Stranded, but a happy ending.

[oldiebutagoody]

So like, after grappling with a handling issue for several wet weekends, and having finally had an epiphany moment after work today, I decided I would stretch the Bandits legs since it no longer harboured the desire to send me down the road at every roundabout and slow/any corner.

Suit up and pile on some throttle heading East from Massey over to the Shore on the upper harbour motorway.....yippee tracks straight and true......OK, give it a bit more on the return run and...........splutter splutter........oooh. Coast to a stop in the semi darkness on the side of the motorway.

Long story short a very nice chap called Paul stopped on my second breakdown on the trig rd offramp, and shepherded me a further two breakdowns all the way home. Said he used to be a biker in Welly a few years ago but Aucks is too busy for him. Rather decent of him though, nd him and his wife will be getting a bottle of wine and some choc tomorrow night as a thankyou.

Soooo, just to check my diagnostics:

Bandit 1200 mk1 1996 carb model.

Electrics all working fine.
Would start and run perfectly after sitting 5 mins.
Time running perfectly would vary between 1-2km depending on engine revs maintained until next breakdown. Higher revs= shorter time before coming to a stop.
Felt like running out of fuel, but dropping cylinders until would not run and coast to stop.
Really rich smell from exhaust after stopping.

I am guessing, as I have just made it home and its dark outside so I have not looked into anything as yet, but gut feeling is either stuck float needle, or faulty float. It is intermittent though and this is the first time it has behaved badly since buying it a couple Months ago. On long rides it has been over-fuelling a little though, so both options are still on the table.

I'll rip into the carbs, as it was next on the list of things to do, honest your honour. Have decided not to dick around so will order new float needles, use the clear tube test to see if the floats shut off, and check float height settings. All told not a biggie as its not my daily drive/ride.

So am I thinking along the right lines fellas.

[caspernz]

Description of fault makes me think fuel filter near clogged.

[awayatc]

Description of fault makes me think fuel filter near clogged.

Sounds like a good place to start.....
Also look for blocked air vent on tank itself?

Fuel out/air in....

Good luck....
Good you got help

[nzspokes]

Check tank vent and tank filter. Also on a Bandit it is easy to kink the fuel line so make sure its clear.

And try it on Prime.

[AllanB]

Sounds like a bloody excuse to buy a new bike to me

[oldiebutagoody]

Description of fault makes me think fuel filter near clogged.

Yeah nah I had that out about 6 weeks ago, so while not keen on that theory I will add it to the process elimination list, .....again.

Sounds like a good place to start.....
Also look for blocked air vent on tank itself?

Fuel out/air in....

Good luck....
Good you got help

Good easy first up step. I'll deal to the fuel cap vent and see if it makes a difference. I'd read about that a while ago, so it may or may not be the case sp might as well eliminate it eh.

Check tank vent and tank filter. Also on a Bandit it is easy to kink the fuel line so make sure its clear.

And try it on Prime.

Yeah tries priming while stuck on the motoway and it just spit n backfired until it sat for a while. Initially I thought it was timing/CDI stuffed as I had just gone over the bumps downside of the bridge and twas a tad bumpy, and remembered a CDI on an impulse years back that shat itself over bumps. (CDI in same place over rear wheel) but its not that.

I'll check the fuel line too. Cheers for that thought.

Sounds like a bloody excuse to buy a new bike to me

yeah yeah yeah lol.

[oldiebutagoody]

Ok, so an update.

I have a carb kit coming on a slow boat from EU.

Started the strip and clean.

Some things stood out while I was playing "one of these things is not like the others". No screwdriver marks at all on any of the soft JIS screws (there are vice grip marks now so allen head bolts going back in). Carb boot clamps were slightly loose, enough to rotate slightly by hand. One float needle was missing its retaining clip that holds it to the tang. One idle mixture jet had the o-ring and washer transposed. Petrol marks (from the carb with the missing float needle clip) on the inside of the airbox from freshly dribbled fuel, which would have affected the air/fuel mixture on all carbs.

About a 5mm layer of red sediment in the bottom of the bowls, and throughout the emulsion tube and jets etc. Jet needles and emulsion tube orifice look good with no sign of wear or marking.

Everything including the rubber tips on the float needles and o-rings look good and all in order otherwise. I could slam it back together but will wait for the replacement float needles and o-rings and then have peace of mind.

What I saw "could" be the cause of the breakdown and intermittent overfuelling problems I had with one cylinder in particular, and the sediment wouldn't have helped. The breather hose might have got kinked when I reinstalled the tank, but it did 100km that day before this particular problem occurred. I'll go over that and clear it out when I reinstall carbs again.

Strange the float needle was missing its retaining clip?

Oh and the float heights were spot on.....and petcock runs petrol strongly on prime.

[F5 Dave]

Are any plugs darker than the others? If so emulsion tubes are worn which is common in this carb. But this won't cause it to stop like that.

Only few times that has happened to me it has been the aftermarket fuel filter kinking the hose enough so it gets enough fuel to cope until on the motorway. Replace it with plain line. Fuel silting it tank rust and no filter is fine enough to really stop it. Sealant is the option. However if tank has been sealed it can block tank breathers.

[oldiebutagoody]

Are any plugs darker than the others? If so emulsion tubes are worn which is common in this carb. But this won't cause it to stop like that.

Only few times that has happened to me it has been the aftermarket fuel filter kinking the hose enough so it gets enough fuel to cope until on the motorway. Replace it with plain line. Fuel silting it tank rust and no filter is fine enough to really stop it. Sealant is the option. However if tank has been sealed it can block tank breathers.

Emulsion tubes are like new. had a good close inspection of the orifices.

Lots and lots of red rust sediment. It was not only in the bowls but up around the emulsion tubes sitting in great globs in the cavity around them.

There's no aftermarket filter in place.

I haven't pulled the plugs since this happened, as new plugs went in barely 150km ago. I;ll have a look at them after I rebuild carbs and refit just to be sure. It stopped again right at the top of the drive and I coasted down and switched it off, so whatever state they are in should indicate lean or fouled at the time it stopped.

Gasket and float needle kit should only be a day or two away now so will spend the weekend on it and see what result I get. Am fairly sure at this point it was a lot of crap jammed the float needle that had no clip on the tang, flooding and overflowing into the airbox while the petcock was feeding the carbs, then sort of solved the fuel/air mix imbalance after sitting a few minutes when the petcock shut off and stopped pouring fuel through the stuck open float valve.

It had an incredibly rich smell of unburnt fuel out of the exhaust after stopping, which sort of indicates to me it was flooding not starving.

I'll also drain the tank and soak it in white vinegar for 24 hours. Cheap enough and cannot harm it.

Cheers for the input :-)

[nzspokes]

Check to see if the oil level has increased. And wip the oil filler cap off and sniff the oil for a petrol smell.

[oldiebutagoody]

So hopefully its the last update.

Got the carb kit yesterday after it sat with NZPost for a week.

Reassembled today, did a leak test which it passed, but I suspected a faulty float needle or valve among the new parts, and when testing how it filled the bowl it indeed was a sticky one. Pulled it and reinstalled the best of the old and it is now functioning perfectly. Had to adjust float level.

Reinstalling the carb bank back into the bike went smoother than I was expecting as I did a bit of reading up over the last week.

Bike started after I remembered to set the idle adjustment screw, and blip the throttle with choke. After the first start it started and ran very smoothly first time every time. Revs freely.

Was dark when I finished, so no test ride today. I'll leave that until daylight hours just in case, ......just in case......

All that should be left to do is to check if I have to alter the clip on the needle jet again now it is not over-fuelling it might be just a tad lean low to mid range.

Stock everything currently, so if it is all tickety boo I can look into putting the two Bros exhaust back on and adjusting carburetion according at my leisure. I wanted to start from stock condition to diagnose what was actually going wrong with it, as who knows what the last owner/owners had done. It was a head scratcher for a few days there.

I would not recommend "Touratec" parts as the quality of the float valves and needles were poor. Gaskets etc were fine but was disappointed in the difference between OEM and the parts supplied. Live and learn. Rock on........