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Thread: Living with a second generation GSXR1300.

  1. #1
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    Living with a second generation GSXR1300.

    I was chatting with a mate this afternoon, and he pointed out that I've never written a review on a Gen 2 Hayabusa. Which is kind of ironic for a number of reasons. First, I'm not sure this vomit of consciousness that I exhale could be classed as writing. Second, I've had a love affair with Hayabusa's for many years. Third. I own at least one I'll admit to at the moment.

    So, here goes.

    In 1999 the Hayabusa was a revelation. It was ugly. It was also fast. Faster than the Honda Blackbird which was the benchmark of the day. Named for the Japanese peregrine falcon, the Hayabusa was known for its 200 mile per dive bombs. That the Japanese peregrine falcon liked using blackbirds as afternoon tea wasn't lost on the marketing team at Suzuki. The Blackbird was an incredible two up tourer, the fact that it was aero and fast meant loved up blue haired swingers had a comfortable ride to the party, and a ride that was easy on the sore bits on the way home.

    Close to 175 (tui, more like 160) published horsepower in 1999, in a time where the then current Fireblade (919cc) was pumping out an optimistic 123 horsepower - well, it was a new benchmark in a number of ways. The 2001/2 GSXR1000 was near enough to 150 horsepower, which made it the daddy of litre bikes in my view. The overlap of these four bikes - the Blackbird (tourer), the CBR919RR (sports) and the GSXR1300R (Hyper-tourer) & the GSXR1000 neatly filled the top performance bikes by category in their day. Remember, this is years ahead of Kawasaki's ZX10R - half a decade; and the ZX7R and ZX9R's were old fashioned and slow after being run far too long. Someone is going to write something angry about the first R1, but go check out the R1's horsepower and comparative weight. Plus, no one other than baggie pant wearing wiggers rode first gen R1's.

    I'm quoting flywheel horsepower here. If you don't know what that means, take a man class and get rid of your handbag, bitch.

    I've had a few very memorable moments on Gen 1 Haybusa's. Allegedly, I like riding with a reasonable helping of my favourite dessert - velocity. And I've over-eaten a few times on highways, autobahns, and motorways. The stock generation one Hayabusa is fun. With nitrous, even more fun. With a turbo kit, even funner. And a turbo plus nitrous, in my view, answers that question of too much power being a possible scenario.

    At that point, turbo plus nitrous, the bike overcomes the torsional rigidity and it starts doing weird things. Like changing direction because of pronounced chassis deflection. And traction becomes a real issue. 160 mph black lines. Matched by brown ones if you're not paying attention. I've ridden minutes at a time wide open on ZX14R's on the autobahn. I've ridden seconds at a time wide open on a turbo + N02 Haybusa. One was a gentle, albeit, loud, pleasant cruise. The other wasn't. More wheel stands and head shaking getting to 200+ mph than a Parkinson's convention on crack cocaine.

    The gen 1 was a revelation, the second generation was either going to be a massive leap, or if Suzuki forgot to pack their balls, it was going to a faithful evolution.

    It should have been the H2RR of the time. It wasn't. I elected to not really bother looking in detail for a long time. 195 flywheel horsepower didn't seem that big a deal. It was lardy. And it's close enough in looks to the first one that most people can't tell them apart from more than 20 feet.

    But, like the times in my life where I placed trust in allegedly humans with va-jay-jays, I was wrong.

    The build quality was a massive leap. The gen-1 was an over bored GSXR1000* with similar frame and moving parts. It carried its weight lower, and was less sporty. But, very similar DNA. The gen 2 is a thing of beauty, well engineered with loads of thoughtful touches. The bitch pad and handle is thing of beauty, carved out of a lump of lead. The ergonomics are incredible - at a gentle 100 mph it's quiet and very comfortable, with little weight on the wrists with a balloon of air under your chest. The detail is wonderful, yoke cover is milled aluminium, the fairings have good insulation, the quality of the bolts and fasteners is great. On my bike, it has one slightly rusty bolt head. It's not an original.

    It's dated. It looks old next to a H2RR. But, like a Ducati 916 next to a new R1, you'd still think the older bike is the more timeless design.

    It has torque. Like sledge hammer torque. And high 9 second ET's in capable hands. Mine is modded, and it's deep into the 9's, I think with a better more focussed straight line rider, it's possibly knocking on 8's.

    With the limiter removed, the correct gearing, and some courage - it will go significantly faster than the 186 mph that the brochure says. Allegedly.

    The downside? Weight. It weighs slightly more than the death-star, or about half of Jenny Shipley. It still carries weight low. The brakes are, umm, adequate; although a massive improvement on the 99 onwards. The most annoying thing is the redline. 11,000 rpm. It's like riding a Ducati, the fun starts, and then it hits the rev limiter like your head hitting the pavement after too many shandies. This takes some getting used to. You're supposed to ride along in one gear higher than I ride, which makes sense if you're sensible, or you want to see your grandkids graduate. However, those of us with testicles find it annoying.

    But, there's lots to love as well. I want to ride a GSXR1000 or Sev-fiddy (as retards call them) for twenty minute sessions of a good track. A few of those, and a new tyre beckons. Or, a quick lap of the SH16 racetrack. Or a Coro loop, the first part fast, then the last section a game of conservation getting the shredded tyre home. The rest of the time, it's painful - painfully loud and too fast for traffic, always straining at the leash. No problem for those with restraint or brains. But for people with poor impulse control, a thou is a path to regular stupidity. I stand guilty as charged.

    The Hayabusa is different. You find excuses to ride it. To the South Island. Because Queenstown is lovely in the summer. Or last week, Cape Reinga. Needed to make sure it was still there. Or Rotorua, for CrankWorks. 2,000 kilometers a month. Seriously. I couldn't ride to Paeroa on the thou without pharmaceutical help.

    It's incredibly good on gas. Except when it's on the Coro loop. There, it's close on 20 litres per 100 klicks. It is very easy on tyres and chains. I am managing 1,000 k's out of a rear tyre. 2-3,000 when the bike has bags. It's socially acceptable. My adoptive dad used to throw stones at the thou and every other Japanese or Italian bike I've owned. He sits, glassy eyed, staring at the Hayabusa and murmurs odd comments about it under his breath.

    It doesn't like sidewinds. Which is odd, considering.

    Everyone warned me ahead of time - I'd find an all too fast entry, then I'd run out of road and end up in the shrubbery, with a funeral shortly thereafter without the need for a casket given the fireball that would ensue. But, that's basically bullshit. Its not intimidating to ride at all. You can't change your line easily, it has relaxed geometry and a lot of mass carried low. It uses the front tyre harder than a sports bike. It wears an odd bevel on the shoulders very quickly.

    It is very tyre sensitive. Riding with touring tyres is like fucking a $2 whore with three condoms, not much feel and you can't help but wonder why people think it's a good time.

    I tried race-tec's. They're the party girl who screams harder and faster. Not a good long term plan. Then Pirelli Super Corsa SC2's. Which are a better match, the bike wants to turn faster, and it holds a line with much more confidence. I've also dropped the yokes as far as I can, and I run a 200 section rear. Which makes for less stability, but man, does it turn.

    I've also got the lightest cans in the world, the standard exhaust is about 22 kg. Seriously. All that mass hanging over the back of the bike, gone. Also good for three feet long flames on over-run - the Power commander needs some work obviously. And it's all sorts of loud - popping and throwing presence. Which is a GSXR requirement. We have standards and reputations to uphold.

    It's easy to service. A relaxed hour to do an oil change. Even buying parts over the counter at Colemans is reasonable, $25 for an oil filter. Buying them 10 at time from overseas is clearly a better plan.

    It's a big jump from a 600 to the Gen 2. But if you're looking to slow down after riding dirty on a modern thou, then it's a good alternative to a cruiser or a tourer. A cruiser is a small leap to tassels, chaps, and fucking men in the ass.

    I prefer the non-ABS, but the ABS gets significantly better Brembos. I prefer the non-ABS because I'm anachronistic misogynistic opinionated old school kind of guy who thinks that hipsters should all be hunted for sport, and I'm not humble enough to admit that there are situations where a machine can out-brake Vale-MadBikeBoy-Rossi.

    The Gen 2's are also basically bulletproof. I've seen very high mileage bikes (100,000 miles plus) that haven't had any problems (aside from rectifiers, but it's a Suzuki, so shit with that is going to happen if you didn't do the recall).

    And you can buy turbo kits for them. And I can assure you, they're really worth the money. The torsional rigidity of the second generation makes this a good idea, in the way that two chick threesomes are a good idea - it's kind of nice in theory, but in real life, it's a lot of fun that you shouldn't admit to at dinner parties..

    Anyhow, there you go. Buy one.

    *Not really over-bored. Different block and bore centres, more stroke. Obviously. Was making a comparison, not a technical statement of fact.
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

  2. #2
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    Can't argue with your eloquent write-up. The 2nd Gen Busa is an improvement on the Gen 1, no doubt about it. Heavy, torquey, comfy yet nowhere near as lethal or unwieldy as some would like to make out. I waited for the ABS & Brembo version, works fine for me, although not even Mr Brembo can disguise the weight of the Busa.

    The tyre wear on a Busa seems odd at first, but it's in line with any nose heavy bike. First bike for me where fronts wear just as fast, if not faster, than the rears. Weight and counter steering assertively sure makes the front tyre somewhat triangular prematurely. Sport/touring tyres wear well enough, but they make the whole bike feel kinda lethargic. Sportier rubber helps it feel a touch nimbler. Each to their own, I'm on Pilot Power 3, 190/55 rear and the current set is gonna be toast by about 6K.

    The only hard part is gonna be what bike next when replacement time comes around...

  3. #3
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  4. #4
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    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to madbikeboy again.

    thanks for that.

    You'd never go hungry with Nigella Gaz.
    If it weren't for flashbacks...I'd have no memory at all..

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzspokes View Post
    Yep. So true. She's a big boned woman. And I like skinny uptight bitches. At least on the bike, I can wear a helmet so my friends can't see me. Fat chicks, I assume, would be curious about the need for the paper bag...
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by caspernz View Post
    Can't argue with your eloquent write-up. The 2nd Gen Busa is an improvement on the Gen 1, no doubt about it. Heavy, torquey, comfy yet nowhere near as lethal or unwieldy as some would like to make out. I waited for the ABS & Brembo version, works fine for me, although not even Mr Brembo can disguise the weight of the Busa.

    The tyre wear on a Busa seems odd at first, but it's in line with any nose heavy bike. First bike for me where fronts wear just as fast, if not faster, than the rears. Weight and counter steering assertively sure makes the front tyre somewhat triangular prematurely. Sport/touring tyres wear well enough, but they make the whole bike feel kinda lethargic. Sportier rubber helps it feel a touch nimbler. Each to their own, I'm on Pilot Power 3, 190/55 rear and the current set is gonna be toast by about 6K.

    The only hard part is gonna be what bike next when replacement time comes around...
    The Brembos give better feel, I think an RCS19 might be worth a go as well. As for 6,000 k's out of a set - that seems very good life. I think the people who get 20,000 k's out of tyres must carry the bike around corners on their backs. I like the Pilots, they have a good amount of feedback on the edge of adhesion.

    Perhaps the answer is having a thou and a Hayabusa. There is no reasonable replacement for the 13 - ZX14R is a lardy old bus. And it got hit with the usual Kawasaki ugly stick. A GS kind of appeals. And then you get on one and realise that it's a bouncy castle ride at a fair. Umm. Err. Hmm.

    I removed the tail section to work out what weight loss would be achievable with a monocoque seat / tail unit. North of 40 kgs was the answer. I figure I could get the dry weight down to 195kgs with a single exhaust, carbon tail, and BST wheels. The fairings are surprisingly heavy as well. There is a common swap in the states - GSXR1000 tail with some adapters. I'd go the whole hog and make another carbon monocoque tail - it's not hard if you're going to paint it to colour match anyhow. It's a slippery slope though. So far I've been well behaved. It's a couple of small mods and then it's made of unobtanium and there's a million dollars more that I'll never get back. I'm bad enough with doing that to the muscle cars without doing it to yet another bike...
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by roogazza View Post
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to madbikeboy again.

    thanks for that.
    K6 thousand on your profile. I reckon the k5 and k6 are the pinnacle of GSXR's.
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

  8. #8
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    Great thread MBB!. I have a Busa K9. Still learning about it. Had it for a year so far. When I got it, I
    Got KSS to redo the front forks with Racetech pistons, re spring and revalve and revalve the rear. Subsequently, I put a Nitron in the rear. I have done lots of little things, braided lines, EBC HH pads,GSXR 1000 K 2 mirrors, Buell pegs ,Yoshis, raised clip ons etc etc. it is a sublime touring bike two up, except the bar ergos which I struggle with. Brakes are ok only. I don't think an RCS Brembo will fit without hitting the fairing on full lock. It handles very well but is still a fat girl. I mostly ride a GSXR 600 in summer so going from one to another requires a big mind shift!
    Do I love it? Not yet...hoping it is a slow burn.

  9. #9
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    I find it interesting that although your review of the GSX1300R makes a number of comparisons and references to other bikes, you've not made any mention of perhaps the most relevant "other" bike when it comes to telling the story of the Hayabusa. Back in the early 2000's it was all about the GSX1300R Vs. ZX12-R. Most magazine reviews were a 2-way shootout whilst the odd one included the Blackbird just for shits'n'giggles.

    Kawasaki ZX12-R, faster and less ugly than the Hayabusa since ages ago.


  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    I find it interesting that although your review of the GSX1300R makes a number of comparisons and references to other bikes, you've not made any mention of perhaps the most relevant "other" bike when it comes to telling the story of the Hayabusa. Back in the early 2000's it was all about the GSX1300R Vs. ZX12-R. Most magazine reviews were a 2-way shootout whilst the odd one included the Blackbird just for shits'n'giggles.

    Kawasaki ZX12-R, faster and less ugly than the Hayabusa since ages ago.

    ZX12R is a good companion to the gen 1 - but the significant proportion of buyers within the segment chose the Suzuki instead. You'll notice that I did reference the ZX14 a couple of times. But, here's a question for you. When was the last time you saw a 12R?

    The ZX10R was more sports focused, it turned sharper, and it was pretty quick. The 12R DNA was clear in the ZX10R, and in the ZX14R - at that point Kawasaki elected to focus on both segments instead of one tool, two groups.

    I think that the 12R became less relevant earlier though. It had a sharper steering head angle, which made it ride like the then current litre and 900's. When the GSXR1000 came out, it moved the goal posts pretty significantly, pretty much matching the performance of the 12R, but with better handling (almost 750 or 600 level). So, the 12R wasn't a great tourer like the Blackbird - and it was lively (another way of saying it head shook somewhat) which meant that it was intimidating for the sportier segment, which preferred the Hayabusa in the sales charts.

    I'm not biased, but most Kawasaki's seem to be either really dull, or nutters. Their owners are almost always deluded (especially the wankers on ZX7R's).
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by SVboy View Post
    Great thread MBB!. I have a Busa K9. Still learning about it. Had it for a year so far. When I got it, I
    Got KSS to redo the front forks with Racetech pistons, re spring and revalve and revalve the rear. Subsequently, I put a Nitron in the rear. I have done lots of little things, braided lines, EBC HH pads,GSXR 1000 K 2 mirrors, Buell pegs ,Yoshis, raised clip ons etc etc. it is a sublime touring bike two up, except the bar ergos which I struggle with. Brakes are ok only. I don't think an RCS Brembo will fit without hitting the fairing on full lock. It handles very well but is still a fat girl. I mostly ride a GSXR 600 in summer so going from one to another requires a big mind shift!
    Do I love it? Not yet...hoping it is a slow burn.
    I have a mate who has a 2012 with an RCS19, he also struggled with the bar set up and ended running a spacer to lift the bars a little. Weird set up. On a thou you can move the clip ons around significantly. Not so much on the 13.

    How do find your front tyre wear with the fork upgrades?

    No one ever loves the brakes. I think the weight is carried low so I get a sensation of the bike pushing the front wheel instead of diving and pushing into the ground. Please post photos. This thread needs some Hayabusa porn.

    The jump from a GSXR6 is massive. Tiny and light, perfect turning and precise. Versus lumbering and wallowing. One seems almost telepathic. The other one needs loads of bar input and big pushes to move it around.

    Do you have the original exhausts still? Do you need them?
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by madbikeboy View Post
    ZX12R is a good companion to the gen 1 - but the significant proportion of buyers within the segment chose the Suzuki instead.
    The apparent popularity of the GSX1300R over the ZX12-R was possibly due to a number of things, including an extra 0.1 litre engine capacity which no doubt appealed to a number of purchasers of new bikes in that segment.

    Quote Originally Posted by madbikeboy
    You'll notice that I did reference the ZX14 a couple of times.
    Yeah, but the 14 is irrelevant when talking about the introduction of the Gen1 GSX1300R in 1999.

    Quote Originally Posted by madbikeboy
    But, here's a question for you. When was the last time you saw a 12R?
    About half-past 6 when I was last in the gargre having a spot, ow.

    Quote Originally Posted by madbikeboy
    The ZX10R was more sports focused, it turned sharper, and it was pretty quick. The 12R DNA was clear in the ZX10R, and in the ZX14R - at that point Kawasaki elected to focus on both segments instead of one tool, two groups.
    I concur about the one tool doing two jobs thing. The ZX12-R is one very confused motorcycle, doesn't really know what it wants to be. I find that mine does everything I want it to do and the only time I haven't been in love with it is whilst serving a period of disqualification.

    Quote Originally Posted by madbikeboy
    I'm not biased, but most Kawasaki's seem to be either really dull, or nutters. Their owners are almost always deluded (especially the wankers on ZX7R's).
    Yeah, see I reckon Suzuki's are like Toyotas. Nothing wrong with them but they're usually pretty beige and boring and every second cunt has one. I've found that Kawasaki owners often seem to keep their bikes for a long time, not sure if that says more about them or the marque.

    You going to Meremere on Sunday?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by madbikeboy View Post
    I have a mate who has a 2012 with an RCS19, he also struggled with the bar set up and ended running a spacer to lift the bars a little. Weird set up. On a thou you can move the clip ons around significantly. Not so much on the 13.

    How do find your front tyre wear with the fork upgrades?

    No one ever loves the brakes. I think the weight is carried low so I get a sensation of the bike pushing the front wheel instead of diving and pushing into the ground. Please post photos. This thread needs some Hayabusa porn.

    The jump from a GSXR6 is massive. Tiny and light, perfect turning and precise. Versus lumbering and wallowing. One seems almost telepathic. The other one needs loads of bar input and big pushes to move it around.

    Do you have the original exhausts still? Do you need them?
    The bike came on Bridgestone T30s, not a tyre I like, so I went to Angel GTs, which I really like, but you have the lack of feel at pace. Front wear so far is fine. The front is so under sprung as standard and over sprung at the rear that it probably promotes front wear. With the suspension mods damping is much more controlled than standard. Very worthwhile doing. Horses for courses, 600 for the Akaroa GP, Busa for Arthur's Pass. Sweepers are its strength . Clip on angle is an issue for me. Sorry, still need the std pipes.

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    Good write up there.

    1,000 ks out of a tyre! ouch. Darkside that fat girl

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madness View Post
    The apparent popularity of the GSX1300R over the ZX12-R was possibly due to a number of things, including an extra 0.1 litre engine capacity which no doubt appealed to a number of purchasers of new bikes in that segment.



    Yeah, but the 14 is irrelevant when talking about the introduction of the Gen1 GSX1300R in 1999.



    About half-past 6 when I was last in the gargre having a spot, ow.



    I concur about the one tool doing two jobs thing. The ZX12-R is one very confused motorcycle, doesn't really know what it wants to be. I find that mine does everything I want it to do and the only time I haven't been in love with it is whilst serving a period of disqualification.



    Yeah, see I reckon Suzuki's are like Toyotas. Nothing wrong with them but they're usually pretty beige and boring and every second cunt has one. I've found that Kawasaki owners often seem to keep their bikes for a long time, not sure if that says more about them or the marque.

    You going to Meremere on Sunday?
    The 14R isn't relevant to the Gen 1, but it's relevant to the Gen 2. Which is kind of the point of the review.

    I like the 12R - it appeals in the same way as mentally deranged women, who I seem to attract. But, again, other than your own, when was the last 12R you've seen? I saw one at a ride night in Sydney's east. In the last few months since, I think I've seen more than two dozen Hayabusas.

    The main thing I can recall about riding the ZX12R is that it felt very tall for some reason, it had a sensation of a massive arc of movement when picking it, and then laying it down again. Also, the noise it made.

    I agree with the Toyota comment. GSXR's are the exception. There's something mental in their DNA. Agree about the ownership duration with Kawasaki's. I owned my thou for almost a decade, but I also had many other bikes meantime. I've owned my CBX1000 since the early 90's. Some bikes just click for whatever reason. I once owned a 2009 R6, I rode it once and then sold it within days. Go figure.
    It’s diametrically opposed to the sanitised existence of the Lemmings around me in the Dilbert Cartoon hell I live in; it’s life at full volume, perfect colour with high resolution and 10,000 watts of amplification.

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