BREXIT - some assistance required

[YellowDog]

OK Guys, so I get a vote on whether the UK should stay as part of the EU.

I can see nothing good at all from the EU, that the UK wouldn't still have after leaving, plus a shit loads of cash to spend on health and education.
The UKs second language is now Polish. Many of my old mates from the UK have lost their jobs to people from poor european countries (not just Poles) whom work in the UK to send back their wages, family allowance, and tax credits to Poland; where their wives and families live the relative high life at the expense of the UK tax payer. Yes, they can even claim for their kids not living in the UK. They can also get free healthcare for their families. They are economic migrants and drain the UK's local economy, but they part of Europe, so if you believe in the socialist ideals, then this should be seen as a good thing?

Plus, in my opinion, the EU is run by idiot no brain politicians. "Oh what a suprise, the bleeding obvious to everyone but us, idiotic morons, has just happened". The Schengen zone is a great example of this. There is a permanent 100,000 person queue in France awaiting ways and methods to get into the UK for the benefits gravy-train. These are not europeans, but they are only there because the EU is run by stupid morons.

Frankly, if I was voting in Greece, I'd have told the Germans to sing for their 60 billion euros, but they didn't get a chance and even the guy whom was elected to say 'screw you' to the Germans, changed sides.

I guess that, if the UK was to leave, some Estonian peasant farmers will be replacing the UKs much needed skills and expertise. I don't think so.

Someone persuade me that I am seeing "such minor teething problems, in need of adjustment" all wrong. tell me why the UK being part of the "Union of Socialist European Republics" is a good thing?

[mashman]

OK Guys, so I get a vote on whether the UK should stay as part of the EU.

I can see nothing good at all from the EU, that the UK wouldn't still have after leaving, plus a shit loads of cash to spend on health and education.
The UKs second language is now Polish. Many of my old mates from the UK have lost their jobs to people from poor european countries (not just Poles) whom work in the UK to send back their wages, family allowance, and tax credits to Poland; where their wives and families live the relative high life at the expense of the UK tax payer. Yes, they can even claim for their kids not living in the UK. They can also get free healthcare for their families. They are economic migrants and drain the UK's local economy, but they part of Europe, so if you believe in the socialist ideals, then this should be seen as a good thing?

Plus, in my opinion, the EU is run by idiot no brain politicians. "Oh what a suprise, the bleeding obvious to everyone but us, idiotic morons, has just happened". The Schengen zone is a great example of this. There is a permanent 100,000 person queue in France awaiting ways and methods to get into the UK for the benefits gravy-train. These are not europeans, but they are only there because the EU is run by stupid morons.

Frankly, if I was voting in Greece, I'd have told the Germans to sing for their 60 billion euros, but they didn't get a chance and even the guy whom was elected to say 'screw you' to the Germans, changed sides.

I guess that, if the UK was to leave, some Estomian peasant farmers will be replacing the UKs much needed skills and expertise. I don't think so.

Someone persuade me that I am seeing "such minor teething problems, in need of adjustment" all wrong. tell me why the UK being part of the "Union of Socialist European Republics" is a good thing?

Remove money from the equation and the problem never would have existed. After all, why else do they migrate. Interesting way to get money to european communities that, for some reason, must be starved of it?

Greece did tell the troika to fuck off. They were threatened with having their banks shut down. There's an interesting interview of Varoufakis with Noam Chomsky, although Chomsky barely says a thing, but Varoufakis explains what he was up against in no uncertain terms.

You did ask. But yes, remove money from the equation and all sorts of things simply aren't problems anymore.

[Voltaire]

If England did leave they could bring back hedgehog flavoured crisps and go back to using feet, inches and pounds.

[YellowDog]

Remove money from the equation and the problem never would have existed. After all, why else do they migrate. Interesting way to get money to european communities that, for some reason, must be starved of it?

Greece did tell the troika to fuck off. They were threatened with having their banks shut down. There's an interesting interview of Varoufakis with Noam Chomsky, although Chomsky barely says a thing, but Varoufakis explains what he was up against in no uncertain terms.

You did ask. But yes, remove money from the equation and all sorts of things simply aren't problems anymore.

Thanks for this. You have really just confirmed what I thought. The ridiculous actions of the EU have been serving to remove all money from the equation. They are not quite there yet, however the work in progress continues. Human instink, which has no compatibility with political idealism, will foil this masterplan.

Would the Greeks have been worse off, with their banks being closed and having no money at all? They would still have industrial production and holidays to sell. Their allegance could easily have gone elswhere (Russia/China).

As I don't agree with removing money from the equation, I should vote BREXIT.

[Oscar]

Remove money from the equation and the problem never would have existed. After all, why else do they migrate. Interesting way to get money to european communities that, for some reason, must be starved of it?

Greece did tell the troika to fuck off. They were threatened with having their banks shut down. There's an interesting interview of Varoufakis with Noam Chomsky, although Chomsky barely says a thing, but Varoufakis explains what he was up against in no uncertain terms.

You did ask. But yes, remove money from the equation and all sorts of things simply aren't problems anymore.

I'm no fan of the EU, but that's a unique view which ignores the fact that the Greeks lied through their teeth to get into the EU.
As for telling anyone to fuck off, first of all they borrowed ridiculous amounts of Euro to prop up their corrupt system (yes, even more corrupt than the rest of the EU), and now they're bleating about repying the money.

[oldrider]

If you care so much - why did you ever leave England? (simply a question no judgement)

[Grumph]

Put it this way...If you leave the EU and Trump gets in as prez in the US, you'll be left shivering in the cold between two hostile neighbours.

Not my call thank god, maybe the Queen could develop a liking for Chinese food ?

[nerrrd]

Plus, in my opinion, the EU is run by idiot no brain politicians.

I think you'll find all countries are run by these, I'm guessing the UK is too. I also think the main reason most of us think politicians are so useless is because running things is actually really, really difficult, and despite what they say to the media, they only have a very tenuous grip on things like the economy at the best of times - after all, if there was one politician who was actually, demonstrably 100% right all the time about what to do, we'd all be voting for him/her, yet most democratic governments barely get over 50%.

Frankly, if I was voting in Greece, I'd have told the Germans to sing for their 60 billion euros, but they didn't get a chance and even the guy whom was elected to say 'screw you' to the Germans, changed sides.

As I don't agree with removing money from the equation, I should vote BREXIT.

Slight contradiction?

Wasn't the idea of the EU to avoid any future European conflicts (WW3, for instance) by making sure economic benefits were shared around? If so that noble aim will by now have been inevitably corrupted, because it's being run by people.

The bigger the organisation, the worse it gets once ideologies, prejudices, greed and self interest take their toll. So if you want the UK to be run exclusively by it own idiot no brain politicians, vote BREXIT; it'll be better for some, worse for others, just like always.

[YellowDog]

I'm no fan of the EU, but that's a unique view which ignores the fact that the Greeks lied through their teeth to get into the EU.
As for telling anyone to fuck off, first of all they borrowed ridiculous amounts of Euro to prop up their corrupt system (yes, even more corrupt than the rest of the EU), and now they're bleating about repying the money.

Thanks Oscar for another one in support of BREXIT.

The politically ideal system, lacking in any understanding as to how the world works, is exactly why a country like Greece was able to exploit it. How else will these fools learn such elementary lessons? It's not the Greek's fault that Europe is such an easy push over. Gullibility and naivety are not legitimate reasons to complain over getting screwed over.

[YellowDog]

If you care so much - why did you ever leave England? (simply a question no judgement)

Easy answer. What was starting to happen and is now happening, full on, was really obvious and I wanted no part of it.

My fear now is that NZ is dumbing itself down for some of the same.

[YellowDog]

I think you'll find all countries are run by these, I'm guessing the UK is too. I also think the main reason most of us think politicians are so useless is because running things is actually really, really difficult, and despite what they say to the media, they only have a very tenuous grip on things like the economy at the best of times - after all, if there was one politician who was actually, demonstrably 100% right all the time about what to do, we'd all be voting for him/her, yet most democratic governments barely get over 50%.


Slight contradiction?

Wasn't the idea of the EU to avoid any future European conflicts (WW3, for instance) by making sure economic benefits were shared around? If so that noble aim will by now have been inevitably corrupted, because it's being run by people.

The bigger the organisation, the worse it gets once ideologies, prejudices, greed and self interest take their toll. So if you want the UK to be run exclusively by it own idiot no brain politicians, vote BREXIT; it'll be better for some, worse for others, just like always.

Agree about "The bigger the organisation...." - that's why I was not ever in favour of the EU, other than it being a free trade zone. I would agree that some of these decisions are really tough. But somehow considering that any one decision, aftecting such a diverse land mass, can be better than local decisions is nonsence.

"So if you want the UK to be run exclusively by it own idiot no brain politicians, vote BREXIT; it'll be better for some, worse for others, just like always" - AGREE, thanks for your input.

So does anyone think WW3 is currently further away than it was before the EU and Schengen zone?

[YellowDog]

If England did leave they could bring back hedgehog flavoured crisps and go back to using feet, inches and pounds.

Borris Johnson & Donald Trump might be blood relatives:

[Voltaire]

I was in the UK in 2002/04 just before Poland joined the EU. I worked in Cork Ireland for 2 years in refrigeration and Air Con, did a tour around Europe in 2004 and then went back to London to look at working there for a while. Hammersmith was like Warsaw, Polish job agencies everywhere, no doubt ripping them off like the used to to the Paddies and to a lesser extent Kiwis and Aussies.
I got a job with a US Chiller company but after a few weeks did the numbers and flew back to NZ. Just too expensive to live there with kids and 1 and a bit incomes.

In Ireland your could combine your Wife's tax and your own and it was grand soo.... paid very little tax for a year. You also got 250 Euros a month for having two kids and it was not means tested...saved up 15 K Euros in 18 months.
The Poles and Romanians really likes this as the Irish Social Welfare was a soft touch.
Gypsies and ( Irish) 'Travellers'....

[Blackbird]

I understand the nervousness about exiting the EU because of all the uncertainties that go with it. However, it could be a golden opportunity for the UK to make a mark on the world again in its own right. When Britain joined the EU, both NZ and Australia were effectively told to go f--k themselves in terms of trade with UK.

However, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger and both countries were forced to develop trade and cultural ties with what might be called non-traditional trading partners and both have done pretty well out of it. I guess that a side effect is the loosening of the traditional bonds with the UK but that's no big deal as it would eventually happen anyway.

Business largely doesn't care about borders if there's a dollar to be made so an exit might be a whole lot less scary than first imagined and if managed properly, sovereignty stays strong and you control your own destiny again. Stay in and you leave your destiny to people outside the country who really don't care a whole lot about everyday life in the UK.

I left the UK in 1975 when Harold Wilson was screwing the place over and have never once regretted the move. I've only returned a handful of times to catch up with family and noticed how generally unhappy people were compared with NZ. Maybe BREXIT would help in that respect too

[mashman]

Thanks for this. You have really just confirmed what I thought. The ridiculous actions of the EU have been serving to remove all money from the equation. They are not quite there yet, however the work in progress continues. Human instink, which has no compatibility with political idealism, will foil this masterplan.

Would the Greeks have been worse off, with their banks being closed and having no money at all? They would still have industrial production and holidays to sell. Their allegance could easily have gone elswhere (Russia/China).

As I don't agree with removing money from the equation, I should vote BREXIT.

Nah, the EU wants as many excuses as possible to get money into circulation. Otherwise it isn't an influence in people's life any more and you can't threaten people with the likes of closing banks in order to get your pound of flesh.

They never got to find out for some reason. Closing down the banks in Greece would likely have led to a global banking crisis the likes of which we can't imagine. Interesting to consider how people will buy food with money they can't get from closed banks, or pay for electricity when they can't get money from their bank etc... Worse off perhaps?

Then vote for what you like, coz it will change nothing. Money rules. End of.