Akaroa GP rant

[swbarnett]

The safest way to ride in my opinion is to ride your own line and keep an eye out on all hazards and the lead rider could end up being one of them too.

While true there is a strong caveat to this. How the H.E.Double Toothpicks is a learner^* supposed to learn good lines if not from another rider? All that is required is to keep enough of a gap so that if the lead rider gets into trouble it's obvious to even the absolute novice that this time taking the same line (or any line at all) is not a good idea.





^*That's all of us in one way or another.

[Gremlin]

While true there is a strong caveat to this. How the H.E.Double Toothpicks is a learner^* supposed to learn good lines if not from another rider?

Ideally a learner is getting professional instruction / attending some courses and gaining this information...

[swbarnett]

Ideally a learner is getting professional instruction / attending some courses and gaining this information...

Ideally yes. But professional tuition can only go so far. Hopefully though, this will teach a rider to not just blindly follow the lines of the rider in front.

[rastuscat]

While true there is a strong caveat to this. How the H.E.Double Toothpicks is a learner^* supposed to learn good lines if not from another rider?

The problems are compression and target fixation.

When you are following someone, instead of looking through corners, theres a tendency to get fixated on the rider ahead. It's easy to creep up on them too, as your fixation draws you in.

We coach people to look through corners, and make sure you have the rider ahead of you in your peripheral vision, not your central vision. That way you can stay focussed on the limit point, yet still see the rider ahead.

It's worthy of proper coaching to mention these things before you start leading a newbie out to show them the way to ride.

[Drew]

While the term "good line" may be something that applies to the track the only "good line" that "generally" applies to the road is not going off the road or crossing the centre line. I did not have to be taught that, however I would need a lesson if I wished to race on the track.

That's not the case. Turn in point and line are important for maximum control and safety margin are still important on the road. It's not the same as the fastest line of course, but it matters.

[swbarnett]

The problems are compression and target fixation.

When you are following someone, instead of looking through corners, theres a tendency to get fixated on the rider ahead. It's easy to creep up on them too, as your fixation draws you in.

We coach people to look through corners, and make sure you have the rider ahead of you in your peripheral vision, not your central vision. That way you can stay focussed on the limit point, yet still see the rider ahead.

It's worthy of proper coaching to mention these things before you start leading a newbie out to show them the way to ride.

Agreed. Still, as long as you keep your distance and concentrate primarily on getting around the corner I don't see a problem with observing from behind how someone else does it.

[Maha]

Agreed. Still, as long as you keep your distance and concentrate primarily on getting around the corner I don't see a problem with observing from behind how someone else does it.

Worked for me, and has worked for others since, a number of newer riders brushed up on their cornering technique on those those Northland rides doing exactly that.

[trufflebutter]

Also maybe new riders should be allowed to develop confidence riding on their own before tackling group rides.

Because there is a lot more to think about (following distance/sight/road position/other riders overtaking you to name a few) when riding in group right? In saying that, there also can be a lot gained from riding in a group situation for newer riders, such as the bracketed points above.

If a group ride is done well and everyone in the group taken into consideration then I don't see why not.
Trouble is though, some newer riders can to be all to keen to become advance riders and not looking like twats in their own mind and, that's when things can come unstuck.

[trufflebutter]

One issue that has not been touched on is that most group riders visit pubs on their rides and once alcohol has been consumed the ride can end up being more dangerous irrespective of riding ability.

True enough but ...Pubs and Taverns are a better suited to feed and accommodate a group of 20+ riders comfortably, rather than a four tabled cafe.

[AllanB]

Shit I'd not want to be learning following most of the riders on the GP. Vast amount follow cars way to closely (also guilty at times).

[Drew]

One issue that has not been touched on is that most group riders visit pubs on their rides and once alcohol has been consumed the ride can end up being more dangerous irrespective of riding ability.

Mu'fuckers are meant to be adults. Someone can't handle their shit, it's their problem.

[eldog]

It's where you place yourself on the road (particularly through a corner as per the thread topic) that counts. I followed a mate for a day's riding about eight years ago, his lines were outstanding and noticeably different than the track I was using at that time. I started using his lines early on that day and noticed almost instantly that a faster/smoother corner speed was achievable. Riding a bike seemed different/better with way less 'oh bugger' moments. Thank you John Baine.

There is only so much an instructor can teach to a group at any one time, nothing can compare to one on one tuition for the ultimate outcome.

The Photo below, though posted earlier, clearly demonstrates the way NOT to corner on a motorcycle.


https://www.facebook.com/24833050867...type=3&theater

Yep, I find myself doing that on the odd occasion(pissed off), just trying to correct that myself.

Recently I tried to ride wide close 0.5m to the centre line on a left hand blind tight turn. There was a bus coming the other way cutting across the centreline. Exact opposite to FB pic.

Being able to change lines quickly mid corner is a skill I have yet to learn.

Slowly getting confidence in my riding so I can ride wider and move in once I can see around the corner proper.

[eldog]

Worked for me, and has worked for others since, a number of newer riders brushed up on their cornering technique on those those Northland rides doing exactly that.

Its something I have been trying, but practise time is limited.

[eldog]

That's not the case. Turn in point and line are important for maximum control and safety margin are still important on the road. It's not the same as the fastest line of course, but it matters.

Turn in point and line are important for maximum control and safety margin.
I don't seem to have a turn in point, just seem to 'me' long arcs.

I will ask someone (experienced) who follows me next time if I do have a turn in point and what they think of my riding position etc

I don't need race speed, want better control=better position on road=confidence

[eldog]

I've been watching my own riding.
Like any "technique". Done properly it's not a problem.

I have seen you go passed me a few times while I was parked up on the SW motorway.
Your technique looks good.
Just watch out for those idiot car drivers in front-they can change lanes any moment...