Are property investors the scourge of the earth?

[HenryDorsetCase]

What checks and balances?

Council regulation? Who needs them? As the one paying for them I sure as fuck don't.

With what they're charging I could pay for a custom design with full engineering spec's and 10 private surveyors for far more in-depth inspections. They're a monopoly, you don't even have to make such comparisons, it's axiomatic: they're massively overcharging.

a lot of them got stuck with high overhead because they were the last man standing in the leaky building (ongoing) crisis, so they have to recover that debit somewhere so they load to this line item......

not excusing, just explaining.

why does a small group of islands at the literal end of the earth need three tiers of gubblemunt? (central, regional, local).

Its fucked up.

and 56 boards/bodies in charge of water when water quality is declining like a motherfucker.

[TheDemonLord]

What checks and balances?

Council regulation? Who needs them? As the one paying for them I sure as fuck don't.

With what they're charging I could pay for a custom design with full engineering spec's and 10 private surveyors for far more in-depth inspections. They're a monopoly, you don't even have to make such comparisons, it's axiomatic: they're massively overcharging.

This is where perfect information and perfect comprehension comes in.

Let's assume (cause I don't know you IRL) - that you aren't what you say you are - you could be in the business long enough to talk the talk, but not follow through (whilst being superficially credible)

This is where the need for some form of regulation comes in.

Now, I don't agree that the Current method and council system is correct, but I balance this with acknowledging that perfect free market economy is not a viable option because of the lack of perfect information.

[Ocean1]

This is where perfect information and perfect comprehension comes in.

Let's assume (cause I don't know you IRL) - that you aren't what you say you are - you could be in the business long enough to talk the talk, but not follow through (whilst being superficially credible)

This is where the need for some form of regulation comes in.

Now, I don't agree that the Current method and council system is correct, but I balance this with acknowledging that perfect free market economy is not a viable option because of the lack of perfect information.

Bullshit. A monopoly isn't just an abomination against free market fetishists, (although in passing I gota ask: who's fucking money is it?) it's a guarantee of rampant graft, with prices utterly divorced from both the cost to supply and any rational explanation whatsoever. Look around, the shysters you imagine might replace them couldn't possibly do as much economic damage.

By all means dictate standards discouraging fuckwits from connecting sewerage to stormwater systems, the cost of that should probably be about $100 per dwelling, most of the actual services required are built by the developer.

There's a new subdivision up the road, couple of dozen lots. The sections were "developed" by the simple expediency of extending a road a few yards, (literally), sticking a few pegs in describing where you were allowed to build your pre-ordered spec' house, (no, sir may not use anyone else to either design or build his house, nor could sir negotiate the price) and bunging in a driveway crossing. All of the infrastructure was existing, had been for decades. The price? $450k minimum.

Big black dog up the fuckers, you want an explanation for massively over priced housing then lay it at your local council's feet.

[YellowDog]

Property investors are providing a valuable service, by allowimg those whom cannot afford to buy a property, to have somewhere to rent or to buy. Prices are high everywhere, not just in Auckland. Vendors want as much as the market will pay and why not? It's how a market works and we would otherwise be driving around in Trabants.

Those foreign investors whom land bank and or whom leave properties empty, should be penalised

[Jin]

All very well, in a free market.

But it's not, you've got any amount of councils, regulatory authorities, materials supply monopolies and dodgy developers colluding to punch the fuck out of the ticket on the way past.

Which begs the question: what would the cost of supply be if it was a genuinely free market?

Wrong. In the real world you cant see supply and demand graphs only what prices are doing. Thats why its crucial that prices arnt manipulated or interfered with. No i havent bothered to tell the govt, rbnz et al because they are a bunch of ignorant mofos.

You are on the right track though. There is no shortage of land in Auckland. The shortage of supply is solely due to council manipulation and interference. The developers trying to work within the rules are still going broke they arent the problem. Neither are real estate agents, mums and dads, baby boomers, land bankers, foreign investors and so on.

And materials supply monopolies are a result of council and govt rules. In fact all monopolies exist only because of govt rules and protectionism.

[Ocean1]

Wrong. In the real world you cant see supply and demand graphs only what prices are doing. Thats why its crucial that prices arnt manipulated or interfered with. No i havent bothered to tell the govt, rbnz et al because they are a bunch of ignorant mofos.

You are on the right track though. There is no shortage of land in Auckland. The shortage of supply is solely due to council manipulation and interference. The developers trying to work within the rules are still going broke they arent the problem. Neither are real estate agents, mums and dads, baby boomers, land bankers, foreign investors and so on.

And materials supply monopolies are a result of council and govt rules. In fact all monopolies exist only because of govt rules and protectionism.

Bit wobbly to start with, there.

But a good strong finish. Well done.

[Jin]

Bit wobbly to start with, there.

But a good strong finish. Well done.

Ha thanks. I could explain in detail but i cbf ive been saying the same thing for over 10 years and its a waste of time. The only thing you can count on is that current environment wont change and the supply will be constrained for a very long time most likely it will never be solved. So if you can buy property in Auckland virtually risk free investment bar a catastrophic event like a tsunami or volcano that wipes out a large number of jafas.

[YellowDog]

Wrong. In the real world you cant see supply and demand graphs only what prices are doing. Thats why its crucial that prices arnt manipulated or interfered with. No i havent bothered to tell the govt, rbnz et al because they are a bunch of ignorant mofos.

You are on the right track though. There is no shortage of land in Auckland. The shortage of supply is solely due to council manipulation and interference. The developers trying to work within the rules are still going broke they arent the problem. Neither are real estate agents, mums and dads, baby boomers, land bankers, foreign investors and so on.

And materials supply monopolies are a result of council and govt rules. In fact all monopolies exist only because of govt rules and protectionism.

Yes of course, if the Auckland house building prices were actually real, then there would not be any new homes in many other part of the country

[Voltaire]

You only have to go 30 minutes North or South of Auckland to see there is no shortage of land.

Unfortunately what appears to be barely controlled immigration has overwhelmed the infrastructure.

Given NZ's history is getting infrastructure built its going to get worse.

With industry based on selling milk,milking tourists and no real return on passive investments its no wonder people buy houses.

Why not, you can see them, touch them, claim all the interest and costs back. Only down side is you have to have tenants

who in my experience can be a bit hit and miss. Other options are start a business or invest in one, both are risky and the

former is hard work and anyone who does it deserves their BMW Ba



I bet Labour capitalises on the groundswell of high housing and immigration as their policies.....

[YellowDog]

I bet Labour capitalises on the groundswell of high housing and immigration as their policies.....

I don't believe that the words 'Labour' & 'Capitalise' belong in the same sentence.

I guess if they ditched the Greens, they might get a different reception.

Reconstruct these words to form a sentece:

'Party'
'A'
'Brothel'
'In'
'Labour'
'Organise'
'Bunk-up'
'The'
'A'
'Couldn't'

[Ocean1]

a lot of them got stuck with high overhead because they were the last man standing in the leaky building (ongoing) crisis, so they have to recover that debit somewhere so they load to this line item......

Who should be responsible for dramatic fuckups, where the council defines standards and inspections?

When I work on any significant project my clients expect to see professional negligence insurance mentioned in the contract. Why would any council customer expect less of any entity so historically prone to massive fuckups?

Why wouldn't any potential customer not demand an alternative supplier from the outset?

[YellowDog]

Who should be responsible for dramatic fuckups, where the council defines standards and inspections?

When I work on any significant project my clients expect to see professional misconduct insurance mentioned in the contract. Why would any council customer expect less of any entity so historically prone to massive fuckups?

Why wouldn't any potential customer not demand an alternative supplier from the outset?

It's not always the council's fault

The number of properties that have passed the inspection, before the concrete is poured, and then after the inspector has left, the metalwork is removed and set up on to the next site, is not funny

I know a couple of councillors whom have told me they are trying to keep the problem under wraps, so as to avoid panic.

Are cracking/sinking homes, better or worse than leaky homes?

We're well overdue for another scandal.

My next property purchase will include a metal detection phase

[Zedder]

It's not always the council's fault

The number of properties that have passed the inspection, before the concrete is poured, and then after the inspector has left, the metalwork is removed and set up on to the next site, is not funny

Yes, I've heard that from people in the building industry too. The new building code NZS 3604, which came about from the 2004 Building Act, is meant to be adhered to but sometimes is not, and the Council is meant to inspect that work is to that code however they do get deceived.

[YellowDog]

Yes, I've heard that from people in the building industry too. The new building code NZS 3604, which came about from the 2004 Building Act, is meant to be adhered to but sometimes is not, and the Council is meant to inspect that work is to that code however they do get deceived.

I was getting some concreting done myself and one of the guys told me that his mother-in-law is a council inspector. She inspected and passed a Millwater bulding site and was heading back to the office. She was half way down the motorway and suddenly realised that she had fogotten to inspect the shared storm water services. So she turned around and was back on site, within the hour. As she approached, the site, she could see two 4x4s towing out the metalwork, on to the adjacent site, which was due for inspection on the following week.

Some of those foreign building firms don't give a shit about NZ and are not here for the long haul. There's noone to sue, 3 years down the line, when it all starts breaking up.

All that happens is that, once they are caught, they get fined heavily. They don't go to jail, or have their right to build revoked, so they can do the same again to help pay the fines

[Ocean1]

It's not always the council's fault

The number of properties that have passed the inspection, before the concrete is poured, and then after the inspector has left, the metalwork is removed and set up on to the next site, is not funny

I know a couple of councillors whom have told me they are trying to keep the problem under wraps, so as to avoid panic.

Are cracking/sinking homes, better or worse than leaky homes?

We're well overdue for another scandal.

My next property purchase will include a metal detection phase

If the council's inspection regime doesn't produce in-spec' results then who's fault is that?

Again: the acid test is "would the customer pay for the service if they didn't have to?"

But I'm not just bitching about the council, why are building sites priced so far over the cost to supply them?

Nowhere in the real world should it cost $450k for a lump of dirt with a couple of pipes laid in. It's a fucking joke.