with his replies so asked him a simple question. He is unable to answer the question. His choice.

some get it some don't

[Bert]

Belinda ...... you failed to answer the question lets try this again!! One more time.

Settle petal. Going around in circles (both sides) is quite boring, the thread is a little bigger than this discussion.

Hi Bert.

The decision to not only ban the engine but the bike as well, was done with no consultation with use at all.
As I have stated earlier we have moved on with a FXR.
But bucketracer was goading with his replies so asked him a simple question. He is unable to answer the question. His choice.
some get it some don't

Well I made my view about pitbikes long ago, they fall outside the intent of the class.
Happy riding with them if clubs let them in - happy if they are in their own class - happy if they do their own thing.
Not a reflection on the people riding them - just the bikes.
I always felt it would and in tears at some stage.
MNZ have now made a ruling so everyone has to suck that up (there is no consultation process - when this happens). no matter what view you hold.

Bucketracer isn't MNZ nor the one pulling the strings - so if you think he (and 90% of the rest of us) really have all the answers: that really hold any weight (then you're deluded).
In fact Bugger all people on the thread/forum can answer those questions.
Email the club for their thoughts on the topic (constructively); if you are a member then they would likely reply with their interpretation/application of the Rules and rulings (they may even suggest contacting MNZ or be party to that conversation if they feel they can not provide a suitable answer. Be aware - no is also an answer... It is risk management and up to the club how they submit permits and run events - not the riders)...

If you are not a member of the club and/or hold an MNZ licence: then you should consider where your views/issues or what ever: sit in the pecking order. If you don't have one or both then you are not contributing to the sport, thus you just need to take it as it comes...

Can I suggest starting a new thread.

[bucketracer]

Email the club for their thoughts on the topic (constructively).

Using Belindas own words in the hope she may understand them, I have been suggesting the same thing myself.

The real question is, and this is just a question for you! are the organizers comfortable with it..... Is it YES or NO!

And

Can I suggest starting a new thread.

Belinda hijacked this one, happy to continue to solicit some meaningful answers from her on her own thread.

[jasonu]

Hi bucketracer

Here is a little test for just you. And the question is !!!!

What engine is in this road legal bike?
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

And to make it as easy as I can for you. Is it this engine from the same site.
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...155hocrate.htm

Is it YES or NO!

Is it road legal in NZ?????
Is it YES or NO!

You can ride am RM85 on the roads in Nigeria but that doesn't make it road legal or non competition in NZ.
Seriously Belinda, even if you did get your shitty bike OK'ed to race in Buckets how do you think you will be welcomed at the track after all this bullshit you have stirred up and all the shouting you and your dick mates have done at organizers like Henk? I seriously doubt you will be made to feel welcome.

[cotswold]

Hi bucketracer

Here is a little test for just you. And the question is !!!!

What engine is in this road legal bike?
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...55-12-2015.htm

And to make it as easy as I can for you. Is it this engine from the same site.
http://www.factorypowerhouse.com/Pit...155hocrate.htm

Is it YES or NO!

Try this one Bell's,

one is a full on 500 MX bike the other is a road legal commuter I built out of a full on 500 mx bike are they the same ?? ( though that may be the 250 I built first for the trial run )