The 2017 Election Thread

[mashman]

Only if you mean it elects a government.
The pathway is not the same.

Yes... but even the different pathways are going to end up with the same people in the same places doing the same thing. This happens because the very same people vote for the same people they were going to vote for anyway. It's all pretty deterministic irrespective of methodology innit.

[Brian d marge]

No, Form followed Function.

Actually function follows form , see the hermetic and its use by the Priestley class for how the form was used and for the concept of the form

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[TheDemonLord]

Actually function follows form , see the hermetic and its use by the Priestley class for how the form was used and for the concept of the form

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You see, this is where we get into one of those fundamental differences in viewpoint.

[Brian d marge]

You see, this is where we get into one of those fundamental differences in viewpoint.

well you had better take it up with the Babylonians , after all they started it ( the banking houses of Egibi and or Muradsu)

unless you have a different view of history , Vadic? or the law of Manu?

or are you original in your Sin?

[Katman]

You see, this is where we get into one of those fundamental differences in viewpoint.

Thanks for your continued efforts in presenting the viewpoint according to The Book of Autism.

[TheDemonLord]

well you had better take it up with the Babylonians , after all they started it ( the banking houses of Egibi and or Muradsu)

unless you have a different view of history , Vadic? or the law of Manu?

or are you original in your Sin?

I don't doubt that somebody invented the concept - but why was it invented in the first place?

The answer being to solve the problem of Trade between groups.

The form of Money is a product of the Function that it has to serve - we as a society buy into the concept (Pun fully intended) because of all the known methods of trade, it's the most successful at solving the problems of Trade.

Should a better system come along, we will probably switch to that (and one could argue that Electronic Banking is that better system that we are slowly moving towards)

[TheDemonLord]

Thanks for your continued efforts in presenting the viewpoint according to The Book of Autism.

Maybe you should try reading it sometime, you might learn something.

Although you might be disappointed that in the book, people aren't repeatedly told to suck other people's cock - it's a bit more highbrow than that.

[Swoop]

Yes... but even the different pathways are going to end up with the same people in the same places doing the same thing.

No, it will vary dependent on the voters selections and popularity of the very small parties. Once a few of the lesser parties are eliminated from the "pool" the larger changes start to become visible.
You have seen how local elections are held, yet you personally will not see the calculations happening, but will see the eventual winner announced. The winning candidate should make a greater proportion of the voters happy, since that person's name will have been selected in 1st, 2nd or 3rd place on the voter's form.
Simple, innit!

[pritch]

I'm getting just a tad pissed off at the political coverage in NZ. Normally I manage to avoid it, but Trump has been so incredibly incompetent and just plain nasty lately that I have been seeking refuge in our tamer news here. Not that it is good news, but it is at least sane.

So some here are whinging about the delay in forming a new Government. Get over it. There is always a delay of about two weeks before the votes are fully counted.

There are complaints that Winston shouldn't have so much power but he only has the power that Labour or National give him. The Greens reportedly won't work with National and that makes sense. They are far apart politically and the Greens have the example of what has just happened to the Maori Party to guide them.

So most people see the obvious outcome as a National/NZ First Government with the long shot being a Green/NZ First/Labour Government.

There is one other possibility that receives little mention, mainly because it is unlikely in the present circumstances. If the NZ First option was completely unpalatable to National there is nothing to stop them approaching Labour about forming what is called a "grand coalition". That hasn't happened here yet but it does happen in Europe.

People who worry about the tail wagging the dog do so unduly, the system can deal with that.

[mashman]

No, it will vary dependent on the voters selections and popularity of the very small parties. Once a few of the lesser parties are eliminated from the "pool" the larger changes start to become visible.
You have seen how local elections are held, yet you personally will not see the calculations happening, but will see the eventual winner announced. The winning candidate should make a greater proportion of the voters happy, since that person's name will have been selected in 1st, 2nd or 3rd place on the voter's form.
Simple, innit!

Yeah I know what you mean, but it's still pretty deterministic given that those who are voting for red, blue and green invariably take up spots 1, 2 and 3 in various combinations. They did produce the iteration results, and in the first 4 iterations Murrell was leading. T'was the final iteration that saw Tana scrape through. Murrell was chosen by the majority as the #1, so should have become Mayor, but STV, is, well, silly. You used to have one vote. NOW you have portions of a vote as your votes get cast and recast again and again for no other treason than it would supposedly make more people happier with the result. Like I said, silly imho.

[oldrider]

I'm getting just a tad pissed off at the political coverage in NZ. Normally I manage to avoid it, but Trump has been so incredibly incompetent and just plain nasty lately that I have been seeking refuge in our tamer news here. Not that it is good news, but it is at least sane.

So some here are whinging about the delay in forming a new Government. Get over it. There is always a delay of about two weeks before the votes are fully counted.

There are complaints that Winston shouldn't have so much power but he only has the power that Labour or National give him. The Greens reportedly won't work with National and that makes sense. They are far apart politically and the Greens have the example of what has just happened to the Maori Party to guide them.

So most people see the obvious outcome as a National/NZ First Government with the long shot being a Green/NZ First/Labour Government.

There is one other possibility that receives little mention, mainly because it is unlikely in the present circumstances. If the NZ First option was completely unpalatable to National there is nothing to stop them approaching Labour about forming what is called a "grand coalition". That hasn't happened here yet but it does happen in Europe.

People who worry about the tail wagging the dog do so unduly, the system can deal with that.

Good post pritch.

I have been waiting for this realisation ever since the introduction of MMP!

We (the electorate) only vote to give them permission to form a government - they impose their own limitations to getting it done! - fucking wankers!

[Swoop]

We (the electorate) only vote to give them permission to form a government - they impose their own limitations to getting it done! - fucking wankers!

Then proceed to do whatever the hell they want for the next 2 1/2 years...
(this applies to whatever colour is in gubbinment).

[Grumph]

Then proceed to do whatever the hell they want for the next 2 1/2 years...
(this applies to whatever colour is in gubbinment).

And then rely on the voting public's short memory when they lie about their achievements while trying to get back in.

Personally, I'm still holding grudges against Holyoake and Muldoon....

[husaberg]

Personally, I'm still holding grudges against Holyoake and Muldoon....

I am not sure how good that will do you now, i doubt they are chasing votes at the moment.

[1billyboy]

And then rely on the voting public's short memory when they lie about their achievements while trying to get back in.

Personally, I'm still holding grudges against Holyoake and Muldoon....

Mine is against Nordmeyer and his black budget. Had to use a lot more pocket to buy smokes.