BUACA: Bikers United Against Child Abuse - Australia

[James Deuce]

Jim - I hope you have 10 pound line and a good reel on....this ones a fighter

Dude!! - I'm gonna need the REALLY BIG pliers to get the hook out! The Leatherman just won't cut it.

[wkid_one]

My thoughts for those that give a fuck.

Great idea - but - why Child Abuse?? We could end up with Bikers Against Child Abuse, Bikers Against Drunk Driving??

I think any fight against Child Abuse is a great idea - I just question 'why bikers?'. This makes limited sense to me.

I think you would struggle to find many people who were FOR child abuse, mental, emotional or physical. I just can't tie a link from Biking to Child Abuse? Maybe there doesn't need to be a link - I don't know?

Also - what does this achieve - what are the outcomes? Is the effort worth the reward (some would argue any return is better than none)? Is the 'biking voice' a big enuf voice to make any ripples on the pond.

[Spook]

Spook, glad I am cracking you up Yes 400 views but only 38 replies. The question may be what prevents these watchers from posting their opinion? Or is it the same sad person viewing over and over (we had another troll who claimed there were only 15 people that posted on this whole site).

I certainly don't ignore child abuse and I have had to deal with the results of serious neglect and child abuse by others to others. So please don't even go there.


So who are these people 'not' against child abuse?(apart from paedophiles)

Do you know that most child abuse starts with a parent trying to teach a child a lesson, perhaps put a little fear into them? What lesson do you think your ''scare the pants off them" approach will give? it's the same lesson an abused child gets....if you are bigger and stronger you can instill fear because of the power you wield, and what you can(do?) do. I notice that this isn't even directed at child abusers. This is not the way to protect children or make a significant change long term.

PS interesting that you edited your first reply...you certainly aren't a poet

Were you sitting there waiting for me?

well okay Ill concede the Poet side, but that's it.
Now Jim...

Look, perception as to how you see MY writing and how, or if leads to a specific Paradigm of Child Abuse??? That's a 'bit' specific, lets try and look at the BIGGER picture ok,..for a second, I know you dont like to but hang on fer a sec ,,,,
, let me see, you expect it to point at Paedophiles *(not Pedo ). But, Anything that exists that works towards Child Abuse has it's imperceptible positive reactions within some socio-economic areas. It also has very deep ramifications within some communities. But you're dragging me off into Social topics, and I cant claim to give an expert opinion on that,..but I will get an expert opinion, IF you email all your concerns, Ill send them on to a person close to BUACA and have an answer in that area for you. How's that....at least Im fair, and know when you're asking something of me that needs expert opinion...we're growing too, we take on board all interesting points of view...

Now to deal with people not responding, as I said.....before....this isnt going to raise everyones eyebrow and have them come into this with an opinion,..the reason Im interested in YOU is because you HAVE. Simple. Im not here to 'shake' you down for your money, Im not even asking you PERSONALLY to become part of any organisation OR club...right....but when you come up with points you dont substantiate, I have to question why...tell me why the website is non representative for a start..if you give VALID comments, I guarantee you we will be interested.

ok..I need a smoke and a rest,...and I havent checked my typos yet so...bear with me..

Spook

[James Deuce]

gotta agree with you there on the last point,..but that's the only one.... it's all a little ambiguous.....Jim.....however,...can you name one group that represents that.

You've made plenty of statements with simply NO information to back your claims.....please reiterate (is that how you spell it?)


Im sorry if I appear a little,......................harsh,
Spook

It's not harsh - it's precisely the kind of reply I expected. I never suggested that child abuse is not a social problem of a huge magnitude. I just don't like your approach.

Don't call me Jimmy.

[bluninja]

My thoughts for those that give a fuck.

Great idea - but - why Child Abuse?? We could end up with Bikers Against Child Abuse, Bikers Against Drunk Driving??

I think any fight against Child Abuse is a great idea - I just question 'why bikers?'. This makes limited sense to me.

I think you would struggle to find many people who were FOR child abuse, mental, emotional or physical. I just can't tie a link from Biking to Child Abuse? Maybe there doesn't need to be a link - I don't know?

Also - what does this achieve - what are the outcomes? Is the effort worth the reward (some would argue any return is better than none)? Is the 'biking voice' a big enuf voice to make any ripples on the pond.

Don't forget Bikers Against Abortion....people would flock to that one

WKID FWIW I think even special interest voices will make enough ripples when added up together. There will be thousands out this weekend on the Westpac run...and that's a big ripple through Auckland.

[Spook]

Don't forget Bikers Against Abortion....people would flock to that one

WKID FWIW I think even special interest voices will make enough ripples when added up together. There will be thousands out this weekend on the Westpac run...and that's a big ripple through Auckland.

Yes, Bikers across this planet IS a big enough voice to make a difference

[Spook]

It's not harsh - it's precisely the kind of reply I expected. I never suggested that child abuse is not a social problem of a huge magnitude. I just don't like your approach.

Don't call me Jimmy.

Ok JIM, I reiterate...NOONE is asking you PERSONALLY to do anything. You make it sound like I got ya hogtied and signed up....Noone said 'we' were little sobby Angels and do-gooders, ..we're Bikers,...I thought the title would have given you that hint? No one is asking you to like the approach, doesnt feel harsh to me...and when you DO say no and turn your back on this,..50, 60, 100 more Will step up and take your place.. and Ill smile everytime I meet a new member.....

it's simple logic...

I hate Child Abuse SO much, that Im willing to make a stand, no matter what it takes to voice it, until Governments give up hiding facts,.....until we make a change in attitudes, until those that harm kids, go to jail and stay there.....and if that pisses you OFF, then welcome to the real world
All I gotta hear is,..This aint for you....right...just say it, and let it go.....no matter what YOU think.....it doesnt change the fact that Bikers United Against CHild Abuse are going to make a difference........in a big way! That's a Promise.

You know,..we're only JUST getting started in this debate, Im not leaving here until we have hundreds of opinions, ...hundreds.... stick around and see what comes of it....

[bluninja]

Spook, sorry...what points didn't I substantiate? Please be more specific and I can respond in a way that helps you.

I have been to the BUACA site. I too am passionate about the welfare and safety of children....and I whilst I support your right to do your part the way you believe is best, I will put across my position if I think you are weakening the fight against child abuse.....this is just a variation of your "ignoring child abuse is child abuse"

Two specifics. Your logo/patch. What were you (or whoever designed it) thinking using a 'clenched fist punching through' for your logo/patch? Think about what that symbol represents to an abused child. It is a symbol of force and violence. The abused child has probably seen a clenched fist for real far too many times.

Why do the bikers have to ride 750cc and above to be a member? What does that have to do with promoting the protection of children? So a biker, say on a 400cc bike, can't combine his/her passion for riding with a desire to help children.

In my post I made an assumption that paedophiles are automatically child abusers....I asked who are the others 'not' against child abuse? As in...I was asking for specifics, and substantiation.

[Spook]

Spook, sorry...what points didn't I substantiate? Please be more specific and I can respond in a way that helps you.

I have been to the BUACA site. I too am passionate about the welfare and safety of children....and I whilst I support your right to do your part the way you believe is best, I will put across my position if I think you are weakening the fight against child abuse.....this is just a variation of your "ignoring child abuse is child abuse"

Two specifics. Your logo/patch. What were you (or whoever designed it) thinking using a 'clenched fist punching through' for your logo/patch? Think about what that symbol represents to an abused child. It is a symbol of force and violence. The abused child has probably seen a clenched fist for real far too many times.

Why do the bikers have to ride 750cc and above to be a member? What does that have to do with promoting the protection of children? So a biker, say on a 400cc bike, can't combine his/her passion for riding with a desire to help children.

In my post I made an assumption that paedophiles are automatically child abusers....I asked who are the others 'not' against child abuse? As in...I was asking for specifics, and substantiation.

Lets start at the beginning, have you gone and looked at the first website I offered for info? ....half of these questions would have been answered. Please GO there then come back with the questions left over after you've gathered the info you seek.... I HATE TYPING when info is available... and not even you are going to get me to type it all out here...sorry...youve seen how good my typos are and you want me to......NM

As for the Logo, there are reason you'll see on the site.....and point taken BUT...........
As for further membership details, you are right about a few points, and this Feb, in SA they will be relaxed as you so rightly pointed out, but we needed to start somewhere, the consitiution was the toughest,..and still up for discussion...but that is dependant on where you live and your laws. Do you see someone on a Moped coming with us 4,500kms on the National run? There's reasons for something that we just have to have....

....ok

and for any future comments, please feel free to go to our websites for information.....if you arent happy with that,..email us!

[bluninja]

Lets start at the beginning, have you gone and looked at the first website I offered for info? ....no because if you did half of these questions wouldnt have been raised. GO there then come back with the questions left over after you've gathered the info you seek.... I HATE TYPING when info is available... and not even you are going to get me to type it all out here...



....ok

Ok been to the US site. They don't specify 750cc just have a bike or regular access.

As for the rest; wished I read this first. I can't support your intiative at all. I would urge others to have a look at your site and decide for themselves. BACA's modus operandi and the way it works are directed at threats external to the family. Like it or not most child abuse is perpetrated within the family/friend circle, where your interventions couldn't succeed.

This IS a vigilante organisation. An implied threat is still a threat. "I am not alone, and you don't want to mess with my family". The intervention takes place whilst the 'official' process is going through.

As far as the patch goes...it's still a symbol of violence....it has no place in any organisation working towards removing any form of abuse.

[Spook]

Ok been to the US site. They don't specify 750cc just have a bike or regular access.

As for the rest; wished I read this first. I can't support your intiative at all. I would urge others to have a look at your site and decide for themselves. BACA's modus operandi and the way it works are directed at threats external to the family. Like it or not most child abuse is perpetrated within the family/friend circle, where your interventions couldn't succeed.

This IS a vigilante organisation. An implied threat is still a threat. "I am not alone, and you don't want to mess with my family". The intervention takes place whilst the 'official' process is going through.

As far as the patch goes...it's still a symbol of violence....it has no place in any organisation working towards removing any form of abuse.

Christ, Im surrounded by people not paying attention. The BACA site you looked at is based on AMERICAN LAW! not Australia, we haven't even finished the AUSTRALIAN rules set against Australian Law and Bylaws... you're really not paying attention are you. Told you, they need switched on people, not someone who reads the surface and makes idiot judgement.

And again, thankyou for your interest,...next..

[bluninja]

Christ, Im surrounded by people not paying attention. The BACA site you looked at is based on AMERICAN LAW! not Australia, we haven't even finished the AUSTRALIAN rules set against Australian Law and Bylaws... you're really not paying attention are you. Told you, they need switched on people, not someone who reads the surface and makes idiot judgement.

And again, thankyou for your interest,...next..

Come back when (if?) you've got your shit fully together....probably never.

What is the point of referring someone to a site that is not reflective of what you are doing?....err plan to do?....hold on you've just got a website.....whoops 2 websites...and they're not complete......you're making it up as you go along. You're seem as much a cowboy as the americans you are aping....except they allow all bikes....not just ones over 750 cc.

These are rhetorical questions ....you don't have to answer....but I forgot you are all about rhetoric

[wkid_one]

I agree with Blue.

I am going to start Bikers Against Bikes......my website is www.bikersAbikers.co.nz.....go there

[wkid_one]

Christ, Im surrounded by people not paying attention. The BACA site you looked at is based on AMERICAN LAW! not Australia, we haven't even finished the AUSTRALIAN rules set against Australian Law and Bylaws... you're really not paying attention are you. Told you, they need switched on people, not someone who reads the surface and makes idiot judgement.

And again, thankyou for your interest,...next..

Um - shouldn't you come back ONCE you have your Bylaws sorted??? Really, this is like asking someone to vote for something without all the information - like MMP - and look how successful that was. Everyone said yes, and it was an unmitigated disaster......Maybe I should start Bikers Against MMP?

[Big Dog]

Um - shouldn't you come back ONCE you have your Bylaws sorted??? Really, this is like asking someone to vote for something without all the information - like MMP - and look how successful that was. Everyone said yes, and it was an unmitigated disaster......Maybe I should start Bikers Against MMP?

WTF?????????
Last I heard all he was looking for was an expression of interest.

I for one want to see how things shape up.

How did this get from a request for expressions of interest to the public lynching above?

Clearly spook is not the most eloquant of spokesman, this does not make his cause trivial.

I voted against MMP. Nobody listened to me then either.

The one down side to the Dis/Reputrable memebers list is that certain members are doing there best to spark controversy just to get one of the now coveted three spots.

Surely if you are not interested in contributing in a positive manner the least you could do is say "Not my cup of tea!" and unsubscribe this thread.