Cannabis referendum.

[onearmedbandit]

when two people share a drink they start a fight, when two people sahre a joint they start a band....

I've often argued similar. If you're at an event where everyone is drinking and say trip over someone and spill your beer on them, almost without fail a confrontation will happen (not always of course). If you're an event where everyone is smoking weed and trip over someone and spill your buds they'll roll you a joint and invite you to sit with them. Fucking dope-heads.

[Viking01]

I'm not mixing anything, I'm simply stating that some people don't see more regulation from the government as a good thing. Have they fully thought out their position? Maybe not. But my response was to the assumption of FJRider that 100% of people who use it support the law changes. If you want my opinion, I don't care. Whether it's legal/decriminalised/whatever doesn't change the fact I'll still smoke it, and still catch up with my friend for supply.

OAB:
Thanks for the reply. Just trying to understand other peoples perspectives.

I'm not trying to mix things up, in fact quite the opposite.

Katman:
I understand your point re recreational cannabis for your own use. Fine.

But why the push-back against government being involved if it was going to be grown commercially in large scale?

Especially given that the primary driver from government perspective is a "health related" initiative (i.e. harm minimisation). In the link you posted earlier on the referendum, right upfront is the statement:

"The Bill's main purpose is to reduce cannabis-related harm to individuals, families/whānau and communities."

The reason for asking is that we have a regulated liquor industry operating here in NZ, where controls are placed on sourcing, quality and distribution of the product, and tax is paid along the way.

Would you propose a different model applying to cannabis being grown in large scale quantites ? Completely government hands-off and unregulated ? If so, I'd be interested to hear why.

Cheers

[Katman]

But why the push-back against government being involved if it was going to be grown commercially in large scale?

Well it's not really a push-back - I'm actually grateful that the government has brought the referendum into being.

I just don't feel that governments deserve to make money out of nature's gifts.

[Viking01]

Well it's not really a push-back - I'm actually grateful that the government has brought the referendum into being.

I just don't feel that governments deserve to make money out of nature's gifts.

If the taxation collected is being used to fund cannabis related health initiatives and education, does that modify your view ?

[Katman]

If the taxation collected is being used to fund cannabis related health initiatives and education, does that modify your view ?

You're probably taking my comments about that particular aspect just a little too literally.

The commercial growing and selling side of it won't actually affect me in the slightest.

So yes, if the revenue raised from it is used for 'good causes' then I'm ok with it.

[BMWST?]

The coming cannabis referendum is in regard to proposed changes to New Zealand drug legislation. Any such changes in NZ law should not affect any US drug issues or laws.

Are you sure you were posting in the correct thread ??

yes i am sure.my ananology is obviously to obscure

[Bonez]

yes i am sure.my ananology is obviously to obscure

Still the wrong thread...Btw it's "too obscure" Obtuse may have been a better description.

[Swoop]

If legalised, will NZ become a tourist destination for smokers wanting a legal high?
We appreciate the legislation wants to be passed by politicians, simply due to the increased tax revenue that can be generated from it, but add in additional tourists and it would become an even bigger earner for the country.

On the other hand, the driving skills of tourists coming here is a regular media headline. Do we want more impaired drivers on the roads?



With retired friends (wife dying of cancer) who are smuggling medicinal canabis into the country to ease her pain, they have said that they never saw themselves being put into the position of being criminals, because that is what they now are.
They have said their exposure to the medicinal benefit has changed their minds on legalising and now fully support it.


Also, the end of life legislation is another law needing to be supported. For various reasons.

[scumdog]

And many of those alcoholic drinks are being manufactured (and marketed) in such a manner that they can't really be seen as anything much other than an attempt to entice younger drinkers.

Dead right there! Just look when the alcopops were introduced....

I'd be keener to see cannabis legalised if alcohol were to disappear.

As it is nobody is really sure how legalised cannabis will affect the country although Colorado has discovered some interesting unanticipated issues since legalising it.

[jellywrestler]

If legalised, will NZ become a tourist destination for smokers wanting a legal high?
.

sounds interesting, arrive at a hotel for your two weeks quarantine, a large bag of wobbly weed on your pillow, and twenty bags of chippies for the munchies, Jacinda will pick up the tab

[TheDemonLord]

And yet, after 40 years exposure to cannabis use, I don't personally know anyone that fits that bill.

That's not to say those people don't exist - I just don't know any.

Maybe it was a function of the group of people that I used to move with.

And not everyone measures success by the size of their bank account.

Sure - some people are quite happy on a subsistence existence. My Umbrage with the individuals is 2-fold:

1: They are (at last count) living on the Benefit, so I'm paying for them to live
2: They had such potential to do something great, whether that be Music, Art or other creative outputs (The work that I do, as an example, has a creative element to it) and seeing them as a person not only fail to realize that potential but to let their talent and gifts (that other people would kill to have) stagnate and rot.

If you've not experienced it - then I'm genuinely happy for you - seeing people spiral down really sucks.

But I feel to add Balance and to cover off OAB's point - There are a myriad of Vices that can lead people in a downward spiral that we allow as a society (Alcohol, Food, Gambling etc.) and I don't think we should tar the majority with the actions of a Minority.

The only point I'm really making here is that I personally witnessed several people fall into that trap and it was very hard for me to watch.

[jasonu]

The weed I get is grown by a trusted friend who has spent thousands of dollars and hours of research developing. I can sit in the comfort of his home and discuss life while enjoying a sample of his hard work. I've never had to meet anyone down a dark alley to get weed. Painting it like you have done just reaffirms peoples belief that the whole industry is full of shady crims. It's not. Wise up.

and those people, especially younger ones that don't have a friend like yours or the means to grow their own are mostly forced to deal with shady dealers ie criminals.

[onearmedbandit]

and those people, especially younger ones that don't have a friend like yours or the means to grow their own are mostly forced to deal with shady dealers ie criminals.

Man when I was buying it from wherever I could 20+ years ago my friends and I never dealt with shady dealers. Interesting people most definitely, but not dangerous or nasty. It's weed, not smack. Of course there are the bad element out there, but with the social media chat groups for example that are widely used there's less and less need for dodgy dealings now than ever before. Anyway I was just countering your stereotypical generalisation.

[Bonez]

Maybe it was a function of the group of people that I used to move with.



Sure - some people are quite happy on a subsistence existence. My Umbrage with the individuals is 2-fold:

1: They are (at last count) living on the Benefit, so I'm paying for them to live
2: They had such potential to do something great, whether that be Music, Art or other creative outputs (The work that I do, as an example, has a creative element to it) and seeing them as a person not only fail to realize that potential but to let their talent and gifts (that other people would kill to have) stagnate and rot.

If you've not experienced it - then I'm genuinely happy for you - seeing people spiral down really sucks.

But I feel to add Balance and to cover off OAB's point - There are a myriad of Vices that can lead people in a downward spiral that we allow as a society (Alcohol, Food, Gambling etc.) and I don't think we should tar the majority with the actions of a Minority.

The only point I'm really making here is that I personally witnessed several people fall into that trap and it was very hard for me to watch.

Are they just doing dope or have moved on to the harder stuff like Ice.?

[jasonu]

Man when I was buying it from wherever I could 20+ years ago my friends and I never dealt with shady dealers. Interesting people most definitely, but not dangerous or nasty. It's weed, not smack. Of course there are the bad element out there, but with the social media chat groups for example that are widely used there's less and less need for dodgy dealings now than ever before. Anyway I was just countering your stereotypical generalisation.

Fair enough. I didn’t factor in the social media aspect, wasn’t around when I was a reefer addict.