Police motorcycle Safety vid.

[old slider]

I must remember next time I swerve/brake to avoid a crash to post on here that I used "Roadcraft" today. I will then know I am as good as you.

As a MLC returning rider who has only been back in the saddle for 2-3 years riding a big heavy sort of road couch and a nice little 650 parallel twin sort of sport bike, I struggle to follow your reasoning.

Maybe I am over cautious or maybe because I know how much it hurts I am looking out for any potential problems as I ride, maybe my roads are much less congested than yours, admittedly I would be way out of my comfort zone riding in any of our big centres, but that would be with any type of vehicle.

Swerving and emergency braking are something I practice in a safe environment, but fingers crossed, or maybe as you say it has been luck, it is not something I have had to do since my teenage to late 20s years racing around local streets on a plethora of bikes.

I am aware shit happens and I try to ensure that I do everything in my power to protect myself, that starts with putting on appropriate clothing and gear every time I throw a leg over, but I think my biggest protection is what is inside my head.

[Moi]

As a MLC returning rider who has only been back in the saddle for 2-3 years riding a big heavy sort of road couch and a nice little 650 parallel twin sort of sport bike, I struggle to follow your reasoning.

Maybe I am over cautious or maybe because I know how much it hurts I am looking out for any potential problems as I ride, maybe my roads are much less congested than yours, admittedly I would be way out of my comfort zone riding in any of our big centres, but that would be with any type of vehicle.

Swerving and emergency braking are something I practice in a safe environment, but fingers crossed, or maybe as you say it has been luck, it is not something I have had to do since my teenage to late 20s years racing around local streets on a plethora of bikes.

I am aware shit happens and I try to ensure that I do everything in my power to protect myself, that starts with putting on appropriate clothing and gear every time I throw a leg over, but I think my biggest protection is what is inside my head.

I'd suggest that many KBers are of a very similar mindset...

[nzspokes]

There is nothing wrong with being cautious and being an MLC rider its fully understandable due to the statistical risk with MLC guys. Your choice of bike can influence how cautious you have to be too as some offer better visability, torque, braking and ground clearance than others. As a matter of interest do you think if you had never given up riding would you feel more confident today?

I am over cautious in my own way too e.g: I will not do group rides and I take notice of speed advisory signs on bends. I just dont brag about it like the riding school grads on here who have learnt fancy names like "Roadcraft" to explain slaming on the brakes or swerving to avoid a crash and coming on here saying their "Roadcraft" riding school saved them.

Roadcraft was released to the public in the 50s.

[old slider]

There is nothing wrong with being cautious and being an MLC rider its fully understandable due to the statistical risk with MLC guys. Your choice of bike can influence how cautious you have to be too as some offer better visability, torque, braking and ground clearance than others. As a matter of interest do you think if you had never given up riding would you feel more confident today?

I am over cautious in my own way too e.g: I will not do group rides and I take notice of speed advisory signs on bends. I just dont brag about it like the riding school grads on here who have learnt fancy names like "Roadcraft" to explain slaming on the brakes or swerving to avoid a crash and coming on here saying their "Roadcraft" riding school saved them.

I don't think I would mix up cautious with confidence Cassina, I have always felt reasonably but certainly not over confident on a motorcycle, well apart from the time I was stopped by Mr Po whilst riding my mates step through Suzuki as quickly as it would go up our street when I was about 13, then I felt quite inadequate.

I used the word cautious as a way of explaining how I try to keep my eyes and ears (even nose after reading on here about the smell and often tell tale sign of a diesel spill) alert to any unforeseen or potential hazards that maybe near and far to myself.
Others may explain it as something akin to roadcraft, hopefully after absorbing all the info available on here it helps many of us to be safer in our riding habits.

[caspernz]

I bet people were able to brake and swerve to avoid hazards long before then though and its just been thought up as a fancy name like a brand name to promote business for driving/riding schools. Eg we teach the "Roadcraft Way" I have only heard that name on Kbiker so it cant be that public that is I have never heard it said in road safety advertising.

That might be down to you not having partaken in any training post license. Roadcraft is used as the basis for the ACC funded Rideforever series. Roadcraft also forms the basis for most defensive riding/driving teaching.

But those of us who've partaken in any kind of post license rider/driver training already know this

[Woodman]

Not all of us need to go to riding school to learn the dangers out there and there is a saying that goes "Everyone Learns Differently" I have not read anything on here to make me a safer rider so due to the number of "non stop" years I have been riding over 40 I must have it all sussed.

Hang on. You have said numerous times on here that you think that rider courses would have helped you avoid all your not at fault accidents.

[nzspokes]

I bet people were able to brake and swerve to avoid hazards long before then though and its just been thought up as a fancy name like a brand name to promote business for driving/riding schools. Eg we teach the "Roadcraft Way" I have only heard that name on Kbiker so it cant be that public that is I have never heard it said in road safety advertising.

Clearly your observation skills for training are just as bad as when on the road then. Its not a brand. IAM are a charity and work for free.

As stated its the basis for Defensive Driving which has been around for some time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roadcraft

[nzspokes]

I don't think I would mix up cautious with confidence Cassina, I have always felt reasonably but certainly not over confident on a motorcycle, well apart from the time I was stopped by Mr Po whilst riding my mates step through Suzuki as quickly as it would go up our street when I was about 13, then I felt quite inadequate.

I used the word cautious as a way of explaining how I try to keep my eyes and ears (even nose after reading on here about the smell and often tell tale sign of a diesel spill) alert to any unforeseen or potential hazards that maybe near and far to myself.
Others may explain it as something akin to roadcraft, hopefully after absorbing all the info available on here it helps many of us to be safer in our riding habits.

What you are being is smart.

[Viking01]

I must remember next time I swerve/brake to avoid a crash to post on here that I used "Roadcraft" today. I will then know I am as good as you.

Look, just don't bother (to swerve or brake , that is).

[Moi]

Larson answers the question "Why?"



From God's Kitchen : And a generous amount of JERKS, just to make it interesting.

[caspernz]

No I said rider courses would "NOT" have helped otherwise I would have done one to learn how to emergency brake and swerve. There was no time to brake or swerve when I was hit which some on here percieve as impossible but they have just got lucky so far.

The sad part is that if you'd actually partake in a Rideforever course, your eyes would be opened to what one can do. Your choice though.

I could write a novel here, but as it's been said before, proper forward observation will greatly reduce the number of times one has to emergency brake and/or swerve.

It is amusing watching Youtube cam videos where the driver/rider of camera car/bike gets upset by the actions of another road user. Most of the time one can reasonably pick what is up, well before the cam driver/rider responds. Merely confirms that human error is largely to blame in something like 90% of accidents. Train the human better, reduce the number of accidents. I've done my bit, and encourage others to do likewise.

I'll be upfront and admit that, until I'd taken part in defensive/advanced driver/rider training, I too thought nothing could be done to make me a better driver/rider. I was wrong, and until you partake in some training you have no business to run down the benefits brought about by such training. Sure explains why you cop so much flack on KB though...

[awayatc]

the number of "non stop" years I have been riding over 40 I must have it all sussed.

How many accidents you been involved in....?

How many years you been riding accident free...?

Those are the only number that matter.

If you did have accidents your witchcraft wasn't up to specs...

Time to see if road craft would serve it's purpose better.

Obviously couldn't be worse

[caspernz]

You have missed the whole point of my argument about riding schools in that they can as you say make "YOU" a better rider but thats the limit of their ability. I have said on here many times going to riding school does not help control the speed and distance from you of another motorist when they screw up. All those who think riding school will help them in such a situation are deluded in my opinion.

Nah the point of your argument isn't lost on me, but what you're missing is that if you've been properly trained you'll spot the screw-ups of others develop, thus giving you a bit more time to react. It's called situational awareness, and part of that means reducing speed when one sees a developing situation and making a plan. It can be taught, and it doesn't have luck as a primary component.

[caspernz]

How many accidents you been involved in....?

How many years you been riding accident free...?

Those are the only number that matter.

If you did have accidents your witchcraft wasn't up to specs...

Time to see if road craft would serve it's purpose better.

Obviously couldn't be worse

Eloquently summed up.

[george formby]

You have missed the whole point of my argument about riding schools in that they can as you say make "YOU" a better rider but thats the limit of their ability.

Finally admitting you're to stupid to improve? Good stuff from a contradictory, cherry picking, troll.

Oh, most on here debate, that requires facts. You argue, that's mere opinion.

YAAF S.Troll on.