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Thread: Roads don't cause crashes- bad driving behaviour does

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by toycollector10 View Post
    Please keep left. You're a danger to yourself and other road users. For example, thirty years ago I started an overtaking manoeuvre thinking I had clear road ahead and unlimited visibility. I was well committed and a car appeared "out of nowhere" from the shadow of some trees and it was nearly a multiple fatality. Keep left and don't cut corners. It's easy.
    So you failed to ensure the road was clear then?


    Quote Originally Posted by nerrrd View Post
    Bear in mind it’s not just you you’re putting at risk, but the poor bugger coming in the opposite direction.
    What poor bugger? I try not to overcook a left hand curve and so far have managed not to. Have found it extends your life.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gremlin View Post
    Those sorts of casual attitudes towards the oncoming lane are part of the problem. No, there is extra risk, both legal and real to life, and not just your own.
    Nah, I don't understand the risk to other people if it is clear there is nothing coming. And I mean clear, not vehicles hiding in the shadows.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gremlin View Post
    Start with following the road rules, because if you're unable to stay in your lane because you "overcook" it, then it's a problem and it's a matter of time before you go from getting away with it, to causing injury/death.
    I said if. The way the roads are going there are going to be median barriers in a lot more places and people who get it wrong will get injured every time if they hit them whereas without them nine times out of ten there will be no oncoming traffic. I am thinking more of the inexperienced guy you sold your bike to than those of us with the experience not to cross the centre line when you cannot see around the corner. And people on Suzuki Boulevards.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berries View Post

    Nah, I don't understand the risk to other people if it is clear there is nothing coming. And I mean clear, not vehicles hiding in the shadows.
    How are you going to see it if its hiding?

    What about the car coming out of the drive that thinks its clear?
    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    but once again you proved me wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    I was hit by one such driver while remaining in the view of their mirror.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzspokes View Post
    How are you going to see it if its hiding?

    What about the car coming out of the drive that thinks its clear?
    You sound like a reformed smoker.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzspokes View Post
    How are you going to see it if its hiding?

    What about the car coming out of the drive that thinks its clear?
    That can happen if you are on either side of the road. Even in a 50kph zone.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berries View Post



    I said if. The way the roads are going there are going to be median barriers in a lot more places and people who get it wrong will get injured every time if they hit them whereas without them nine times out of ten there will be no oncoming traffic. I am thinking more of the inexperienced guy you sold your bike to than those of us with the experience not to cross the centre line when you cannot see around the corner. And people on Suzuki Boulevards.
    You don't tend to "get it wrong" when you know doing so will maim or kill you. Probably the same reason why people don't cut left hand corners.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzspokes View Post
    How are you going to see it if its hiding?

    What about the car coming out of the drive that thinks its clear?
    If there is somewhere to hide it is not clear.
    If there is a driveway it is not clear.
    It's not hard.


    Quote Originally Posted by SaferRides View Post
    You don't tend to "get it wrong" when you know doing so will maim or kill you.
    Unfortunately I have been to a few fatal crashes where the rider did get it wrong, crossed the centre line and wiped themselves out against an oncoming vehicle. How many people cross the centre line on the same corner I have no idea, but I can't imagine they were the first, on two wheels or four. Which brings it back to the title of the thread. I am firmly in the group that blames the driver/rider in 95 percent of crashes. But then how do you get certain corners that have a crash history and others that don't? There must be something wrong with the road environment to make so many people mess up in the same place.

  7. #22
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    I like the main roads that have "High Crash Area" signs. On my unsuccessful way to Wellywood last weekend I notice a hell of a extra steel cable centre barriers. Didn't feel intimidated whatever compared to some snowflakes. Around a decade or so ago there was a big hugh and cry about them because a rider behaving stupidly got killed by hitting some. Traffic seems to be a lot more sedate around these areas now as well. In fact I found the behavior of 99% of traffic on that trip was fantastic.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berries View Post
    If there is somewhere to hide it is not clear.
    If there is a driveway it is not clear.
    It's not hard.

    There must be something wrong with the road environment to make so many people mess up in the same place.
    There is a 90o corner at the end of my residential street, clear visibility, two lanes. The vast majority of vehicles taking it as right hander cross the centre line, often completely on the wrong side of the road. The only reason can be thoughtless driving, it's not tight, narrow or surprising. Could be subliminal, there is a big house on the corner and the outside camber is quite pronounced, could just be laziness.

    It was pointed out to me on a training course that corners which have a high accident rate, vehicles crossing the centre line, usually have clues as you approach. Damage to the road side furniture, rubber on the road, broken cats eyes and a worn centre line amongst others. Nice little bit of road craft to file away.

    The road toll is lower than I would expect given the average lackadaisical attitude of many road users.
    Manopausal.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonez View Post
    I like the main roads that have "High Crash Area" signs. On my unsuccessful way to Wellywood last weekend I notice a hell of a extra steel cable centre barriers. Didn't feel intimidated whatever compared to some snowflakes. Around a decade or so ago there was a big hugh and cry about them because a rider behaving stupidly got killed by hitting some. Traffic seems to be a lot more sedate around these areas now as well. In fact I found the behavior of 99% of traffic on that trip was fantastic.
    Try losing traction on SH1 (in a straight line at the speed limit) and starting an uncontrollable drift towards the WRB in the centre (installed against advice of minimum distance to live lane)...
    Quote Originally Posted by Jane Omorogbe from UK MSN on the KTM990SM
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gremlin View Post
    Try losing traction on SH1 (in a straight line at the speed limit) and starting an uncontrollable drift towards the WRB in the centre (installed against advice of minimum distance to live lane)...
    Not a place I would like to be in.
    Having done something similar way under posted limit.
    It happens.

    Remember back in the old days there used to be multiple crashes involving opposing traffic esp in AKL. Road barriers have reduced a lot of carnage.

    On my way south last week past Pokeno. A reasonable section of WRB demolished. Almost straight section of road. Lucky whatever it was didnt make it to the second barrier on the other side of the centre.

    READ AND UDESTAND

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berries View Post
    There must be something wrong with the road environment to make so many people mess up in the same place.
    Undoubtedly the environment/location/time of day, season/weather, other distractions etc play a part.

    On the high risk locations need to find the common factor(s)

    READ AND UDESTAND

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berries View Post
    ... There must be something wrong with the road environment to make so many people mess up in the same place.
    Like at the end of passing lanes you mean ...

    or the last corner before a long straight ...

    or even any intersection controlled by a give way or stop sign.


    All familiar with the road ...

    All fully licensed drivers ...

    And all swearing the other vehicle "Came out of nowhere" ...
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by eldog View Post
    Undoubtedly the environment/location/time of day, season/weather, other distractions etc play a part.

    On the high risk locations need to find the common factor(s)
    They DO. A common lowered speed limit for that location.

    With VERY large speed limit signs ... and large waning signs that warn of a road "Black spot ahead" ... usually ignored by most "Good" drivers ...
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by nzspokes View Post
    What about the car coming out of the drive that thinks its clear?
    I've seen more than a few accidents ... where a vehicle coming out of a driveway on an open road ... turning left and checking to the right. But getting clobbered by a overtaking vehicle coming FROM their left.

    Main highways ... and some back roads. Locals in their (quiet) local areas.
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by FJRider View Post
    I've seen more than a few accidents ... where a vehicle coming out of a driveway on an open road ... turning left and checking to the right. But getting clobbered by a overtaking vehicle coming FROM their left.

    Main highways ... and some back roads. Locals in their (quiet) local areas.
    I was almost taken out by a young lady drive the weekend before last on a gravel road. She didn't look EITHER way just drove straight out of the drive way. It was damn close. I had flash backs of 1986 when I was T-boned in a 50km zone in Waipakurau.

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