Four dead and two hurt today

[KezzaCFC]

With the top age group probably accounting for well over half the riders on the road, and far more actual miles?

Not a jot.

this statement which I first referred the table to still rings true.

"the anecdotal evidence suggested it was middle-aged men who did not have the experience to handle large motorbikes who were involved in most accidents"

[jellywrestler]

I got my knees in the breeze bro, I don't want to unite with those adventure bike homo's.

it's people like you who wear shorts on a bike that give us a bad name....

[jellywrestler]

how do they know all this data, from memory when the census asked about motor vehicles, they said to exclude motorcycles?

[Berries]

I knew it all along. According to the New Zealand Motorcycling Safety Consultants it is all the governments fault - https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/southland/motorcycle-club-head-objects-police-ministers-call. Nothing to do with rider responsibility at all, what was I thinking.

At least the AA are going to save us.

[nerrrd]

Clive Matthew Wilson was briefly on RNZ this morning saying that voluntary training courses only cater for those who are already safety conscious, he was suggesting fitness / reflexes / hand-eye coordination tests instead for older riders along the lines of the compulsory medical requirements for elderly drivers.

I think I would probably fail on all counts .

[KezzaCFC]

I knew it all along. According to the New Zealand Motorcycling Safety Consultants it is all the governments fault - https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/southland/motorcycle-club-head-objects-police-ministers-call. Nothing to do with rider responsibility at all, what was I thinking.

At least the AA are going to save us.

"Every other Western country makes anti-locks on motorcycles compulsory - they've done it for years - and yet governments have, for years, ignored that and a few other things to do with motorcycle safety, and motorcyclists have kept on dying.''

What? is ABS compulsory in Aussie? then how did I get around on a VTR250? Or is it on new imported?

Anyway, what a load of rubbish

[pritch]

Clive Matthew Wilson was briefly on RNZ this morning saying that voluntary training courses only cater for those who are already safety conscious, he was suggesting fitness / reflexes / hand-eye coordination tests instead for older riders along the lines of the compulsory medical requirements for elderly drivers.

I think I would probably fail on all counts .

Since I was already of the opinion that Mr Wilson was an idiot that comment changes nothing. Motorcyclists do the same elderly tests as car drivers. I know this, because last week my mail included an invite to participate.

"Every other Western country makes anti-locks on motorcycles compulsory - they've done it for years - and yet governments have, for years, ignored that and a few other things to do with motorcycle safety, and motorcyclists have kept on dying.''

Anyway, what a load of rubbish

European Community regulations were going to make ABS compulsory on all new models homologated after January 1 2016. Other countries are in the process of introducing their own regulations. "They've done it for years" is stretching it.

Bluewing used to import bikes without ABS to 'maintain their margins' IIRC. Hopefully it won't be worth the manufacturers shagging about for a tiny market like ours, and almost everything will come with ABS sooner rather than later.

Typically the regulations have exclusions, such as dirt bikes, what our bureaucrats will come up with is anybody's guess.

[nerrrd]

Since I was already of the opinion that Mr Wilson was an idiot that comment changes nothing. Motorcyclists do the same elderly tests as car drivers. I know this, because last week my mail included an invite to participate.

I assumed he was wanting to test all the "mid-life crisis" riders as well? So these tests would kick in a lot earlier for anyone wanting to keep their full licence (maybe 50 onwards?)

[Banditbandit]

Group rides are a recipe for disaster and should be avoided at all costs.

Oh crap .. there were other group rides on that weekend - and nothing happened there ... we do not know if these riders were part of a group ride at the time - or whether they were coming from or going to a group ride ..

I was lead rider in a group a week ago - 62 bikes - had NO incidents at all - count them - NO INCIDENTS ..

There are group rides every weekend - and nothing happens at most of those ..

[pritch]

I assumed he was wanting to test all the "mid-life crisis" riders as well? So these tests would kick in a lot earlier for anyone wanting to keep their full licence (maybe 50 onwards?)

Given that our allotted span is three score years and ten, mid life is 35.

Mr Wilson can shove any extra tests.

I became aware of a "returning rider" having just bought a new bike, bigger than anything he'd had back in the day, but not particularly powerful, a metric cruiser. I offered his wife, who I worked with, use of any of the small library of "how to ride" manuals I have here but she declined."He'll figure it out".

A couple of weeks later I asked how the biking was going and received the reply that the bike was away for repairs having crashed.
"What happened?"
"A dog ran out."

The books may or may not have helped, but Mt Wilson's tests would have been irrelevant unless there are tests for overconfidence and lack of knowledge.

[SaferRides]

Clive Matthew Wilson was briefly on RNZ this morning saying that voluntary training courses only cater for those who are already safety conscious, he was suggesting fitness / reflexes / hand-eye coordination tests instead for older riders along the lines of the compulsory medical requirements for elderly drivers.

I think I would probably fail on all counts .

Just as well the ACC don't use him as a consultant. Why the media keep interviewing this guy is beyond me.

[Ulsterkiwi]

I knew it all along. According to the New Zealand Motorcycling Safety Consultants it is all the governments fault - https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/southland/motorcycle-club-head-objects-police-ministers-call. Nothing to do with rider responsibility at all, what was I thinking.

At least the AA are going to save us.

Yeah, makes you wonder where they get people from to comment for pieces like this.

I think the AA thing is an example of not understanding the world they are reporting on, or trying to report to others who are not familiar with the area of interest. What has happened is the AA has become one of the providers of the R4E programme. There is nothing new in what is being offered, but ACC are trying to step up availability, especially to regions not as well catered for to date. Ironically because the AA do not have a motorcycle training side to their business per se, they are subcontracting delivery to motorcycle instructors. I guess AA is a brand most New Zealanders are familiar with. Few outside of motorcycling will have heard of R4E, this way a connection is made using familiar names or things?

[Ulsterkiwi]

Just as well the ACC don't use him as a consultant. Why the media keep interviewing this guy is beyond me.

the sideburns?

[Ocean1]

this statement which I first referred the table to still rings true.

"the anecdotal evidence suggested it was middle-aged men who did not have the experience to handle large motorbikes who were involved in most accidents"

It rings like a festering pile of propaganda, the table doesn't even refer to bike size. It's so obviously spun to present a presupposed argument against "born again" bikers it deserves zero credibility

And as it's exactly this sort of political spin that creates most "anecdotal evidence" that source is also about as credible as your aunt's knitting circle.

[FJRider]

Preaching to the converted here because we’re all alive and posting on the the forum.

Group rides are dangerous. Occasional riders are dangerous . The start of the riding season is dangerous.

It’s not rocket surgery.

The fact is ... that members of Kiwibiker are not immune from a motorcycle accident ... and being in one is likely on any ride I'm pretty sure most will know of one member (not necessarily personally) killed in a motorcycle accident. For some ... why they ride is to push the boundary's of danger and exhilaration to their own limits ... and further. Those that ride this way and live to talk of it ... tend to put it all down to THEIR skill / ability ... and not luck. In too many cases it is simply luck they owe their survival to.

We ALL need to start looking at the way WE (ourselves) ride ... and not point the finger at any one (or more) groups / types of riders. Even at the posted speed limit and us riding to the conditions ... some OTHER other road users may not be. Being "In the right" with "Right of way" will not always save you from grief. We ALL need to be more aware of OTHER road users ... even if the risk is low and you feel safe in how you are riding.

Most road accidents are caused by multiple factors ... not usually by just by one. Count the factors that might go against you as you ride ... and ask yourself just how many more is needed to be killed in an accident. The simple scary answer is usually ... just ONE more is needed. So perhaps ... wherever and whenever (and however) we ride ... we just look harder for the factor that might just kill us. The life you save might just be your own.