The 2017 Election Thread

[Voltaire]

There has been a mindset that "whoever" pulls the national strings, yet labour do not get this form of attention, so bringing the union interest (among other interested groups) into a more public view is relevant.

At least we know that businesses want to make a profit, prosper and employ people.

I think they only want to profit, employing people is a necessary evil. Banking is an example, as they can provide the same level of service with technology. Banks in AU are even using chat bots, cheaper then overseas call centres.

[Ocean1]

I dont care i dont care i dont care
Ps I dont care.
To use Aussie as an example to just silly as its only been implimented for a single month.
But the UK has been doing it for 20 years which you conviently ignore. Seeing as you are from the UK you knew this.
https://www.gov.uk/goods-sent-from-abroad
Aussie has a Amazon distribution center opening their, so They dont care either.
If you truely believe its a huge problem for you to pay the legally defined ammount of GST. I say you should not be buying the goods then.

If its such an issue i suggest you move back overseas. Or set up your own political party and win an election or you could face up to the fact its a law and stop moaning about small amount tax for something you claim that you don't buy often anyway.

We get it, your only concern is that people pay tax. Including those that cost more than they earn. Can I be quite frank? Fuck you, and your horse.

Using Aussie as an example is fucking obvious though, they've just done exactly what NZ labour plan to do: force Amazon et al to deduct GST at source. They're the first country in the world to harbour such delusions of omnipotence, and it's not going anywhere near as well as you seem to believe.

And according to your link blighty has, in fact been doing exactly the same thing we've done for fucking years: catch some of it at the border and then demand payment. As far as I can see they've never required an off shore vendor to collect their taxes for them.

"You’ll be contacted by Royal Mail, Parcelforce or the courier company explaining how to pay any VAT, duty and fees for dealing with customs.

They’ll normally hold your parcel for about 3 weeks. If you haven’t paid the fee by then, it’ll be sent back."

[husaberg]

We get it, your only concern is that people pay tax. Including those that cost more than they earn. Can I be quite frank? Fuck you.

Using Aussie as an example is fucking obvious though, they've just done exactly what NZ labour plane to do, force Amazon et al to deduct GST at source. It's not going anywhere near as well as you seem to believe.

And blighty has, in fact been doing exactly the same thing we've done for fucking years: catch some of it at the border and then demand payment. As far as I can see they've never required an off shore vendor to collect their taxes for them.

"You’ll be contacted by Royal Mail, Parcelforce or the courier company explaining how to pay any VAT, duty and fees for dealing with customs.

They’ll normally hold your parcel for about 3 weeks. If you haven’t paid the fee by then, it’ll be sent back."

You dont get anything, i dont care about TDL moaning.
I have heard you other blather many times how its is okay that big companies shirk the tax laws
Nor do i care about your opinion because its generally just right wing whinging.
Aussie having been doing it for one month grow up, they expect to generate 500 milion dollars.
The only reason you are winging is it was a labour coalition that put the law into place.
I say this as you have never winged about the average of 6 nrew taxs that National brought in every year.
How many of the 6 new taxes a year did you moan about national doing?....
Did you moan when national raised the GST rate?
If it irks you so much to pay the correct ammount of gst dont.
Or form the" ocean party" where you hold your breath under the ocean for the next 2 1/2 years for all i care.

But nothing you are going to say ot do is going to change the fact that its a law, so grow up and move on.

[Ocean1]

You dont get anything, i dont care about TDL moaning.
Nor do i care about your opinion becase its generally just right wing whinging.
Aussie having been doing it for one month grow up
The only reason you are winging is it was a labour coalitition that put the law into place.
How many of the 6 new taxes a year did you moan about national doing?....
Did you moan when national raised the GST rate?
If it irks you so much to pay the correct ammount of gst dont.
Or form the" ocean party" where you hold your breath under the ocean for the next 2 1/2 years for all i care.

But nothing you are going to say ot do is going to change the fact that its a law, so grow up and move on.

All of which might be very interesting, (if tedious and horribly repetitive), if the rationale behind your opinions were at all based in fact, and not on your misinterpretation of what others say and whatever similarly misinterpreted "supporting evidence" you dredge up.

Sadly, such is not the case. Now clean up your horse's shit on your way out.

[TheDemonLord]

I dont care i dont care i dont care
Ps I dont care.

And thus we see what lurks beneath the facade.

You sound more like my Toddler whining about bed time, than someone who should be making significant changes to our international trade setup.

Let me put it another way.

Your assumption is that the net result of this change is that a whole load of tax which you assert is not being paid or you assert should be paid - gets paid. And because the government will have this wonderful windfall of tax, they'll be able to build roads, pay the nurses, ride unicorns etc. etc.

Now, if the legislation did that, and only that - I could perhaps relent a little - afterall - 15% markup on an item isn't the end of the world. But you've shown NOTHING to back that up. And what's more, we have our Aussie neighbours - with whom we have the closest geographic, political, Legislative, cultural and historic connections - they did something similar - the net result of which was that Australia (not Amazon) lost out.

There's also an implied line of logic in there that goes something like "there are a group of people who aren't paying their fair share, and are somehow freeloading" - which implies that the driving force behind this change isn't anything resembling Economic sense - but jealousy and hatred of a group who are perceived as gaming the system.

And FWIW - This concern isn't based out of any right or left wing politics - it's borne out of the fact that Governments are trying to impose taxes upon the internet, in much the same manner that British Colonialism imposed taxes - do you need a history lesson as to what happened next?

[husaberg]

All of which might be very interesting, (if tedious and horribly repetitive), if the rationale behind your opinions were at all based in fact, and not on your misinterpretation of what others say and whatever similarly misinterpreted "supporting evidence" you dredge up.

Sadly, such is not the case. Now clean up your horse's shit on your way out.

You are a hypocrite dude, plain and simple.
You have never actually used any evidence only your opinion.

[husaberg]

And thus we see what lurks beneath the facade.

You sound more like my Toddler whining about bed time, than someone who should be making significant changes to our international trade setup.

Let me put it another way.

Your assumption is that the net result of this change is that a whole load of tax which you assert is not being paid or you assert should be paid - gets paid. And because the government will have this wonderful windfall of tax, they'll be able to build roads, pay the nurses, ride unicorns etc. etc.

Now, if the legislation did that, and only that - I could perhaps relent a little - afterall - 15% markup on an item isn't the end of the world. But you've shown NOTHING to back that up. And what's more, we have our Aussie neighbours - with whom we have the closest geographic, political, Legislative, cultural and historic connections - they did something similar - the net result of which was that Australia (not Amazon) lost out.

There's also an implied line of logic in there that goes something like "there are a group of people who aren't paying their fair share, and are somehow freeloading" - which implies that the driving force behind this change isn't anything resembling Economic sense - but jealousy and hatred of a group who are perceived as gaming the system.

And FWIW - This concern isn't based out of any right or left wing politics - it's borne out of the fact that Governments are trying to impose taxes upon the internet, in much the same manner that British Colonialism imposed taxes - do you need a history lesson as to what happened next?

Ther only person whining is you and ocean.
The rest of it is blather to make yourself feel better.
Its not an implied logic, is what is fair and reasonable when the taxion laws were created there was no internet shopping.
As i have said about 5 times the aussie law has only been in effect for 1 month.
the UK law has been arround 20 years yet you never mention that, twenty years not a peep, were you unaware of that or did it not suit your agenda to mention that?

if you don't like NZ taxation laws stop moaning and do something about it or go back to the UK and moan there about it.
Either way i don't care.

[TheDemonLord]

Ther only person whining is you and ocean.
The rest of it is blather to make yourself feel better.
Its not an implied logic, is what is fair and reasonable when the taxion laws were created there was no internet shopping.

There was certainly the facility to purchase items from overseas - Mail order, Phone order - so people could still order from overseas...

As i have said about 5 times the aussie law has only been in effect for 1 month.

60 Million products vs 480 Million products - that's an instantaneous effect.

If you want one of the 420 Million products that is no longer on offer - you're shit out of luck.

the UK law has been arround 20 years yet you never mention that, twenty years not a peep, were you unaware of that or did it not suit your agenda to mention that?

It's more complicated than what you are trying to make it out to be - and furthermore, the UK happens to be a much bigger market than NZ or Aus - which happens to be relevant.

if you don't like NZ taxation laws stop moaning and do something about it or go back to the UK and moan there about it.
Either way i don't care.

A Tax that is fair and produces the desired result - fine.
A Tax that is stupidly applied and will cause a myriad of detrimental and unforseen consequences - not fine.

[husaberg]

There was certainly the facility to purchase items from overseas - Mail order, Phone order - so people could still order from overseas...



60 Million products vs 480 Million products - that's an instantaneous effect.

If you want one of the 420 Million products that is no longer on offer - you're shit out of luck.



It's more complicated than what you are trying to make it out to be - and furthermore, the UK happens to be a much bigger market than NZ or Aus - which happens to be relevant.



A Tax that is fair and produces the desired result - fine.
A Tax that is stupidly applied and will cause a myriad of detrimental and unforseen consequences - not fine.

All your opinion

[oldrider]

All your opinion

Just as valuable/valid as yours or anyone else's for that matter.

[Ocean1]

Read my lips: NO NEW TAXES!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/ne...-water-systems

[pete376403]

Read my lips: NO NEW TAXES!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/ne...-water-systems

Ok so the water system appears to be broken. There are three options:

Ignore it and carry on as usual. This seems to be the way things have operated in the past. Government does nothing while in power then once in opposition blames the other party.

Impose a tax to pay for repairs. people end up paying for improvements but in the long term things may get better

Privatise the system such as the UK did. People end up paying but few improvements happen, huge profits accrue and go to (usually) overseas owners

[Ocean1]

Ok so the water system appears to be broken. There are three options:

Ignore it and carry on as usual. This seems to be the way things have operated in the past. Government does nothing while in power then once in opposition blames the other party.

Impose a tax to pay for repairs. people end up paying for improvements but in the long term things may get better

Privatise the system such as the UK did. People end up paying but few improvements happen, huge profits accrue and go to (usually) overseas owners

Oooorrrr, we could spend taxpayers money on infrastructure instead of social engineering, council rorts and civic empire building puffery.

It worked for previous generations. So what's changed?

[Ocean1]

Oh yeah, this housing crisis shit's easy!

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/106...l-may-struggle

[jasonu]

Oooorrrr, we could spend taxpayers money on infrastructure instead of social engineering, council rorts and civic empire building puffery.

It worked for previous generations. So what's changed?

Coulda used those several millions the tooth fairy gave to the coconut islands for more pressing local stuff.