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Thread: The journey that COVID-19 will take us on

  1. #526
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    Quote Originally Posted by husaberg View Post
    Yeah for a guy that refers to themselves as being a medical professional this is some pretty petty and easy to dismiss shit.
    Trying to corollate the death rate with strategies to minimise amounts of cases or the total deaths.
    Rather than the deaths per case or the number of cases or total deaths is rather funny.

    Most smart people would realise the idea of lockdowns was to slow to stop the transmission of the disease not really to make it less deadly per case, although a lot died in places where the health system was clearly overrun.


    That's almost like trump trying to say they had more cases as they just tested more.
    Maybe you would be best t stick to just pasting National party press releases like the old days
    Sure. You do you. Whatever.

  2. #527
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    Quote Originally Posted by RDJ View Post
    Sure. You do you. Whatever.
    It seems the new adage is true, RDJ can't argue the facts when they are clearly no facts in RDJ's favour.
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    I reminder distinctly .




    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  3. #528
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    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politi...box=1606267170

    A factor of particular importance appears to be social cohesion. The countries doing well all have it. The US is the most extreme example of a country that doesn't. Too many people who know their rights, or who know it's a hoax, who know it's a Bill Gates plot, and who are going to travel to their family Thanksgiving dinner in spite of a pandemic.

    Hospitals in some parts of the US can no longer take patients. The hospitals they usually pass patients to can't take them, they too are full. And it's about to get a whole lot worse.

    NZ is doing well but the virus could be back tomorrow. Guess we should make the most of what we have while we have it.
    There is a grey blur, and a green blur. I try to stay on the grey one. - Joey Dunlop

  4. #529
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    Quote Originally Posted by husaberg View Post
    It seems the new adage is true, RDJ can't argue the facts when they are clearly no facts in RDJ's favour.
    Sure. You do you. History will enlighten our descendants as to who had a more accurate perspective. Enjoy your faux-reality.

  5. #530
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    Quote Originally Posted by RDJ View Post
    Sure. You do you. History will enlighten our descendants as to who had a more accurate perspective. Enjoy your faux-reality.

    Seven states—Arkansas, Iowa, Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota, Utah, and Wyoming—did not issue orders directing residents to stay at home from nonessential activities in March and April 2020 in response to the coronavirus pandemic. The 43 other states all issued orders at the state level directing residents to stay at home except for essential activities and closing businesses that each state deemed nonessential.[1] Read more about those stay-at-home orders here.

    Only one of the seven states that did not issue a stay-at-home order did not require any businesses to close: South Dakota. All seven states also closed schools to in-person instruction.
    States that did not issue a stay-at-home order in response to the coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic
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    States total deaths % based on case of known infection is 0.98%
    NZ total deaths % based on case of known infection is 1.23%
    Only issue with using this particular statistic is it misses the point.
    as the lock down was never to increase a survival rate based on deaths per case it was to allow a greater number of people not to actually die.
    US states with no total lockdown had 608 deaths per million people from Covid19
    Whilst NZ had 5.16 deaths per million head of population from Covid 19.
    Now 600 less deaths per million of the population is the real effect of lockdowns

    Using a death rate per infection is just plain idiotic. like I said you lose on facts. Its best you stick to parroting National party press releases.

    especially given also.
    Due to the lock down we had a 99.8 percent reduction in flu cases.
    there were usually 1600 more deaths in winter, compared to other seasons, and around a third of those were caused by influenza, mostly in older people with long-term health conditions.
    "What the Covid-19 response has done has largely eliminated those excess winter deaths and mortality as a whole is down around 5 percent," he said. "So that means an extra 1500 people will survive this year who wouldn't have."
    But hey..........
    Last edited by husaberg; 25th November 2020 at 22:12. Reason: added flu
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
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  6. #531
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    Quote Originally Posted by husaberg View Post
    It seems the new adage is true, RDJ can't argue the facts when they are clearly no facts in RDJ's favour.
    I'm mildly curious, why you're such an idiot. But, I am not particularly invested in finding out why you are such an idiot. You should just be you. Because the facts of the future will prove you completely idiotic, but you will interpret them as confirming your Weltanschau. Which should help your mental health, and the rest of us will see that you should do you, to help you. OK then.

  7. #532
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    Quote Originally Posted by RDJ View Post
    I'm mildly curious, why you're such an idiot. But, I am not particularly invested in finding out why you are such an idiot. You should just be you. Because the facts of the future will prove you completely idiotic, but you will interpret them as confirming your Weltanschau. Which should help your mental health, and the rest of us will see that you should do you, to help you. OK then.
    Maybe instead of multiple different replies to the same post with ad hominem attacks you should stick to the facts.
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    As it's irrefutable, the facts show 600 more people per million die without lockdowns. It's all above in black and white. no fudging, it's not an opinion, not an attempt to misrepresent the facts, no made-up crap. Just simple data.

    In a country the size of NZ that's 2880 extra dead people, but hey, keep up the attacks. You might convince yourself you know better. you will not convince me with your parroting of National party propaganda and your ad hominem attacks that you know much of anything.


    Maybe in your "medical professional" prospective is 608 extra deaths per million is not in fact 120 times worse than 5.6 per deaths million. But here in reality it clearly is by simple maths 120 times worse.
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
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    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  8. #533
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    As Americans prepare to gather for Thanksgiving, the world watches with dread and disbelief

    That's a headline in The Washington Post today. They are not wrong.
    There is a grey blur, and a green blur. I try to stay on the grey one. - Joey Dunlop

  9. #534
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    Catholic and Jewish communities in New York appealed to the Supreme Court against the Governor's ruling banning large gatherings. Trump's new court found in their favour 5-4. The stupid twats are now free to spread the virus at Mass and at the synagogue. It was the "pro life" justices voted for spreading the virus.
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  10. #535
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    Obviously there's going to be a problem with members of a marching band blowing their instruments while wearing masks.

    The caption to this pic was, "We're doomed."
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  11. #536
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    Quote Originally Posted by caspernz View Post
    It's all about perspective, here's a line from an article I read recently:

    Globally, the World Health Organization (WHO) estimates that the flu kills 290,000 to 650,000 people per year.

    The covid-19 pandemic has so far taken about 110,000 and while I wouldn't want to compare it with the flu, many elements are similar.

    The global figures reported at present make it rather plain that China is dodgy
    Yup, flu figures have been touted a lot but I have not seen a statement of how many people contract the flu every year.

    It would be very difficult to find an accurate figure as the majority of sufferers just go to bed for a few days, no Dr's visits.

    Absolutely no bias in my post, the quote just got me thinking.
    Manopausal.

  12. #537
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    Quote Originally Posted by george formby View Post
    Yup, flu figures have been touted a lot but I have not seen a statement of how many people contract the flu every year.

    It would be very difficult to find an accurate figure as the majority of sufferers just go to bed for a few days, no Dr's visits.

    Absolutely no bias in my post, the quote just got me thinking.
    Sorry it generates a lot of data i gave the effect on the lockdowns on seasonal flu in NZ here.

    Due to the lock down we had a 99.8 percent reduction in flu cases.
    there were usually 1600 more deaths in winter, compared to other seasons, and around a third of those were caused by influenza, mostly in older people with long-term health conditions.
    "What the Covid-19 response has done has largely eliminated those excess winter deaths and mortality as a whole is down around 5 percent," he said.
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/progr...ue-to-lockdown

    https://www.vox.com/science-and-heal...mparison-chart
    https://www.bbc.com/news/health-54463511


    CDC estimates that the burden of illness during the 2019–2020 season was moderate with an estimated 38 million people sick with flu, 18 million visits to a health care provider for flu, 400,000 hospitalizations for flu, and 22,000 flu deaths
    https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html
    on average seasonal flu kills 30,000 to 60,000 Americans every year.
    but in the US Covid 19 is 50 times more deadly than Flu
    During the 2018-19 flu season, about 35 million people in the US contracted the flu and about 34,000 died, according to the CDC. In that season, about one out of every 1,000 people who got the flu died.
    Breaking down the numbers by age range reveals a more complex story. Among children, there was about one death per every 10,000 cases. For adults between 50 and 64 years old, about six out of every 10,000 people who got the flu died. For those 65 and older, the rate rose to about 83 out of 10,000 people. Over 30% of US coronavirus patients over 85 have died
    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/c...20-6?r=US&IR=T
    We also have a vaccine for flu

    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
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  13. #538
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    No need for me to go looking later. Cheers.
    Manopausal.

  14. #539
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    Meanwhile, more people died of suicide in one month in Japan, than the entire WuFlu death toll. "The National Police Agency said suicides surged to 2,153 in October alone... more than 17,000 people taking their own lives this year to date." By comparison, fewer than 2,000 people in the country have died from COVID-19 in 2020.

    ***

    Every choice has costs, but when the authorities withhold the figures that measure the damage from their preferred choice v other choices so we cannot participate in informed consent... well, here we are now.

    ***

    It is absolutely no secret at all that the usual annual death toll from the seasonal flu in NZ is ~ 500. We do not crash the economy and imprison people to prevent that. Because until 2020, we knew the cure would be worse than the disease.

  15. #540
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    Quote Originally Posted by RDJ View Post
    It is absolutely no secret at all that the usual annual death toll from the seasonal flu in NZ is ~ 500. We do not crash the economy and imprison people to prevent that. Because until 2020, we knew the cure would be worse than the disease.
    Where do you get that figure? Using "annual death toll influenza new zealand" in Google gets me "In the winter months of 2009, a total of 49 New Zealand patients1 died with pandemic influenza A(H1N1) 2009 virus infection. While the Ministry of Health identified 35 deaths from pandemic influenza A(H1N1) during the first wave, the processes arranged by the PIMMRG were able to collect information on an additional 14 deaths due to pandemic influenza A(H1N1)." https://www.hqsc.govt.nz/assets/PMMR...nza-report.pdf

    Pretty sure that if this number jumped from 49 to over 500 as a usual annual figure there would be some more noise made about it.
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