1st to 2nd Conundrums

[nzrobj]

One guy who teaches on here says it can take up to 2 years to learn to ride at his school to an advanced level which in my opinion is nuts. When he and a guy from another school both answered the same question on here about cornering I found the guy that said it takes 2 years to ride at his school gave the best answer of the 2 though which did appear to reflect the way I rode anyway.

Two years to learn how to ride is an awful long time and a lot of money by the sounds of it! What I will say is that I do believe that after two years of riding one would still be learning and aquiring better skills.. even after many years this would still be the case, as with any other skill you practice.

[george formby]

Two years to learn how to ride is an awful long time and a lot of money by the sounds of it! What I will say is that I do believe that after two years of riding one would still be learning and aquiring better skills.. even after many years this would still be the case, as with any other skill you practice.

Indeed, learning never stops. It never gets cheaper either. lol.

If memory serves this 2 year thing was about reaching the loftiest of IAM pinnacles, which is very highly skilled indeed. Don't rely too much on my memory..

[FJRider]

You will get from this site that everyone is into riding schools except me because they were not around in my day.

You're still alive (the gods must be smiling on you) and still riding (that you're actually riding is yet to be confirmed by reliable witnesses) so you are still eligible to take a course on your little 750 ...

I actually only had one fall that could have been put down to not going to riding school and that was coming off when braking on the downhill of a bridge where it was wet and I may have hit a white line on the road or applied too much front brake.

Stuff like that is (and always has been) learned in the bitter and tough course of experience ...

One guy who teaches on here says it can take up to 2 years to learn to ride at his school to an advanced level which in my opinion is nuts. When he and a guy from another school both answered the same question on here about cornering

Most Riding schools have a series of courses that require riders to take in stages. With an assessment prior to courses being started. this ensures rides do not claim to be better than their actual skill level. Many years of holding a motorcycle license does not always equate to a higher skill level ... than someone just riding for a year or so.
Most schools require the rider to practice the skills learned in the first course before progressing to the next course level. Two years to get to the advanced level ... is actually quite quick ... in the great scheme of things ...

I found the guy that said it takes 2 years to ride at his school gave the best answer of the 2 though which did appear to reflect the way I rode anyway.

Considering ...

1. The number of (admitted) crashes you've had and reasons for.

2. The "Advice" you've posted for new riders.

3. Your conclusions/reflection from the above.

4. The fact that you have never taken a riding course.

I would be sure (read categorically state) that the "Way YOU ride" would not reflect (or compare) with anything a Riding Instructor would expect to see with a rider ... after attending an advanced riding course.

So if you are keen to take the riding school approach and you get to a point where what they are teaching no longer fits what you want to learn just change schools.

Remember ... Riding Schools seldom give refunds if you fail to show up for the courses.

What you WANT to learn ... and what you NEED to learn ... should not be up to the student to decide.

If you think you know better that the riding instructors ... don't take ANY riding courses ... OH WAIT ...

An important thing to keep in mind is that no matter how long you have been to riding school for shit can still happen to you on the road

You better believe it sunshine ... but if you use your eyes and brain ... you can avoid most of it. Some avoid all of it ...

namely from other drivers that screw up not looking etc

You need to look too. What you need to look for is taught in the first learner courses given to new license holders. Having a full class 6 license does not mean you know all that is required ... to ride safely on the road.

... and whether you get time to swerve or brake to avoid them just comes down to luck.

You make your own luck by looking ... and thinking about what you see.

Obeying speed limits and having "Right of way" does not give you a safety bubble around you.

[nzrobj]

That would depend on how often you ride and where you ride. To learn the quickest would mean making sure you ride frequently on a whole mixture of roads and in different weather. To compliment your practical lessons there are a lot of video tutorials on the net. When I learnt to ski I used a mixture of learning methods: gut feeling, practical lesson, video tutorials and books.

That's very true, someone who only ever rides on a motorway may not have the skills needed for riding in peak hour traffic in the middle of the city! I do plan on both a lot of city riding as well as getting out on the open road!! I have been having a nosey at quite a few videos on youtube to get a step up on things.

[jasonu]

It could be a combination of not holding the clutch lever in long enough and not kicking the gear lever up hard enough. I would support what another poster said that your gear change may work smoother when your motor has warmed up. Its not just beginners that have that problem as some of us experienced riders can have issues with getting in the wrong gear from time to time especially when we buy a new bike it can often take a little while to get used to a new bike's gearing. Its important to be aware wrong gearing can happen in traffic too and not to panic if it does. The more you get used to changing gear the easier you will find it to get back into the right gear if you have got in the wrong one. One thing that can happen is you can find yourself not getting into neutral as you come to a stop and its a matter of pulling in the clutch and kicking the gear lever a few times until the netral light comes on while remaining stopped. Good Luck.

Don't take any notice of this stupid bint.

[nzrobj]

I dont remember what variety of roads I went on when I was learning other than it was mostly city commuting. The best road in the country for learning long straight and twisty hill riding is SH 1 from Waipara to Kaikoura (if open) due to the absence of traffic as a result of the earthquake. That stretch of road would be ideal for any ChCh based riding school to give long distance riding lessons on. On the open road I found the most difficult thing was strong side winds buffeting me around as a beginner but I found out only after moving up to a 750 did side winds become much less of an issue. What sort of bike have you got/going to get?

Well dunedin has plenty of windy hilly roads to ride on!! I'm looking at getting an R3


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[Moi]

... If memory serves this 2 year thing was about reaching the loftiest of IAM pinnacles, which is very highly skilled indeed. Don't rely too much on my memory..

Nothing wrong with your memory...

it was Gremlin in the New crash study thread who said: "... very few come close to meeting the required standard without 6-24 months of practise, feedback and more practise... " [see post 182] when he was discussing the time taken to achieve the level of riding required to pass the IAM advanced standard.

So you can keep to having a glass or two of something each night... it's not killing your little grey cells...

[eldog]

On the open road I found the most difficult thing was strong side winds buffeting me around as a beginner but I found out only after moving up to a 750 did side winds become much less of an issue.

What do you put the difference down to.

[caspernz]

Nothing wrong with your memory...

it was Gremlin in the New crash study thread who said: "... very few come close to meeting the required standard without 6-24 months of practise, feedback and more practise... " [see post 182] when he was discussing the time taken to achieve the level of riding required to pass the IAM advanced standard.

So you can keep to having a glass or two of something each night... it's not killing your little grey cells...

Yes Gremlin is correct in broad terms. To achieve the IAM Advanced Rider standard can take 6-24 months. Here's some variables; it depends on the riders' initial standard, how well they can take onboard the Roadcraft method, the frequency a rider can get together with an observer, to name the main ones.

So in reality IAM won't get into coaching a rider with very limited experience. All the necessary info can be found on the website http://iam.org.nz/motorcycles/ for those who are interested.

[nzrobj]

So in reality IAM won't get into coaching a rider with very limited experience. All the necessary info can be found on the website http://iam.org.nz/motorcycles/ for those who are interested.

I didn't even know that IAM was until you posted the link so thanks for that.

[george formby]

Thanks Moi. KB is so confusing at the moment, I'm still trying to figure out which gear I need to be in to successfully back a 1200 GS into a wall. And why?

[nzrobj]

Just had a look at the R3 and Yamaha also make a MT03 which has a higher up riding position which I have always preferred as it gives you better periferal vision without getting sore wrists. The more low down riding position of the R3 could possibly give you better protection from wind buffeting. So pros and cons with both. I see some manufacturers are now making 300cc adventure bikes which allow you to handle rough roads/gravel more confidently but they have a taller seat height than a road bike. Maybe demo the others as well.

Some good points - though I'm not sure how many dealers are willing to let learners out on their bikes!!

[caspernz]

I didn't even know that IAM was until you posted the link so thanks for that.

In practical terms, once you've done the Rideforever series of courses, think of IAM as the next step beyond that.

Thanks Moi. KB is so confusing at the moment, I'm still trying to figure out which gear I need to be in to successfully back a 1200 GS into a wall. And why?

And I'm worrying about which hand to wave with while I'm doing it...

[FJRider]

So after all that ramble your riding school did not teach you wet weather handling and braking and you found out about that the same way I did? You can learn that on some of the Roadcraft Nottingham tutorials on Youtube. I wonder what else they did not teach you. Chances are you know no more than me but have just been luckier accident wise.

I learned a lot of wet weather riding do's and don'ts ... on my second day of holding a motorcycle license. Invercargill mid winter is not always a fun time to ride.

[FJRider]

... I'm not sure how many dealers are willing to let learners out on their bikes!!

If they advertise them as LAM's compliant ... they would surely hope some will ask for a test ride ...