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Thread: 450 triple race bikes

  1. #16
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    9th January 2005 - 22:12
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    In terms of power do you get a straight up 75% of the 4 cylinder output (say 90hp??) or are there other losses?
    I thought elections were decided by angry posts on social media. - F5 Dave

  2. #17
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    9th August 2005 - 19:52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave- View Post
    Totally curious now, how do you go about cooling them? rig them into the coolant?
    Using an inductor is rare. But the 1 person I know of who did this routed the wires to the front of the radiator and bolted the inductor on there so it was sitting in the air stream.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave- View Post
    5th set of injectors? huh? as far as I know the most "sets" you can get a 2 in bikes with staged injection?

    What about the spark plugs?

    Do you remove the 2nd stage injector too?
    Spark plugs stay in most cases. Still gets spark just there's nothing to light up. The spark plug hole is so restrictive it's a complete waste of time to remove it and take care of the air and oil pumping in and out. It was away from anything that could catch fire and the air was enough cooling.

    So, as you know, a 600 has 4 sets of injectors. With the 5th set you unplug the injectors on 1 cylinder and plug in the 5th set, which aren't attached to fuel at all. They're simply there to make the ECU think there's still 4 working cylinders. Usually people cool them with a C shaped piece of tubing that attaches to both ends of the 5th injectors and fill them with water.

    You have to do both injectors on a cylinder, otherwise it's not a triple.

    Quote Originally Posted by HenryDorsetCase View Post
    In terms of power do you get a straight up 75% of the 4 cylinder output (say 90hp??) or are there other losses?
    It's less than 75%, depending on how you disable a cylinder. The best 450 triples have the piston + conrod removed (no pumping or friction losses) and they get somewhere around 72%. They do vibrate a little, but nothing serious. Still way more reliable and cheaper than a suped up twin though.
    Zen wisdom: No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously. - obviously had KB in mind when he came up with that gem

    Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity

  3. #18
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    9th January 2005 - 22:12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mental Trousers View Post
    It's less than 75%, depending on how you disable a cylinder. The best 450 triples have the piston + conrod removed (no pumping or friction losses) and they get somewhere around 72%. They do vibrate a little, but nothing serious. Still way more reliable and cheaper than a suped up twin though.
    Or a 25 year old ex-streetbike that has had the tits thrashed off it....
    I thought elections were decided by angry posts on social media. - F5 Dave

  4. #19
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    30th November 2008 - 11:15
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    suzuki
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    would removing the camshaft lope and crank on missing cyclinder help with balancing ?

  5. #20
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    13th June 2010 - 17:47
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    Quote Originally Posted by wayne View Post
    would removing the camshaft lope and crank on missing cyclinder help with balancing ?
    No. If you go the full crank plus a bolted on bobweight you can achieve quite good balance.
    If you take an end cylinder off including removing that crank throw, you're left with a 3 cylinder crank which is out of balance due to:
    1/ the phasing - 2 up, 1 down at 180 degrees. Big rocking couple as the 2 up are adjacent.
    2/ all the bobweights are all the same weight. To work, the one odd one must be the same weight as the total of the other two.
    Laverda made this work on the 180deg triples - the center cylinder is the odd one and it's bobweights match the total of those on the outer two.
    It's in balance...

    I was told of a 450 triple built by reputable people iin ChCh. The valves had been removed but the piston was still in place. Inlet and exhaust ports blanked off. The guides had not been blocked however so oil went into the cylinder and it had a habit of hydraulicing till someone realised....

  6. #21
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    9th January 2005 - 22:12
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    Here's a stupid question: which cylinder do you disable? Like take a sawzall to one of the end ones* or something else?



    *I know that is unrealistic. No one has that much RTV and spare bits of MDF to block up the holes.
    I thought elections were decided by angry posts on social media. - F5 Dave

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by HenryDorsetCase View Post
    Here's a stupid question: which cylinder do you disable? Like take a sawzall to one of the end ones* or something else?



    *I know that is unrealistic. No one has that much RTV and spare bits of MDF to block up the holes.
    In theory, the one inboard of the primary drive is the best choice. The main bearing feeding that bigend carries a high load from the primary so if no oil is being bled off to the bigend, it should run cooler/better lubrication.

  8. #23
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    9th August 2005 - 19:52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    I was told of a 450 triple built by reputable people iin ChCh. The valves had been removed but the piston was still in place. Inlet and exhaust ports blanked off. The guides had not been blocked however so oil went into the cylinder and it had a habit of hydraulicing till someone realised....
    Did that one end up with holes being drilled in the piston and tungsten being inserted into the wrist pin to balance it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grumph View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HenryDorsetCase View Post
    Here's a stupid question: which cylinder do you disable? Like take a sawzall to one of the end ones* or something else?



    *I know that is unrealistic. No one has that much RTV and spare bits of MDF to block up the holes.
    In theory, the one inboard of the primary drive is the best choice. The main bearing feeding that bigend carries a high load from the primary so if no oil is being bled off to the bigend, it should run cooler/better lubrication.
    Most people have disabled #2 or #3. I had the opportunity to dyno my bike before the engine was rebuilt and we tested disabled different cylinders to see which would be the best. #1 was terrible (by comparison to the others) and it ran like shit, #4 was better but not as good as disabling #2 or #3. Probably different for other engines though.
    Zen wisdom: No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously. - obviously had KB in mind when he came up with that gem

    Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity

  9. #24
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    16th December 2020 - 18:12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mental Trousers View Post
    It's tuned for 4 cylinders. Tuning for 3 only seems to be worth an extra 1hp if you're lucky. One thing the 450's do respond to is some ignition advance. It gives marginally more power (less than 1hp) but on the dyno the torque and power curves are much smoother and the engine just feels better.

    2005 CBR600RR
    Over in South Australia I'm thinking of doing the triple thing with my 2006 CBR600RR. Have you experienced any problems so far with that setup?

  10. #25
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    16th December 2020 - 18:12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roguenut View Post
    Over in South Australia I'm thinking of doing the triple thing with my 2006 CBR600RR. Have you experienced any problems so far with that setup?
    BTW It seems like the original information on 450cc triples is no longer available at www.450triples.com but the Wayback Machine still has older copies.

    Here is the method I plan on using.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roguenut View Post
    BTW It seems like the original information on 450cc triples is no longer available at www.450triples.com but the Wayback Machine still has older copies.

    Here is the method I plan on using.
    Yep, that's me

    One thing that this engine seems to like is running 1+ tooth on the front sprocket and 3+ teeth on the rear sprocket.
    Zen wisdom: No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously. - obviously had KB in mind when he came up with that gem

    Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity

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