Feminists going full retard.

[WristTwister]

You know last time I checked, women gave birth to 100% of human babies.

Funny thing is there was a chick studying to be a vet when doing our antenatal class. Wonder how she's doing right now?

Yep, and men are completely capable of raising those babies.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Really? I've rarely heard either viewpoint expressed.

it might not be expressed that often, but the attitude is there. Talk to some women lawyers some time. I have.

[mossy1200]

Yep, and men are completely capable of raising those babies.

Unless there is a custody battle in which case men would want to start a maninist group.

[mossy1200]

When a company promotes a women over a man solely to avoid being labeled sexist then that is a win for the Feminist movement.
Most feminists are not about equality at all.

[WristTwister]

When a company promotes a women over a man solely to avoid being labeled sexist then that is a win for the Feminist movement.
Most feminists are not about equality at all.

Feminism has always been about giving women the same rights and opportunities as men. You may not have realised this, but for centuries men have been promoted over women because women were considered less capable than men. Now more women are getting offered these opportunities and you cry foul?

[TheDemonLord]

Feminism has always been about giving women the same rights and opportunities as men. You may not have realised this, but for centuries men have been promoted over women because women were considered less capable than men. Now more women are getting offered these opportunities and you cry foul?

Men get promoted over women because Penis = Sexism
Women get promoted over Men because Vagina = Yay! Equality!

D'yah see the double standard?

I prefer this system:

Competent person gets promoted over less competent person because meritocracy.

And out of curiosity - since it's about Equal rights - can you name some rights that I have (as a Man) that you lack as a woman?

Cause I can think of a few rights you as a Woman have that I don't - but I don't seem to remember any Feminists marching down Queen Street to protest this...

[husaberg]

Given the original quote refers to vets, staying on topic (a novelty...) our secondary income is small animal breeding.
I consider therefore I have an expert opinion on the matter....
90% of the time we deal with female vets. I'd sooner have a female vet attend to our stock than a male.

The only male vet in our area I'll work with is almost as old and decrepit as me....and is a bloody good greyhound tuner I'm told.

When it comes to large animal vets, just as many male vets have physical problems as female when handling stock.
It's impossible to generalise in that area.

I will, generally the female vets shy away from large animal practice after having a family, likely due to the hours and nights and on call etc.
Also genarally they are it seems not willing to buy into the pratices, this along with economies has lead to the almagmations of practices.

The most annoying thing is that when Men try and talk about Men's issues - the other side brings up people like Yokel to discredit us.

Unfortunately true.

The whole thing keeps coming back to the perennial issue of women training (often at great expense and for many years) for jobs which at some point will be interrupted by having children.
Having kids is obviously not the sole reason for a woman to leave their job but traditionally childbirth and rearing has caused much angst when in competition with employment.
Women who choose to forgo having children in order to focus on a career often given a hard time; women who put careers on ice for the years they feel necessary to bring up children get it in the neck for having the audacity to take jobs off blokes and then toss it in to pop out sprogs.
Ya just can't win!

Princess as you are a teacher, maybe you can shed some light.
20-30 Years ago the academic achievement was pretty similar regardless of gender.
There were pretty similar ratios of male to female teachers within primary schools.
Nowadays i have noticed there is very few male primary teachers (actually only two at my children’s 400 child school, and one of those rarely teaches)
The male children, now seem to perform academically poorly, compared to the female children.
Is it the curriculum changes not suiting the male children? or could it be the teachers not being able to relate to how male children learn differently?
I realise there was a push to impove the females academic performance, Has it gone to far?
There is no difference between IQ or gender as far as i am aware.
What are your observations?

[WristTwister]

Men get promoted over women because Penis = Sexism
Women get promoted over Men because Vagina = Yay! Equality!

D'yah see the double standard?

I prefer this system:

Competent person gets promoted over less competent person because meritocracy.

And out of curiosity - since it's about Equal rights - can you name some rights that I have (as a Man) that you lack as a woman?

Cause I can think of a few rights you as a Woman have that I don't - but I don't seem to remember any Feminists marching down Queen Street to protest this...

Meritocracy is ideal, provided the merits aren't biased towards one gender. As for rights, how about the right to be paid the same as a male (all things being equal of course). The right to be selected for a senior position without having sexist comments assuming things like "she only got the job because 'vagina=yay'". The right to a job without the risk of being turned down if I decide to have a child sometime in the future. Generally just the right not to have to defend why women deserve the same pay and opportunities as men without men making snide remarks about feminism.

[TheDemonLord]

Meritocracy is ideal, provided the merits aren't biased towards one gender.

And what about the Nordic Paradox then? The most free and egalitarian societies on earth, that have undergone nearly 30 years of social engineering - And yet - Most Nordic women are more happy to go into lower paid caring fields (nursing, Child care etc.) or stay home with the kids.

Compare it to say India (where there is most definitely something that could be described as a Patriarchal society) where women are entering the field of Engineering at an equal rate as Men (because getting a degree in Engineering is a means to an end)

As for rights, how about the right to be paid the same as a male (all things being equal of course).

You have that - Equal pay act of 1972. Not only that, but assuming you are referring to the Wage Gap - once you factor in all the relevant factors which would determine an individuals worth to a company (education, Hours worked, Years experience etc. etc.) the wage gap shrinks to virtually nothing.

The right to be selected for a senior position without having sexist comments assuming things like "she only got the job because 'vagina=yay'".

So a real world example - in the STEM fields, I believe the hiring bias is something like 2:1 - ie a Woman has twice the likelyhood of being hired vs an equally qualified Male (once all other factors have been accounted for) - this is as a direct result of various 'Affirmative Sexism' policies - I put it to you then, if you want that 'right' - then stop demanding preferential hiring/treatment because 'vagina'. Earn you place like everyone else does, and people will stop questioning how you got the job.

The right to a job without the risk of being turned down if I decide to have a child sometime in the future.

You have that right already - Human Rights act of 1993.

On a related note - You have the right to Maternity leave and to have your job held open for you. Guess how much Paternity leave a father is entitled to in NZ? I'll give you a clue - its between 1 and -1.

Generally just the right not to have to defend why women deserve the same pay and opportunities as men without men making snide remarks about feminism.

When women work the same job, with the same qualification, with the same years experience, for the same hours, taking the same amount of holiday - Guess what?

You get paid the SAME!

The snide remarks about Feminism is because Feminism is still trying to tell you that you earn 77c on the dollar - despite this being based on the most lazy averaging method, that completely disregards any of the factors that can influence what you get paid.

Sources can be provided if needed.

[Akzle]

it might not be expressed that often, but the attitude is there. Talk to some women lawyers some time. I have.

ja dude, i think he meant actual humans...

[Akzle]

Feminism has always been about giving women the same rights and opportunities as men. You may not have realised this, but for centuries men have been promoted over women because women were considered less capable than men. Now more women are getting offered these opportunities and you cry foul?

it's not the opportunities being bemoaned, it's the outcomes. a vagina is not a qualificiation, and pandering to fill a vagina quota (or a black one, or a retard one, or whatever else) is discriminatory.

now get back in the kitchen, byatch. men are talking about serious shit.

[mossy1200]

Feminism has always been about giving women the same rights and opportunities as men. You may not have relised this, but for centuries men have been promoted over women because women were considered less capable than men. Now more women are getting offered these opportunities and you cry foul?

I really do not care who has what job and at what pay rate because what they negotiate is none of my business.
I find it interesting that feminist groups fight for equality at the top end of the workplace and ignore other workplace positions in less desirable jobs.
I find it interesting when workplaces feel pressure to promote based on anything other than skills.
I think its interesting that Hillary Clinton tried using the vote for Americas first lady President as if that was a Trump card.

[mossy1200]

[yokel]

Feminism has always been about giving women the same rights and opportunities as men. You may not have realised this, but for centuries men have been promoted over women because women were considered less capable than men. Now more women are getting offered these opportunities and you cry foul?

Yes that's what the feminist brochure says.
But the reality is quite different.
It does not mean women somehow should be paid the same or work the same jobs as men, because they are less capable.

Having the same number of female CEOs or God forbid politicians makes about as much sense as having the prison population being 50% female compared to the current 6%

The male role is providing resource, the female role is pumping out and taking care of the kids.

It's what women are designed for, the wife freaks out when I try to breast feed the baby.

The fact is women are overly emotional illogical insane insecure weak the list goes on creatures.

People with a functional brain will realise that I'm speaking in the general.

Look at the social damage this feminist bull shit has done, people don't even know what a female is anymore.

And the idiots are teaching that gender identity nonsense to innocent kids for fuck sake.

[bogan]

And what about the Nordic Paradox then? The most free and egalitarian societies on earth, that have undergone nearly 30 years of social engineering - And yet - Most Nordic women are more happy to go into lower paid caring fields (nursing, Child care etc.) or stay home with the kids.

Compare it to say India (where there is most definitely something that could be described as a Patriarchal society) where women are entering the field of Engineering at an equal rate as Men (because getting a degree in Engineering is a means to an end)



You have that - Equal pay act of 1972. Not only that, but assuming you are referring to the Wage Gap - once you factor in all the relevant factors which would determine an individuals worth to a company (education, Hours worked, Years experience etc. etc.) the wage gap shrinks to virtually nothing.



So a real world example - in the STEM fields, I believe the hiring bias is something like 2:1 - ie a Woman has twice the likelyhood of being hired vs an equally qualified Male (once all other factors have been accounted for) - this is as a direct result of various 'Affirmative Sexism' policies - I put it to you then, if you want that 'right' - then stop demanding preferential hiring/treatment because 'vagina'. Earn you place like everyone else does, and people will stop questioning how you got the job.



You have that right already - Human Rights act of 1993.

On a related note - You have the right to Maternity leave and to have your job held open for you. Guess how much Paternity leave a father is entitled to in NZ? I'll give you a clue - its between 1 and -1.



When women work the same job, with the same qualification, with the same years experience, for the same hours, taking the same amount of holiday - Guess what?

You get paid the SAME!

The snide remarks about Feminism is because Feminism is still trying to tell you that you earn 77c on the dollar - despite this being based on the most lazy averaging method, that completely disregards any of the factors that can influence what you get paid.

Sources can be provided if needed.

It seems that, while you recognise yokel is a poor/extremist advocate for 'anti-feminism' (or other name of your choice); your arguments put forward the views of extremist feminists as strawmen.

NZ has got it pretty right in regard to the legal aspects, women do desrve special treatment around the issue of childbirth to ensure they have equal opportunities. What some people in NZ haven't yet figured out (and this would be the thread topic), is that women are worth the same as men, and there should be no distinction between them made throughout the education or employment process to affect their career prospects besides that based purely on aptitude.

I would like to see that 2:1 STEM hiring bias data, and think it worth re-stating that not all feminists push the 77c on the dollar thing.