The 2017 Election Thread

[YellowDog]

Would be fantastic if it was easy, but generally it never has been. My point was that labour won't (can't) change that overnight, nor can they change that in the next 20 plus years.

Lowering the LVR to 10% and 5%, for first time buyers, might help a lot of people now and give others hope for the future

[Crasherfromwayback]

When you find yourself disagreeing with facts it's generally recognised as a good idea to review your belief system.

Best you have a look in the mirror then matey. You're still talking shit.

[Woodman]

See what happens when we get a labour government. The All Blacks lose, and this is just the start.

[YellowDog]

Interesting to read that the Czechs now have a leader, whom polled less than 30% of the vote:

Ano (Yes): 29.6%
Freedom and Free Democracy party (SPD) : 10.6%
Civic Democratic party: 11.3%
The Czech Pirate Party: 10.8%
Communist Party of Bohemia and Moravia (KSCM): 7.8%
Social Democrats (CSSD): 7.3%

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.e88578b761bf

[nerrrd]

See what happens when we get a labour government. The All Blacks lose, and this is just the start.

Not like 'lucky' John Key, with the GFC, pike river, and three major earthquakes.*

*the point being there's no causal relationship here, move along

There won't be any fundamental change I'm guessing, for all the reasons smarter people on here understand better than me. Just more fiddling around the edges. OK so Winston was in the forefront while 'coalition idol' was being played out, but Labour's still got the most control over things, and so far I don't see any concrete evidence that they'll be any less centrist than National. Given Jacinda's lack of experience I can't see that changing, others will be driving things behind the scenes.

So what spending there is may shift towards health and education, but given the horror stories coming out of health especially (since the current model appears to be collapsing around it's own ankles) that's probably a good thing.

And if the government falls over we'lll just have another election and the Nats will be back anyway. Same shit, different day.

[Ocean1]

given the horror stories coming out of health especially (since the current model appears to be collapsing around it's own ankles) that's probably a good thing.

Got any numbers to go with that dude?

Outside of the number of media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest, obviously...

[Ocean1]

And so it begins: https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/...greens-unaware

[YellowDog]

And so it begins: https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/...greens-unaware

The Greens can wait until he disappears down that mine shaft, never to be seen again, before getting back on track. Chances of the old codger making it, back out of there, must be quite slim.

Jacinda could learn a thing or two from them too: https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/natio...cid=spartandhp

Not going to cut immigration? - Wait until his down that mine shaft, before you start changing his tune for him

I love politics and all of the parties (except Colin Craig)

[nerrrd]

Got any numbers to go with that dude?

Outside of the number of media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest, obviously...

'Insiders with a vested interest', 'Professionals at the coalface who actually know what's going on and have a duty of care'...'po-tay-to', 'po-tah-to'

Just wait until the docs start telling the DHBs, 'no, I can't work extra shifts because it's against my Hippocratic (or whatever it is now) oath'. No coincidence it was a NZer who sponsored that change.

The sky is falling, the sky is falling...!!!

[husaberg]

Got any numbers to go with that dude?

Outside of the number of media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest, obviously...

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011, and Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners president Tim Malloy warned the risks of patients avoiding doctors' visits for years could result in greater inequity in healthcare

He blamed the problem on what he said was an annual funding gap of about $45 million, created by a funding formula based on enrolment numbers, rather than on the number of times a practice saw its patients.
"The formula they use to correct for each year is fundamentally flawed," he said.

Survey of almost 6000 health workers found:

90% Say the health system doesn’t have the staff and resourcerequired to give New Zealanders the healthcare they need when they need it.
61% Say New Zealanders access to health care over the last fiveyears has decreased.
72% Say their workload and work pressures aren’t reasonable.
84% Say their workload and work pressures have increased overthe last five years.
90% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting New Zealanders’ access to healthcare.
82% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting their workload and work pressure.

A 2016 workforce survey by the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners found 44 per cent of all GPs plan to retire within 10 years – up from 36 per cent just two years ago.
Otago Medical School associate professor Sue Pullon​ said the smpending shortage could be traced back to the 1990s, when annual positions in GP training were halved from 100 to 50.

. Health professionals make difficult ethical decisions about life and death – treatment or no treatment – and this requires considerable judgment, autonomy, specialisation and knowledge. Yet, under-funding and restricted resources mean the service runs largely on goodwilll. Could this be the reason we have experienced ongoing strike action by junior doctors since 2006? Is it why senior doctors have also threatened industrial action? Perhaps it is the reason our health service relies so heavily on internationally-trained medics – over 40 per cent at last count and the highest level of any country in the OECD.

NZ also relies on the highest rate of internationally-qualified nurses (at 25 per cent) in the OECD.

[husaberg]

http://www.watchme.co.nz/entertainme...g-with-labour/

http://www.watchme.co.nz/entertainme...ike/hard-work/

http://www.watchme.co.nz/entertainme...g-met-jacinda/

http://www.watchme.co.nz/entertainme...olden-showers/

http://www.watchme.co.nz/entertainme...isnt-flagging/

http://www.watchme.co.nz/entertainme...alanders-dumb/

[Ocean1]

One in nine Kiwis are not getting the GP care they need because they cannot afford it, Ministry of Health survey figures show.
The latest New Zealand Health Survey estimates more than 500,000 people have unmet healthcare needs because of the cost of a GP visit.
The figure has remained constant since 2011, and Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners president Tim Malloy warned the risks of patients avoiding doctors' visits for years could result in greater inequity in healthcare

He blamed the problem on what he said was an annual funding gap of about $45 million, created by a funding formula based on enrolment numbers, rather than on the number of times a practice saw its patients.
"The formula they use to correct for each year is fundamentally flawed," he said.

Survey of almost 6000 health workers found:

90% Say the health system doesn’t have the staff and resourcerequired to give New Zealanders the healthcare they need when they need it.
61% Say New Zealanders access to health care over the last fiveyears has decreased.
72% Say their workload and work pressures aren’t reasonable.
84% Say their workload and work pressures have increased overthe last five years.
90% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting New Zealanders’ access to healthcare.
82% Say the Government’s current level of health funding isaffecting their workload and work pressure.

A 2016 workforce survey by the Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners found 44 per cent of all GPs plan to retire within 10 years – up from 36 per cent just two years ago.
Otago Medical School associate professor Sue Pullon​ said the smpending shortage could be traced back to the 1990s, when annual positions in GP training were halved from 100 to 50.

. Health professionals make difficult ethical decisions about life and death – treatment or no treatment – and this requires considerable judgment, autonomy, specialisation and knowledge. Yet, under-funding and restricted resources mean the service runs largely on goodwilll. Could this be the reason we have experienced ongoing strike action by junior doctors since 2006? Is it why senior doctors have also threatened industrial action? Perhaps it is the reason our health service relies so heavily on internationally-trained medics – over 40 per cent at last count and the highest level of any country in the OECD.

NZ also relies on the highest rate of internationally-qualified nurses (at 25 per cent) in the OECD.

So outside of the media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest you got nothing.

We've done this before dude, health spending in real terms has increased more in the last decade than at any time in our history, you no listen.

http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publicat...0/10-01/23.htm

[Ocean1]

'Insiders with a vested interest', 'Professionals at the coalface who actually know what's going on and have a duty of care'...'po-tay-to', 'po-tah-to'

Just wait until the docs start telling the DHBs, 'no, I can't work extra shifts because it's against my Hippocratic (or whatever it is now) oath'. No coincidence it was a NZer who sponsored that change.

The sky is falling, the sky is falling...!!!

They're certainly an uppity bunch.

There's a thing about health that most people completely miss: It's a cost that doesn't simply represent a diminishing return on expenditure, it's a cost that actually creates further expenditure. Health issues that a generation ago were untreatable are now being successfully treated, (often at a cost that simply wouldn't have been acceptable 10 years ago) and those patients WILL be back, requiring more expenditure. Fix them up again and...

[husaberg]

So outside of the media feeding frenzy quotes from insiders with a vested interest you got nothing.

We've done this before dude, health spending in real terms has increased more in the last decade than at any time in our history, you no listen.

http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publicat...0/10-01/23.htm

Btw you do realise those figures are for Labours increases rather than nationals they only came to power in November 2008.
By then the budgets for the next year were set.

Funny Some of what you are so readliy dismissing is ministry of healths own figures retard
In case you missed it we have an aging population so the nats miniscule funding increases are not going far enough.
The best way to measure Government spending is to compare it to the size of the economy. And in this sense, an argument can be made that health funding has actually gone down in "real terms". This can be seen in the Budget analysis carried out by Victoria University's School of Government and the New Zealand Institute for Economic Research, which says "Real per capita spending in health will fall slightly the coming Budget year (-0.1 per cent), but over the forecast period is projected to fall to 7.5 per cent below current levels by 2021"

They're certainly an uppity bunch.

There's a thing about health that most people completely miss: It's a cost that doesn't simply represent a diminishing return on expenditure, it's a cost that actually creates further expenditure. Health issues that a generation ago were untreatable are now being successfully treated, (often at a cost that simply wouldn't have been acceptable 10 years ago) and those patients WILL be back, requiring more expenditure. Fix them up again and...

[Ocean1]

Funny Some of what you are so readliy dismissing is ministry of healths own figures retard

Yeah? Which items from your above confirmation bias trawl do you believe represents moh numbers?