the clean two-stroke thread

[Vannik]

Why has HAUFEN started this thread and never been heard from since - is he no longer with us? ........... I have asked this twice before and there has been no reply - so third time lucky?

Maybe on summer holiday - he is from that part of the globe.

[husaberg]

https://www.researchgate.net/publica...stroke_engines

[WilDun]

https://www.researchgate.net/publica...stroke_engines

A lot of interesting stuff there!

[mr bucketracer]

Will the 2 stroke engine do the same k's as a four stroke before rebuilds?

[WilDun]

Will the 2 stroke engine do the same k's as a four stroke before rebuilds?

No, it won't if it doesn't make a comeback on the roads! ........
To have any chance of ever coming back, first we have to accept the fact that it has already gone!

It will need proper (positive) lubrication, not mixing oil with petrol, smaller individual ports, instead of great gaping (racing style) holes in the cylinder wall, (think of the rings) and instead of reaching for the sky in peak horsepower we need to focus on a clean exhaust (totally necessary today - no longer any room for debate there), also maybe a need for the great fuel injection debate to be resolved, it will need to be a very different two stroke!

Also we have to think of the Bucket Racer boys, stuck with the prospect of no more road bikes to modify anymore! (the only alternative being the four stroke!)

That's what I believe anyway - we can't bury our heads in the sand any longer!

[ken seeber]

No, it won't if it doesn't make a comeback on the roads! ........
To have any chance of ever coming back, first we have to accept the fact that it has already gone!

It will need proper (positive) lubrication, not mixing oil with petrol, smaller individual ports, instead of great gaping (racing style) holes in the cylinder wall, (think of the rings) and instead of reaching for the sky in peak horsepower we need to focus on a clean exhaust (totally necessary today - no longer any room for debate there), also maybe a need for the great fuel injection debate to be resolved, it will need to be a very different two stroke!

Also we have to think of the Bucket Racer boys, stuck with the prospect of no more road bikes to modify anymore! (the only alternative being the four stroke!)

That's what I believe anyway - we can't bury our heads in the sand any longer!

I think you're right, but maybe there are other application opportunities where it might see a return.


Basically agree, with maybe longer skirt pistons. Now here is a question: Back in their day, what was the life of Trabants, DKWs, SAAABs, BSA Bantams etc? When I was a post pimple kid when we had bikes, Jawas, Bultacos, T20 Suzukis, etc I just don't remember anyone really boring out cylinder etc to replace pistons, maybe cos we were too broke to afford them.


Have made the suggestion here before, recognising this is a looming issue, that maybe they could consider the use of 125 cc TAG style kart engines. They are clutched, water cooled, durable, around 28 hp, relatively cheap and available. Would require a mounting system and a jackshaft in the drive train, but provided endless possibilities for class structures; eg standard, modified, really modified, CVT, etc etc.

[WilDun]

I think you're right, but maybe there are other application opportunities where it might see a return.


Basically agree, with maybe longer skirt pistons. Now here is a question: Back in their day, what was the life of Trabants, DKWs, SAAABs, BSA Bantams etc? When I was a post pimple kid when we had bikes, Jawas, Bultacos, T20 Suzukis, etc I just don't remember anyone really boring out cylinder etc to replace pistons, maybe cos we were too broke to afford them.

KEN,
That was way before they invented the environment and we accepted all the failings of the ones you mention (cos we didn't know any better!) and no, they never did the mileages you would have expected of a car (in those days a car engine wouldn't last nearly as long as today either!) but we just accepted that - we believed in them and only wanted to modify them (including the Bantam and the T20 in my case).

Now, all that carefree attitude has come to haunt us! and we need to admit that the present day two stroke has had its chips as far as being a common sight on the roads is concerned! and even with a completely redesigned two stroke we would still have to face an uphill battle to ever get it back!

I have often talked about this (and I need to admit that unlike you, that's mainly all I do these days ), and have wondered what else it can be used for - but same old answer, it's mainly only for use in poxy little scooters, (a lot of guys get a lot of pleasure out of modifying these too!) garden tools etc. however, more sophisticated two stroke engines are used in snowmobiles and light aircraft. - and of course, motocross/enduro! (sometimes).
Karting, above all, does most to keep it on the planet of course!

Have made the suggestion here before, recognising this is a looming issue, that maybe they could consider the use of 125 cc TAG style kart engines. They are clutched, water cooled, durable, around 28 hp, relatively cheap and available. Would require a mounting system and a jackshaft in the drive train, but provided endless possibilities for class structures; eg standard, modified, really modified, CVT, etc etc.

Not sure if you're referring to Bucket Racing here (guess you are) - but that does sound like a good idea in the meantime anyway! - not really suitable for everyday road motorcycles of course!....... keep plugging on with your latest idea and climb another step up and try to rescue this thing!

[mr bucketracer]

This guy is on it at 16.30 https://youtu.be/3eozooUOhco

[Flettner]

This guy is on it at 16.30 https://youtu.be/3eozooUOhco

Whats your point?

[mr bucketracer]

Whats your point?

the point been . Hes on it ?predicted the future? What more do i say lol. Up to you to guys change it I guess

[WilDun]

This guy is on it at 16.30 https://youtu.be/3eozooUOhco

I think that guy was actually looking back though!

All very depressing stuff of course - and I know that many believe that "Elvis aint dead" but he is! - also Greg Hansford ..... and Pat Hennen only just escaped death in the IOM TT!

I guess we will all be the same to a certain extent, but maybe just thinking and acknowledging, rather than denying the truth, accepting it how it really is and trying to do something about it will bring some happiness back - it is possible but things WILL need to change somewhat - trying to stay rooted in the past and becoming bitter is what kills old men (like me!).

Taking on change is the most difficult thing we have to do!

[mr bucketracer]

All very depressing stuff of course - and I know that many believe that "Elvis aint dead" but he is! - also Greg Hansford ..... and Pat Hennen only just escaped death in the IOM TT!

I guess we will all be the same to a certain extent, but maybe just thinking and acknowledging, rather than denying the truth, accepting it how it really is and trying to do something about it will bring some happiness back - it is possible but things WILL need to change somewhat - trying to stay rooted in the past and becoming bitter is what kills old men (like me!).

Taking on change is the most difficult thing we have to do!

yes . I love all engines 4 2 stroke or wankels. And of course anything made out the ordernealy. I'm a engineer that's it . Love it . Hate me if you like. Good video wildun ah ?

[husaberg]

the point been . Hes on it ?predicted the future? What more do i say lol. Up to you to guys change it I guess

It looks like Kel Curuthers who went on for another 20 years with two strokes after that.......he retired from 2 strokes in 1998.
when i was growing up two strokes had forced out the 4 strokes from MX it took a rule change givin 4t a 100% advantage to change it
The 2t's running cost per hour is a tiny percentage of a competition 4t for MX or MotoGP.
Funny enough his world tittle while riding was on a 250 4 cylinder 4t Benelli after all the other works teams pulled out a season early due to the change in the rules limiting the cylinders for the next season.

[mr bucketracer]

It looks like Kel Curuthers who went on for another 20 years with two strokes after that.......he retired from 2 strokes in 1998.
when i was growing up two strokes had forced out the 4 strokes from MX it took a rule change givin 4t a 100% advantage to change it
The 2t's running cost per hour is a tiny percentage of a competition 4t for MX or MotoGP.
Funny enough his world tittle while riding was on a 250 4 cylinder 4t Benelli after all the other works teams pulled out a season early due to the change in the rules limiting the cylinders for the next season.

it is like that's lots of guys would rather got 2 stroke for mx I know . For me i can can pull i top of a 4 stroke and put back on pretty dam fast . So dont bother me . Have you got a link to the 2 stroke with the guide to piston that runs like a banana. Stops a lot on piston wear. New Zealand built?

[Flettner]

it is like that's lots of guys would rather got 2 stroke for mx I know . For me i can can pull i top of a 4 stroke and put back on pretty dam fast . So dont bother me . Have you got a link to the 2 stroke with the guide to piston that runs like a banana. Stops a lot on piston wear. New Zealand built?

You got something to offer, here?