The 2017 Election Thread

[husaberg]

Yeah? Which items from your above confirmation bias trawl do you believe represents moh numbers?

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011,

Funny how you personally feel national party figures are beyond questioning. yet people who actually work in the health system according to you are self interested idiots who know nothing about healthcare.

[eldog]

you guys should go to the ED dept on a Saturday arvo.
oh yes

see the drunk guys outside having a fight then get admitted for treatment.
Ahead of the people who have been waiting......

then get told you will see some specialist who you have seen leave hours ago......LOL

there really needs to be more transparent details on public health sector.
We should start with Salaries and 'benefits' from the top-down.

ever been to a private health clinic?
what sort of cars are the doctors driving? mini minors?

Dentists are another - you should check the hours....

I am not saying people should be worked hard, it just that most of NZ is struggling

[Grumph]

I am not saying people should be worked hard, it just that most of NZ is struggling

This is true. There's nothing like actual experience either yourself, a family member or friend having to go through the system to firstly, be diagnosed, then referred, then wait....to find out just how stretched and poorly resourced the health system actually is.

The "unable to afford doctors visit" is also sadly accurate. Particularly in the elderly.

But this would seen to be helpful in Mr Ocean's eyes as it will reduce the numbers needing help....

[Ocean1]

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011,

Funny how you personally feel national party figures are beyond questioning. yet people who actually work in the health system according to you are self interested idiots who know nothing about healthcare.

I haven't mentioned the national party at all let alone their figures. Now who is it that's claiming moh figures show one in nine Kiwis can't afford a GP visit?

Nor did I call health care workers idiots. They are, however without a shadow of doubt interested in the taxpayer spending even more on healthcare than the already huge recent increases.

But none of that's going to influence your pet hatred for anything that threatens your beliefs, and I'm certainly not wasting my time with it.

[Ocean1]

This is true. There's nothing like actual experience either yourself, a family member or friend having to go through the system to firstly, be diagnosed, then referred, then wait....to find out just how stretched and poorly resourced the health system actually is.

The "unable to afford doctors visit" is also sadly accurate. Particularly in the elderly.

But this would seen to be helpful in Mr Ocean's eyes as it will reduce the numbers needing help....

See, if you can read that I'm in favour of helping fewer people then I guess it's only a small extra step to believing that the health system funding has been neglected.

Have another wee read, dude, it may suit you to believe that, but neither is actually correct.

[Brian d marge]

The numbers with bad teeth
Unbelievable

Appalachian centrefolds become desirable after one visit to CHCH

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[husaberg]

Got any numbers to go with that dude?

Outside of the number of media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest, obviously...

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011, and Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners president Tim Malloy warned the risks of patients avoiding doctors' visits for years could result in greater inequity in healthcare

He blamed the problem on what he said was an annual funding gap of about $45 million, created by a funding formula based on enrolment numbers, rather than on the number of times a practice saw its patients.
"The formula they use to correct for each year is fundamentally flawed," he said.

Survey of almost 6000 health workers found:

90% Say the health system doesn’t have the staff and resourcerequired to give New Zealanders the healthcare they need when they need it.
61% Say New Zealanders access to health care over the last fiveyears has decreased.
72% Say their workload and work pressures aren’t reasonable.
84% Say their workload and work pressures have increased overthe last five years.
90% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting New Zealanders’ access to healthcare.
82% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting their workload and work pressure.

A 2016 workforce survey by the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners found 44 per cent of all GPs plan to retire within 10 years – up from 36 per cent just two years ago.
Otago Medical School associate professor Sue Pullon​ said the smpending shortage could be traced back to the 1990s, when annual positions in GP training were halved from 100 to 50.

. Health professionals make difficult ethical decisions about life and death – treatment or no treatment – and this requires considerable judgment, autonomy, specialisation and knowledge. Yet, under-funding and restricted resources mean the service runs largely on goodwilll. Could this be the reason we have experienced ongoing strike action by junior doctors since 2006? Is it why senior doctors have also threatened industrial action? Perhaps it is the reason our health service relies so heavily on internationally-trained medics – over 40 per cent at last count and the highest level of any country in the OECD.

NZ also relies on the highest rate of internationally-qualified nurses (at 25 per cent) in the OECD.

So outside of the media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest you got nothing.

We've done this before dude, health spending in real terms has increased more in the last decade than at any time in our history, you no listen.

http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publicat...0/10-01/23.htm

They're certainly an uppity bunch.

There's a thing about health that most people completely miss: It's a cost that doesn't simply represent a diminishing return on expenditure, it's a cost that actually creates further expenditure. Health issues that a generation ago were untreatable are now being successfully treated, (often at a cost that simply wouldn't have been acceptable 10 years ago) and those patients WILL be back, requiring more expenditure. Fix them up again and...

Yeah? Which items from your above confirmation bias trawl do you believe represents moh numbers?

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011,

Funny how you personally feel national party figures are beyond questioning. yet people who actually work in the health system according to you are self interested idiots who know nothing about healthcare.

I haven't mentioned the national party at all let alone their figures. Now who is it that's claiming moh figures show one in nine Kiwis can't afford a GP visit?

Nor did I call health care workers idiots. They are, however without a shadow of doubt interested in the taxpayer spending even more on healthcare than the already huge recent increases.

But none of that's going to influence your pet hatred for anything that threatens your beliefs, and I'm certainly not wasting my time with it.

The ministry of healths own survey.

The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.

http://www.health.govt.nz/publicatio...-health-survey
Really you never mentioned the national party or their figures really........
But don't worry the real figures are much worse

New research published today in the New Zealand Medical Journal reveals a staggering 25 per cent of adults are not able to get the primary health care they need, 16.5% of which missed out on a GP due to cost,

We've done this before dude, health spending in real terms has increased more in the last decade than at any time in our history, you no listen.

Then you tried to justify that statement using what was labours increased spending on healthcare you really are stupid.

[YellowDog]

I was looking at what the outside world thought of Jacina Ardern. Read a reasonable article at ft.com, with a video too.

So she was one of Tony Blair's policy advisers. I'm not sure if that is good or bad. Never liked the man, whom was a traitor to his party, as well as his country. People whom got in his way, with obstacles like 'the truth', disappeared and had their characters publicly shamed (as they do).

I have pasted the article below. It makes a big thing of the currency drop, which I don't, as it has been over valued for waaaay too long. The TPP think isn't very interesting, but I can see where they are coming from. As Trump has ditched it, it is no longer as meaningful.

The immigration policy seems fairly sensible, but that's before Winston spits the dummy.

I don't have a problem with letting the alliance see what they can change. The Housing/Health/Homelessness bullshit worries me, a bit, as she seems totally clueless about those and will just blow loads of cash, achieving nothing. Change and restructure are not the same thing and you can't do what you can't do (not sure she realises).

The areas where I hope she focusses on and goes full steam ahead, over and above the other trivia, are with the plan to force landlords to make their properties healthy & safe, and also with the indicated educational investment. I'm still in 2 minds about the first year of tertiary education, but it might prove to have some merit (I'll see what I can enroll for).

Also, kicking the central bank up the arse, will be a good thing. Working people (not drop-kick losers), deserved of a future, and should be able to borrow money with just a 5% - 10% deposit. The 20% LVR is unfair, prohibitive, and counter productive, to what the government wants to achieve.

"Jacinda, give the poor bastards a chance in life, instead of focussing on your unsustainable lefty money burning shit, and you just might get re-elected in 3 years and you won't need the senile old codger for support."

It's just a shame that I am too busy to be her adviser


Here's the article:
__________________________________________________ _____________________________
Jacinda Ardern set to become New Zealand PM

Former Tony Blair adviser forms Labour-led coalition with support from minor parties
Jacinda Ardern, left, is expected to take the top job with the support of Winston Peters' New Zealand First party © AFP/AP

October 19, 2017
by Edward White in Taipei and Jamie Smyth in Sydney

Jacinda Ardern is set to become the next prime minister of New Zealand, capping a spectacular rise to power just months after taking control of the opposition Labour party in the middle of an election campaign.Ms Ardern, 37, a former policy adviser to Tony Blair, will become one of her country’s youngest prime ministers and the third woman to lead a government after winning the support on Thursday of the nationalist New Zealand First party headed by Winston Peters.A final coalition deal is expected to be ratified by the Green party on Thursday, ushering in the first Labour-led coalition in almost a decade.“We aspire to be a government for all New Zealanders and one that will seize the opportunity to build a fairer, better New Zealand,” said Ms Ardern. She will head a centre-left government that is likely to refocus economic policy around delivering public services, toughening immigration and foreign ownership rules.New Zealand’s currency was down as much as 1.6 per cent against the greenback on Thursday, following weeks of negotiations, at one stage as low as $0.704.Ms Ardern said the coalition would seek to renegotiate the Trans-Pacific Partnership trade deal, which had been strongly supported by the previous National-led government. It would also focus on tackling a shortage of affordable housing, delivering public services and protecting the environment. Bronwyn Hayward, head of politics at the University of Canterbury, said: “The TPP has been quite a divisive issue in New Zealand and Labour will focus on renegotiating aspects related to foreign ownership of housing and land, as well as investor dispute mechanisms. ”The government was likely to ban offshore ownership of housing and seek to reduce immigration, which is running at record levels.A planned review of the Reserve Bank Act could result in an expanded role for the central bank, said Shamubeel Eaqub, an economist with Sense Partners. This could see the Reserve Bank of New Zealand “being directed to focus on not just inflation, but also much greater priority on exchange rate volatility and full employment”, Mr Eaqub said.Mr Peters, the leader of the minor party that was left holding the balance of power after the September 23 election failed to deliver a clear winner, said people had voted for change. The National party, which had led a centrist government since 2008, won 56 seats in the 120-seat parliament, Labour 46, New Zealand First nine, the Greens eight and the rightwing ACT one.Mr Peters has since been in talks with Bill English, the National party leader and incumbent prime minister, and the Labour leader.Ms Ardern’s rise followed a whirlwind election campaign that led to a Phoenix-like resurgence for Labour. ”Grant Duncan, associate professor at Massey University, said: “Ardern is an outwardly warm, engaging and intelligent person that has tapped into a desire for change. “But she is also capable of being tough and her remarkable rise shows that you underestimate her at your peril.”
__________________________________________________ _____________________________________

Under estimate her at your peril. I'd say that was virtually impossible

[Ocean1]

The ministry of healths own survey.

Really you never mentioned the national party or their figures really........
But don't worry the real figures are much worse



Then you tried to justify that statement using what was labours increased spending on healthcare you really are stupid.

Fuck me, enough bullshit to choke a galloping gish horse.

And none of it even slightly addresses the fact that health funding has never been higher.

[husaberg]

Fuck me, enough bullshit to choke a horse.

And none of it even slightly addresses the fact that health funding has never been higher.

So you don't believe the ministry of heaths own figures
show us all the figures then that shows in real terms the healthcare funding has never been higher in real terms.

remember you posted this

Note this was Labours spending not nationals spending you deluded idiot
look at the dates.

The release of the figures follow leaked documents revealing proposals for wholesale changes to the governance and funding of district health boards.
It found Core Crown health expenditure nominally increased from about $13.1b in 2009-10 to about $15.6b in this financial year.
It was $485m lower than the expenditure growth required to maintain 2009-10 funding levels, taking into account inflation and population growth.

Its estimated that $2.3 billion was needed to restore funding for 2017/18 to 2009/10 levels. Only $0.8 billion was provided so the shortfall compared to 2010 is $1.4 billion.
This shortfall has steadily grown over those years. It means that the next Government will need to find well over $2 billion for 2018/19 if it wishes to restore the value of funding. • The Health Vote is forecast to rise slightly as a proportion of Gross Domestic Product (GDP), but only because of the pay equity settlement for care and support workers. If it had maintained the proportion of GDP it had in 2009/10, it would be $1.6 billion higher in 2017/18. • District Health Boards (DHBs) are underfunded by an estimated $107 million below what they need to cover increased costs and demographic changes. •

[Crasherfromwayback]

Fuck me, enough bullshit to choke a galloping gish horse.

And none of it even slightly addresses the fact that health funding has never been higher.

It matters not one flying fuck if funding has never been higher, if the need for more is rising at a much higher rate though eh?. It's called a shortfall. Bit like building 1000 houses a year, yet importing 73000 people a year, 95% of whom, want to live in Auckland. But no, keep importing Asians, who'll continue to vote National, because they let them in. Once you control the Auck vote, you'll gen have enough to get in despite what the rest of the country wants. Change. That's what we (you know, the majority) of Kiwis wanted. And do you know what happened? That's just what we finally got. So again, suck it up mate. Get another box of tissues...and get it all out before it eats you alive.

[Brian d marge]

Snip,. .A planned review of the Reserve Bank Act could result in an expanded role for the central bank

And at this point one realizes ....

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[eldog]

Snip,. .A planned review of the Reserve Bank Act could result in an expanded role for the central bank

And at this point one realizes ....

now that a lot of deadwood has been removed, we could Nationalise everything

[eldog]

This is true. There's nothing like actual experience either yourself, a family member or friend having to go through the system to firstly, be diagnosed, then referred, then wait....to find out just how stretched and poorly resourced the health system actually is.

The "unable to afford doctors visit" is also sadly accurate. Particularly in the elderly.

But this would seen to be helpful in Mr Ocean's eyes as it will reduce the numbers needing help....

disorganised was what I saw.
Hand holding

and only a couple of overworked people making decisions, the rest .......

however, a recent family member required emergency services, it actually worked as it should.
Just could inform patient a bit more about how long they want them stick around so planning could be done.
- Transport, food, recovery and help required. Turned out OK.

[jasonu]

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011, and Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners president Tim Malloy warned the risks of patients avoiding doctors' visits for years could result in greater inequity in healthcare

He blamed the problem on what he said was an annual funding gap of about $45 million, created by a funding formula based on enrolment numbers, rather than on the number of times a practice saw its patients.
"The formula they use to correct for each year is fundamentally flawed," he said.

Survey of almost 6000 health workers found:

90% Say the health system doesn’t have the staff and resourcerequired to give New Zealanders the healthcare they need when they need it.
61% Say New Zealanders access to health care over the last fiveyears has decreased.
72% Say their workload and work pressures aren’t reasonable.
84% Say their workload and work pressures have increased overthe last five years.
90% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting New Zealanders’ access to healthcare.
82% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting their workload and work pressure.

A 2016 workforce survey by the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners found 44 per cent of all GPs plan to retire within 10 years – up from 36 per cent just two years ago.
Otago Medical School associate professor Sue Pullon​ said the smpending shortage could be traced back to the 1990s, when annual positions in GP training were halved from 100 to 50.

. Health professionals make difficult ethical decisions about life and death – treatment or no treatment – and this requires considerable judgment, autonomy, specialisation and knowledge. Yet, under-funding and restricted resources mean the service runs largely on goodwilll. Could this be the reason we have experienced ongoing strike action by junior doctors since 2006? Is it why senior doctors have also threatened industrial action? Perhaps it is the reason our health service relies so heavily on internationally-trained medics – over 40 per cent at last count and the highest level of any country in the OECD.

NZ also relies on the highest rate of internationally-qualified nurses (at 25 per cent) in the OECD.

How much is a GP visit?