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Thread: Electronic Rider Aids

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulsterkiwi View Post
    well, it is the internet, so I guess it is kind of an expectation someone will try and score points and be a bit superior, so go you.
    No, merely pointing out that your blanket statement that ABS and TCS are a 'no brainer' is way too simplified. ALL riding should be a 'brainer' whether you have electronic intervention, or not. As you state further on, ABS cuts in on the back wheel of your bike very easily. Now try it on a gravel road... very, very easily. Without its intervention, stopping will be in a shorter distance and much safer.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laava View Post
    OK, sounds good. Have you ever noticed it cutting in? Or is it purely for those knife edge moments?
    You don't notice it with most road riding however if you really want to ride hard (like on a track) it seems to muffle the experience and that's why I turn it off. Prevents wheelies & stoppies too

    I've had the same experiences on Kwakas and Beemers too

    It's the future (unfortunately).

  3. #48
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    14th June 2007 - 22:39
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    I'm not sure if this is relevant to the thread but when I watched it rider aids sprung to mind. Not sure if they can or where fully disabled on the Ducati, either.

    Anyway, food for thought and quite entertaining.

    Manopausal.

  4. #49
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    25th March 2004 - 17:22
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    Quote Originally Posted by YellowDog View Post
    Like UlsterKiwi implies, it is an intelligent management system to balance ABS & traction controls to neutralise suicidal tendancies.

    The BMW version allows you to take a fist full of front brake whilst at full lean. Instead of throwing you to the ground, on the opposite side of the road, it balances the madness with fancy electronics to keep you upright.

    "It's motorcycling Jim, but just not as we know it!"
    I could have done with that on my race bike when some turkey pulled out on the track. I had option of braking whilst leant right over or hitting him.
    I should have hit him. But instinct couldn't avoid trying to avoid him.
    I've been told. Dreaming`s free.
    Think I'll go, back to sleep.
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  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by YellowDog View Post
    You don't notice it with most road riding however if you really want to ride hard (like on a track) it seems to muffle the experience and that's why I turn it off. Prevents wheelies & stoppies too

    I've had the same experiences on Kwakas and Beemers too

    It's the future (unfortunately).
    Not sure if my Multistrada has this or not? Like I said, I haven't read the manual very thoroughly. Like most manuals these days it is so full of warnings, warranty voiding actions and "thou shalt nots" that I gave up!
    Definitely has TC as all the lights start flashing when you give it a handfull on the gravel! Which is kinda fun, let's be honest!
    Only a Rat can win a Rat Race!

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laava View Post
    OK, sounds good. Have you ever noticed it cutting in? Or is it purely for those knife edge moments?
    I've got a 2010 R1200GSA, more primitive than ulster's wethead. No riding modes, just ABS on or off, 3 stage traction control (on, limited, off). Rear brake on seal is relatively easy to trigger the ABS, pretty tricky on the front. On gravel, either is easy if you want to... Tractionn control on mine is pretty primitive, it's wheel speed differences, so if power sliding on gravel, rear spins too quickly. Take off too quick, front lifts, rear is spinning faster. On or limited simply alters the threshold of intervention.

    On the KTM, traction control is linked to power mode in some ways (but you still have to adjust multiple settings in most cases). In off road it will allow wheel spin, but equally, its a softer throttle down low (so if you jerk it over a bump it doesn't snap), but let the revs climb and it will allow a lot sideways movement In rain, same HP as off road, but as it would suggest, it doesn't allow any wheel spin, early intervention etc. ABS in off road will keep ABS on front, turn off on rear so you can lock and build up gravel in front of the wheel, or on steep/rough descents where you want it to lock, it can, rather than letting you rattle to the bottom.

    Quote Originally Posted by Laava View Post
    Not sure if my Multistrada has this or not? Like I said, I haven't read the manual very thoroughly. Like most manuals these days it is so full of warnings, warranty voiding actions and "thou shalt nots" that I gave up!
    Definitely has TC as all the lights start flashing when you give it a handfull on the gravel! Which is kinda fun, let's be honest!
    I read the manual cover to cover for the Enduro >2016 as I was contemplating it but bought the KTM. You should probably have a degree by the time you've finished it, jaysus, 3 stage anything? noooo, we need at least 9 settings for ABS, independent of 9 stages of traction control. Seriously, what?
    Quote Originally Posted by Jane Omorogbe from UK MSN on the KTM990SM
    It's barking mad and if it doesn't turn you into a complete loon within half an hour of cocking a leg over the lofty 875mm seat height, I'll eat my Arai.

  7. #52
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    See, what we need here is an AI app to read the manual and make all of those tiresome decisions for you. Linked to your credit details it can then choose and order your 6 monthly update.


    . . . um. . I don't think I would have chosen a Keyway 125 single. Shut Up. I know what's best for you.
    I've been told. Dreaming`s free.
    Think I'll go, back to sleep.
    Everybody listen, voices in my head
    Everybody listen, do yours say, what mine says?

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gremlin View Post
    I've got a 2010 R1200GSA, more primitive than ulster's wethead. No riding modes, just ABS on or off, 3 stage traction control (on, limited, off). Rear brake on seal is relatively easy to trigger the ABS, pretty tricky on the front. On gravel, either is easy if you want to... Tractionn control on mine is pretty primitive, it's wheel speed differences, so if power sliding on gravel, rear spins too quickly. Take off too quick, front lifts, rear is spinning faster. On or limited simply alters the threshold of intervention.

    On the KTM, traction control is linked to power mode in some ways (but you still have to adjust multiple settings in most cases). In off road it will allow wheel spin, but equally, its a softer throttle down low (so if you jerk it over a bump it doesn't snap), but let the revs climb and it will allow a lot sideways movement In rain, same HP as off road, but as it would suggest, it doesn't allow any wheel spin, early intervention etc. ABS in off road will keep ABS on front, turn off on rear so you can lock and build up gravel in front of the wheel, or on steep/rough descents where you want it to lock, it can, rather than letting you rattle to the bottom.


    I read the manual cover to cover for the Enduro >2016 as I was contemplating it but bought the KTM. You should probably have a degree by the time you've finished it, jaysus, 3 stage anything? noooo, we need at least 9 settings for ABS, independent of 9 stages of traction control. Seriously, what?
    Yikes! Now, that is the bit that does not interest me, going into endless menus to adjust stuff. Then having to remember what it was cos you disconnected the battery and it reset to standard. I just hop on and ride it. The only time I adjust anything is the preload for when the wife hops on. 4 step adjust.

    Quote Originally Posted by F5 Dave View Post
    See, what we need here is an AI app to read the manual and make all of those tiresome decisions for you. Linked to your credit details it can then choose and order your 6 monthly update.


    . . . um. . I don't think I would have chosen a Keyway 125 single. Shut Up. I know what's best for you.
    Hahaha!....no wait!....are they doing that now?
    Only a Rat can win a Rat Race!

  9. #54
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    So the ultimate conclusion down this path is Autonomous motorbikes. I mean that makes no sense.

    Or does it?

    What if you lived in Auckland and had to ride for dreary hours to get to somewhere where you could turn off auto and go for your ride. Then when done flick back onto Auto and transport back while your visor inner is an immersive movie to keep you entertained.

    Just be careful of what you are watching and don't forget where you are. Just imagine Aunt Betsie saying "ooh I saw you out on your motorbike yesterday. What were you doing? Because it looked like. . "
    I've been told. Dreaming`s free.
    Think I'll go, back to sleep.
    Everybody listen, voices in my head
    Everybody listen, do yours say, what mine says?

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by eldog View Post
    adaptive cruise control would be nice when there is a lot of traffic.
    I use that in my wife's late model Jeep Cherokee.

    It always amuses me that it only does what I =should be able to do anyway i.e. adapt my following distance to the speed of the vehicle ahead.

    I mean, isn't that a thing a driver should be able to do? I console myself with the view that I could do it myself, or let the car do it.

    It makes us lazy. Or less fatigued. One of those.

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racing Dave View Post
    Without its intervention, stopping will be in a shorter distance and much safer.
    and that is not over simplification?

    fine, you win
    Life is not measured by how many breaths you take, but how many times you have your breath taken away

  12. #57
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    So you have all this electronic wizardry on the m/c and have another electronic gizmo to turn all that stuff off that makes using m/cs dangerous in some quite ordinary riding situations? Sounds logical captain......
    "Every time you set your ass on a bike, you're playing a game of Russian Roulette between yourself and your own stupidity."

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by rastuscat View Post
    I use that in my wife's late model Jeep Cherokee.

    It always amuses me that it only does what I =should be able to do anyway i.e. adapt my following distance to the speed of the vehicle ahead.

    I mean, isn't that a thing a driver should be able to do? I console myself with the view that I could do it myself, or let the car do it.

    It makes us lazy. Or less fatigued. One of those.
    Yep, one of those. I drive kamo to mangonui a lot, a distance of 130km most of which I can comfortably just set the cruise control on my ute. It becomes very obvious if the person you are following also is using CC
    Only a Rat can win a Rat Race!

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by rastuscat View Post
    It makes us lazy. Or less fatigued. One of those.
    Complacent, the motorway is moving along, we accept that we see no reason for it to stop. So many things happening we are in a false sense of security and of our ability to react.

    Its there for the split second someone brakes suddenly or cuts in front unexpectedly.

    Also can take the stress out from following a driver who constantly speeds up and down.

    It isn't perfect.

    READ AND UDESTAND

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonez View Post
    So you have all this electronic wizardry on the m/c and have another electronic gizmo to turn all that stuff off that makes using m/cs dangerous in some quite ordinary riding situations? Sounds logical captain......
    It's the riders choice that what can be turned off ... is turned off. Logical or not. That supercomputer holding the handlebars can make that call. And if things turn to shit ... it was their call and their responsibility for whatever happens after that. I just hope they're as good as they think they are.

    The gizmo's wont stop you crossing the center line ... nor stop you exceeding posted speed limits (watch this space for THAT one). They let you overtake any time you want to ... regardless of weather or traffic volumes on the road ... or it's a really bad idea. They don't slow you down to the recommended posted speeds for corners. They don't even warn you when corners are coming up that people have died on in the past. Nor do they warn you of traffic approaching you that is on your side of the road (I think they're working on it though).

    "Ordinary riding situations" still require a fair amount of rider input into what needs to happen, to get to where you're going without losing time/blood/body-parts ... or even your life. People seldom see issues that will kill them ... simply because they weren't looking for them.

    The wizardry may not always save your life ... but the odds of it saving you money (and/or blood) is still pretty good.

    Those "ordinary" riding situations may even seem boring at times ... but it's usually better than in a car. Well ... most days anyway.

    There's plenty of electronic wizardry about ... and plenty it can't (and won't/can't) warn you about ... or help you with.



    No doubt ... someone somewhere is working on it though.
    Sweat wipes off. Road-rash doesn't.

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